The Power of Cinema

Steve_in_MD said:
I'm staying out of the debate here, but just wanted to chime in and say how awful that film looks. That green screen work...yeah...
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Thanks for that. :)

I absolutely did NOT intend to start a religious/political debate, but in retrospect I feel stupid for not assuming it would head down that path. I just wanted to point out how F-ing HORRIBLE the movie is. Reportedly, it had $5mil. behind it. Seriously?!

Normally, I like to pay a certain amount of respect to fellow filmmakers, no matter how poor I think their efforts are. Normally, I think it's mean-spirited to make fun of films that you might think are lesser than yours. For this guy, I make an exception. Because he's an asshole. Many of his cast and crew have reported that they were seriously misled about what the final film would be.

Plus, the movie is REALLY bad. I don't think any members of this forum could make something so horrible even if they were trying to.
 
PaulGriffith said:
A) That's why it's a crucial part of our legal system, innocent until proven guilty. Due process exists for a reason.

B) Ray, if half the gross economic output of Texas was appropriated by the Federal government I'm sure we'd start in the court system, yeah. It wouldn't be war off the bat. If it came down to someone forcibly taking your possessions then I don't think it would be too out of line to defend your and your peer's safety and property. Again, defense is almost always acceptable where offense usually crosses the line.

C) The guys that made the film in question, their freedom of speech trumps the rights of people who killed an ambassador and others to not be offended. I hear stuff I disagree with and find offensive almost daily. I'm what most would call religious, even when people insult what I believe I just shrug it off.
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A) Our legal system.
I'm not so sure this is even part of their legal system, but I understand it's certainly not unheard of in their cultural system, albeit an extreme part.
I suspect there was a certain age demographic the bulk of the rioters were prone to being.
But I imagine most practicing Muslims take their religion considerably more serious than most practicing anything else non-Muslim. However, I do recall a rather disgraceful period, or two, in Christian history that would be nice to just ignore.

B) "Start in the court system, yeah. It wouldn't be war off the bat." Exactly! They are well beyond the court system, and I'm not entirely sure that even in their official court system their actions would be considered altogether illegal, unfounded, unjustified, and immoral.
I suspect Lybian and Egyptian authorities have more rather pressing matters on their hands than operating a smoothly operating judicial system, and even then, when in Rome. It's kinda the wild west in that territory. A lot of foolishness isn't going to find much tolerance.

In Benghazi, a large mob stormed the U.S. consulate, with gunmen firing their weapons, said Wanis al-Sharef, an Interior Ministry official in Benghazi. A witness said attackers fired automatic weapons and rocket-propelled grenades at the consulate as they clashed with Libyans hired to guard the facility.

Outnumbered by the crowd, Libyan security forces did little to stop them, al-Sharef said.

The crowd overwhelmed the facility and set fire to it, burning most of it and looting the contents, witnesses said.
One American was shot to death and a second was wounded in the hand, al-Sharef said. He did not give further details.

Hours before the Benghazi attack, hundreds of mainly ultraconservative Islamist protesters in Egypt marched to the U.S. Embassy in downtown Cairo, gathering outside its walls and chanting against the movie and the U.S. Most of the embassy staff had left the compound earlier because of warnings of the upcoming demonstration.​
You know, there's a point when standing your ground is counterproductive.
If most of the embassy staff left, then whomever stayed behind to protect property and principle put themselves in harms way. I don't know if they would have warranted a citation for bravery.

C) The swelling protesters clearly didn't feel this way.
This was an American embassy in a foreign country, and in one that's undergoing a violent transition under multiple factions under no centralized formal control.
If this film, production quality be d@mned, is representational of what America has to offer, then no sh!t actions like this are going to happen.

America represents freedom to act like GD blasphemous fools.
And they want our egregious @sses in their nation for what reason exactly?



Cracker Funk said:
I just wanted to point out how F-ing HORRIBLE the movie is. Reportedly, it had $5mil. behind it. Seriously?!

Plus, the movie is REALLY bad. I don't think any members of this forum could make something so horrible even if they were trying to.
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Wow. $5M. Someone needs to learn about making a budget.

starshiptroopers.jpg

https://www.google.com/search?num=1...e=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw&ei=YmpRUNquAZLE9gSuyIHACg

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444017504577645681057498266.html
"Mr. Bacile said he raised $5 million from about 100 Jewish donors, whom he declined to identify. Working with about 60 actors and 45 crew members, he said he made the two-hour movie in three months last year in California."​

Sh!t. From a production standpoint this fool's impressive.
I wish more IT-ers could raise $5M from about 100 donors, rustle up 100+ cast and crew and shoot a feature in three months.
Effffff meeeee that'd be great!



wheatgrinder said:
I note that rayw did not mention "un important family members!" :P
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;)
 
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And this is one of those times that understanding a bit more of their thought process doesn't make it any more right in my eyes. The fundamental idea of embassies are to make a place for safe political discussion, that's why there are embassies in the US for countries we have a history of not getting along with. Like it was pointed out earlier, it's person B killing person C for what person A said.

And yeah, Ray, that last bit is offensive. I'm not going to throw a tizzy over it though; let alone kill anyone.

Either way, this thread has gotten way to serious, my bad. Thanks to CF and the others for toning it back down haha.
 
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directorik said:
It’s an interesting question, ray.
What I can’t understand is killing person “C” because of what
person “A” did. I know there is a point where I would move to
physical action. Putting aside the clear choice (you see a rape
or child molestation in progress and take up a weapon to stop
it) I might very well pick up a weapon and kill a man who
molested a child. What I wouldn’t do is pick up a weapon and
kill a man because another man molested a child.
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This.

Violent response to a "creative" (in quotes because I'm sure the piece in question is garbage) work - the making of which caused no harm to any involved - against third parties who had nothing to do with it is inexcusible. There is no discussion on that matter. Tenets of Organzied Religion are no excuse. No matter how offensive the work of fiction, murdering people who were in no way involved is indefensible.

Period.

Furthermore; the Muslim world needs to start policing its own. This radical nonsense has to stop. Muslims are the only ones forbidden to depict Mohammad. The rest of us are free to do as we please. The same goes for all people who are practicioners of an Organized Religion. (Religion is not to be confused with Faith.)

Keep your flock in check; knock of the saber rattling, tone down the rhetoric, and realize that you are just going to have to get along with the rest of the world even if you disagree with them. Seriously, the rest of us are sick of your shit.




* -- The "You" in this post is collective, referring to the general masses. Not specific individuals.
 
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I was just returning to this post to point out what Alcove already posted.

Quite a guy this Nakoula Basseley Nakoula.
 
From Alcove's link above:
"American actors and actresses who appeared in "Innocence of Muslims" issued a joint statement Wednesday saying they were misled about the project and alleged that some of their dialogue was crudely dubbed during post-production.
In the English-language version of the trailer, direct references to Muhammad appear to be the result of post-production changes to the movie. Either actors aren't seen when the name "Muhammad" is spoken in the overdubbed sound, or they appear to be mouthing something else as the name of the prophet is spoken."

Too bad the director didn't know about: http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=42912
http://sourcefilmmaker.com/
 
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