Could be Funny at Some Point

So, the two actors who have worked their ass off on the production desperately want it to be complete.

I've already given up on it, and I told every one exactly that. My Invisible Producer is like "Just see it through. Once it's done you'll be happy." I know I won't. I just don't give a shit anymore.

I told the Invisible Producer and the two actors, to go to town and finish shooting.

It took ONE DAY for the Producer to e-mail me that he was quitting. They haven't even set a shooting schedule yet. I told him he couldn't quit till after June or July.
 
Filmmaking is a group effort. As you mentioned, there are people other than yourself who have worked their asses off, and want to see it completed.

Were you acting in everyone's best interest, when you fired the first actress? Are you acting in everyone's best interest now, when you decide to quit because you've personally lost interest?

When I start a movie, it is a commitment. I am committing to the cast/crew, just as much as they are committing to me. I expect everyone to honor their commitments, as I should always honor mine.

There are at least two people I can think of who will never find this to be funny, ever.
 
Filmmaking is a group effort. As you mentioned, there are people other than yourself who have worked their asses off, and want to see it completed.

Were you acting in everyone's best interest, when you fired the first actress? Are you acting in everyone's best interest now, when you decide to quit because you've personally lost interest?

When I start a movie, it is a commitment. I am committing to the cast/crew, just as much as they are committing to me. I expect everyone to honor their commitments, as I should always honor mine.

There are at least two people I can think of who will never find this to be funny, ever.

You know what I love about Cracker. You don't like me, and I have no problem with that. I don't really care. You take everything at face value, remove what you don't like and say "It's George's Fault". I'm obviously doing everything wrong.

Yes I was acting in everyone's best interest when I fired the first actress. She deserved to be fired. The second one unfortunately turned out to be just as bad. No one, not even her fellow actors like her. But, I guess that's my fault.

If you just read the actual post, the PRODUCER after dealing with these "COMMITTED" members for ONE DAY was ready to quit. Is that MY FAULT? Did you bother actually reading the whole post?

I was committed to this for the past year. I showed up, the actresses didn't. I didn't lose their costumes, forget call times, and just not give a shit. I'm not the DP who falls asleep while the tape rolls, who can't be bothered to set a light. If this is your idea of committed cast and crew, then perhaps you need to figure out what teamwork is all about. I literally ask NOTHING from anyone, except to do their job. I wear so many hats it makes everyone's head spin. It doesn't bother me, because if I do it, I know it'll be done right.

Oh, and perhaps I should just continue tossing my money out the window. It's MY money. Because my committed actress had to leave by 5pm, even though she knew we were suppose to finish that day. I had to spend another $300 to bring everyone back another day.

Nick: I'm a DAMN GOOD director. The two leads from Us Sinners are both in this. Even the actors and crew that don't like me, respect me on set. While they question just about anything I ask, they eventually go "Oh, yeah, that's right." They LOVE the rough cuts. Because they see how great they come off. We aim for excellent acting. Because that's the one thing you can control on a micro-budget movie set. One of the crew from the original production called and asked if he could use the footage for his reel, because as he put it "It's the best, most professional set he'd ever been on". He worked with my DP on just about everything he'd ever done.

The 2 actors that desperately want to see this completed, are already set to star in my next movie in 2013.

I don't post about this because I want sympathy. I literally find this pathetic and amusing. I think some will find it an interesting read.
 
I'm seeing it your way George.

Dealing with people in general can be bullshit.

Their lazy at everything. Apparently from fast food to even movies.

If your wasting money For asses, I don't see the point either.
 
Hey when your the boss, everything is your fault! Cutting our losses is not an "inherently" bad strategy, but it does have a cost. We have to accept that and weigh the cost against any potential gain from pushing ahead.

Is it worth "finishing" a steaming pile of poo simply to give you cast and crew a "tangible" result of their effort?
 
If the script is good, arguably the key element, is there enough quality footage to make a "proof of concept" trailer for a new fundraising effort for a complete re-shoot? New cast & crew?

Also, I see Iselin is in New Jersey (which I believe I recall you stating before.)
If so, NJ hasn't got squat for any film incentive tax credits or rebates.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsBznn8D13zOdHVZN2NOQnV4em5nbTZZU2M3eXg2RGc#gid=0

May I suggest you consider filming in nextdoor Pennsylvania?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsBznn8D13zOdHVZN2NOQnV4em5nbTZZU2M3eXg2RGc#gid=1

state_map2.jpg


http://filminpa.com/incentives/
"Pennsylvania offers a 25% Tax Credit to films that spend at least 60% of their total production budget in the Commonwealth."

http://filminpa.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/Film-Tax-Credit_Guidelines-09.pdf

To the best of my ability, I see no state minimums or preference for in-state vs. out-of-state production companies.

If correct, it looks like you could get back up to 25% of your production budget no matter what the budget is, (or likely 25% of the 60% or more spent in PA for qualified expenses.)
Of course, the state film office would need to approve your application beforehand, so... Yeah. That.


Make a few phone calls.
See if that's correct.
Use the PA cast & crew resources site to locate a quality crew over on your end of the state.
http://www.film.org/Philadelphia/Public/Home.aspx
Investigate any local grant possibilities.
Throw together a KickStarter or IndieGoGo account.
Make some jingle.
Start over again.
Whole new show.
Except for the two other non-@ssclowns, of course. :)


FWIW, I'm sorry this project went tits-up on you.


GL.
 
Last edited:
You know what I love about Cracker. You don't like me, and I have no problem with that. I don't really care. You take everything at face value, remove what you don't like and say "It's George's Fault". I'm obviously doing everything wrong.

Yes I was acting in everyone's best interest when I fired the first actress. She deserved to be fired. The second one unfortunately turned out to be just as bad. No one, not even her fellow actors like her. But, I guess that's my fault.

If you just read the actual post, the PRODUCER after dealing with these "COMMITTED" members for ONE DAY was ready to quit. Is that MY FAULT? Did you bother actually reading the whole post?

I was committed to this for the past year. I showed up, the actresses didn't. I didn't lose their costumes, forget call times, and just not give a shit. I'm not the DP who falls asleep while the tape rolls, who can't be bothered to set a light. If this is your idea of committed cast and crew, then perhaps you need to figure out what teamwork is all about. I literally ask NOTHING from anyone, except to do their job. I wear so many hats it makes everyone's head spin. It doesn't bother me, because if I do it, I know it'll be done right.

Oh, and perhaps I should just continue tossing my money out the window. It's MY money. Because my committed actress had to leave by 5pm, even though she knew we were suppose to finish that day. I had to spend another $300 to bring everyone back another day.

Nick: I'm a DAMN GOOD director. The two leads from Us Sinners are both in this. Even the actors and crew that don't like me, respect me on set. While they question just about anything I ask, they eventually go "Oh, yeah, that's right." They LOVE the rough cuts. Because they see how great they come off. We aim for excellent acting. Because that's the one thing you can control on a micro-budget movie set. One of the crew from the original production called and asked if he could use the footage for his reel, because as he put it "It's the best, most professional set he'd ever been on". He worked with my DP on just about everything he'd ever done.

The 2 actors that desperately want to see this completed, are already set to star in my next movie in 2013.

I don't post about this because I want sympathy. I literally find this pathetic and amusing. I think some will find it an interesting read.

I think you completely missed my point. I never said anything about whose "fault" the breakdown may be. I only mentioned the issue of commitment. If you are truly committed to the project, you will see it through to the end, no matter the frustrations. Do you think your production is the only one that has any road-bumps?

In the OP, you stated quite clearly that you have lost interest, but that there are two other people who have not lost interest! Do you think you are vindicated by the fact that your "producer" gave it a whirl and decided to quit? Your producer isn't you!!! YOU are the filmmaker. YOU are the person that everyone has looked to from the get-go; you can't just pawn it off on someone else and blame the actors when that person isn't able to do the job that YOU committed to at the beginning of this production.

BTW, you cannot change the fact that you stated, publicly, that your main reason for re-casting the lead role was plain-and-simple spite.
 
When I start a movie, it is a commitment. I am committing to the cast/crew, just as much as they are committing to me. I expect everyone to honor their commitments, as I should always honor mine.

You know what's funny? I feel guilt over the fact that i never finished that thread on sandwiches even though i put a disclaimer in the OP that im busy and it may take time. Even though several infinitely more important things keep me too busy, i still remind myself to finish that thread because i said i would.

Now that my therapy session is over, everyone please continue this thread as you were. I don't mean to derail.
 
You know what I love about Cracker. You don't like me, and I have no problem with that. I don't really care. You take everything at face value, remove what you don't like and say "It's George's Fault". I'm obviously doing everything wrong.

Yes I was acting in everyone's best interest when I fired the first actress. She deserved to be fired. The second one unfortunately turned out to be just as bad. No one, not even her fellow actors like her. But, I guess that's my fault.

If you just read the actual post, the PRODUCER after dealing with these "COMMITTED" members for ONE DAY was ready to quit. Is that MY FAULT? Did you bother actually reading the whole post?

I was committed to this for the past year. I showed up, the actresses didn't. I didn't lose their costumes, forget call times, and just not give a shit. I'm not the DP who falls asleep while the tape rolls, who can't be bothered to set a light. If this is your idea of committed cast and crew, then perhaps you need to figure out what teamwork is all about. I literally ask NOTHING from anyone, except to do their job. I wear so many hats it makes everyone's head spin. It doesn't bother me, because if I do it, I know it'll be done right.

Oh, and perhaps I should just continue tossing my money out the window. It's MY money. Because my committed actress had to leave by 5pm, even though she knew we were suppose to finish that day. I had to spend another $300 to bring everyone back another day.

Nick: I'm a DAMN GOOD director. The two leads from Us Sinners are both in this. Even the actors and crew that don't like me, respect me on set. While they question just about anything I ask, they eventually go "Oh, yeah, that's right." They LOVE the rough cuts. Because they see how great they come off. We aim for excellent acting. Because that's the one thing you can control on a micro-budget movie set. One of the crew from the original production called and asked if he could use the footage for his reel, because as he put it "It's the best, most professional set he'd ever been on". He worked with my DP on just about everything he'd ever done.

The 2 actors that desperately want to see this completed, are already set to star in my next movie in 2013.

I don't post about this because I want sympathy. I literally find this pathetic and amusing. I think some will find it an interesting read.

Well, how about assembling a dedicated team? I am sure there are many people who would like to work on a film set with you!
 
"Hey when your the boss, everything is your fault! Cutting our losses is not an "inherently" bad strategy, but it does have a cost. We have to accept that and weigh the cost against any potential gain from pushing ahead." -

I could take the footage I have, make a nonsensical movie and get distribution. I have enough footage for distribution, I don't have enough to make the script I wrote or a good movie. Because key scenes were never shot.

I've mentioned this once or twice before. I don't do this for money, or the hopes that it will one day be my job. I do it to have fun. I record music because it's fun. Would I like to make money at it? Of course. But, I don't work a project because I expect to make anything. I do it to be artistic and have fun. 5% fun regarding this since Feb 11. It's not cutting loses, it's contempt and disgust.

rayw: I don't save a receipt or think about the cost up front. I have a number in mind, and figure 2 - 3 times that. I spent about $10,000 (most on equipment) on Us Sinners, and someone said "Claim it all on your taxes" and I couldn't be bothered. If it was ever "real" money I'll start thinking like that. I look at it, the same way I approached music - FUN. I don't mind spending money when I'm enjoying myself. See 5% above for my enjoyment factor on this shit. BTW: I still fill out the E-Z form for both state and federal. I pay the mortgage but the house is in my wife/girlfriend's name. She does the long forms. Yes, she can kick me out anytime she wants. But, after 27 years what's the chance.

"Do you think your production is the only one that has any road-bumps?" Road Bumps? Really? Again, you need to read and comprehend.

"Given Up, don't give a shit. I know, I won't" and "Lost Interest" are completely different phrases with completely different meanings. You say it like "I'm bored and don't want to do this anymore" or "I can't be bothered", which is just something written by someone who doesn't choose to read or understand.

I didn't pawn it off. I asked the actors, they said YES. I didn't ask the Producer, he OFFERED to take charge. The actors can't possible handle everything. Then when he stepped in, he wanted out. So, yeah, I do feel completely vindicated. It took him hours to find out what I put up with since August. I say August because that's when I hired the new actress. This is a guy who has produced 4 indie movies, and 3 theatrical productions, along with all his other projects.

Committed is a two way street. You can commit to people who say their committed and then don't show up. But, I guess that's the way YOU commit. Because YOU condone it. YOU agree with it. Don't you? Isn't that what YOU'RE saying? That's I've bowed out. I'm running away while the people who only show up when they want to are still COMMITTED.

"BTW, you cannot change the fact that you stated, publicly, that your main reason for re-casting the lead role was plain-and-simple spite." This STUPIDITY just goes to prove the fact that you pick and choose what you read. SPITE? Really? Leaving for 3 months, changing the color of her skin. Bitching and moaning at every turn. Calling the Producer in the middle of the night crying and EVERYTHING else is not the reason why she was fired? Do you know what the term LAST STRAW means? Do you remember what the words or the meaning behind the words she said? Spite. Absolute sheer stupidity. But, I'm not surprised. I fully expect it from your responses to my posts.

Here's a good one that I'm sure you'll defend. Because I'm saying it, and you can't agree with me. So, please do defend. It'll be great. It won't fall into the realm of common sense. But it'll be entertaining.

We needed a gun for the shoot. The trigger is never pulled. When the barrel is touching the actress' skin, the finger is not in any way on the trigger. But, if it went off accidently (hammer pulled back by ghosts and released) the actress would surely die, or be seriously wounded. I was concerned about this.

My DP is an ex-cop and I asked if we could borrow his gun. He said yes. When we get up to the scene where we need the gun I said "Time for the gun. Please let me see that the gun is empty". I know very little about pistols. I watch as he removes the bullet from the chamber. He then removes the clip. I watch as all the bullets are removed from the clip. I can see the black plastic or metal where the bullets sit. I asked to see the empty chamber again. I ask if he'd put the clip back in so if we catch the bottom of the gun there won't be a gaping hole where the clip should be. He puts it back. He then removes the pin and barrel. He hands me a gun with no barrel. There's a huge hole in the top of the gun. I know nothing about guns. But, even I know there shouldn't be a hole there.

So, I tell him, we need A gun. Not half a gun. You have to put that back. So, he does. He puts the gun back together. Then he says "I'm really uncomfortable with this. If you use this, I'm packing up and leaving right now". It's his gun, his cameras. What the fuck? And why the fuck did he put it back together? Because it wasn't quick.

So, I ask a really simple question which only has one answer "How can someone be shot when there's no bullets in a gun?"

His non-answer was "You're only safe if there's no barrel or pin it in". Which is bullshit. An unloaded gun can not shoot you. At least not with a bullet.

I asked the same question at least 5 times. Not one of these mother fuckers could or would answer it.

When he threatened to leave, the words "Get the fuck out" were about to come out, when the actor stepped in and said "Why don't we just try it without the barrel? He's the gun expert. Let's bow to his expertise." Really?

I finished with common sense. "If you weren't going to give me a gun. Why did you agree to? I'd have gotten one from somewhere else."

It's that simple COMMON FUCKING SENSE.

Of course the actress started bitching how uncomfortable she was at this point. Because GOD KNOWS that an UNLOADED GUN that DOESN'T have bullets can accidently go off and shoot you. Only with this group can something like that happen. Because this is LA LA land. Nothing close to reality.

For anyone who thinks it's just a prop, it doesn't matter. YES it does. It does if quality means anything. There's so much that can't be controlled shooting micro-budget that stupid shit like this shouldn't be one of them. If you COMMIT to lending a gun, lend a gun.
 
I've mentioned this once or twice before. I don't do this for money, or the hopes that it will one day be my job. I do it to have fun. I record music because it's fun. Would I like to make money at it? Of course. But, I don't work a project because I expect to make anything. I do it to be artistic and have fun. 5% fun regarding this since Feb 11. It's not cutting loses, it's contempt and disgust.
What do you think others are doing it for? To piss in your face? I don't think so. If your crew are incompetent, fire them and hire competent people. Or do it yourself. What do you think those who are still keen are doing it for? For you to say 'nah I'm not having fun anymore, let's just kill the project'? Filmmaking is hard work for everybody, especially the Director. Sometimes it's not fun. Sometimes you're on set of a low-budget film in the pouring rain and freezing cold. The actors get the shelter and the blankets. Sometimes you're doing that with a steadicam or easyrig. It's certainly not fun when you come home at the end of the day and your back is sore for the next 3. Does that mean you throw in the towel and go 'screw it, you guys can finish it, it's not fun for me'? Directors succeed because they have the passion for it and no matter what goes wrong, they'll still be there plugging away.

Road Bumps? Really? Again, you need to read and comprehend.
I think I've personally read some of, or all of your previous threads. It's a low/no budget production. At the end of the day, it all comes back to you. If you aren't instilling in people the kind of work ethic you expect, then you either need to do that, or hire new people who can take your direction. All productions have road bumps, hassles, issues. I know of Directors who despise their own work. But they finished it because the cast and crew deserved it.

You say it like "I'm bored and don't want to do this anymore" or "I can't be bothered", which is just something written by someone who doesn't choose to read or understand.
All you've said so far is essentially 'it's no longer fun' in this thread anyway. As I say, making a film is hard work. If you want to be the guy who throws the towel in at the end of it all, then be that guy. But just know that you won't be known as or remembered as the guy who put his heart and soul into it and despite all his best efforts the production crumbled and he decided to fold it. You'll be known as the guy who quit at the end, no matter how you tell the story.

Then when he stepped in, he wanted out.
So? You hire a cast and crew who don't respect you, then you lower their respect for the production even more by throwing in the towel because you can't do it anymore and hand it over to the 'invisible Producer'. That's a sure-fire way to win tthem over.....

I'm running away while the people who only show up when they want to are still COMMITTED.
I don't know how you run your ship. I'm a DP but I know that if my AC was completely unreliable, average at his job, only turned up every now and then, and still expected to get paid, I'd find a new one. I'm not sure if you're giving these people a chance or what, but if someone disrespects you or isn't committed to the project then they should be fired. Having a DP not turn up half the time or not pay attention is not something you should just 'put up with' for a year. At the end of the day, like it or not, you're the one calling the shots and you're the one who hired them. So fire them if they're not doing their job. Don't let them continue to do it and then complain and quit.

Leaving for 3 months, changing the color of her skin...
Where do you find these people..?:hmm:

if it went off accidently (hammer pulled back by ghosts and released) the actress would surely die, or be seriously wounded. I was concerned about this.
I know nothing about guns.
An unloaded gun can not shoot you. At least not with a bullet.
If you know nothing about guns how can you know this..? He's an ex-cop, I think he knows more than you. There's no way I would let a real gun on set that was just loaded without an armourer and safety officer present. There's a reason they hire out imitation weapons for film sets. If the gun didn't need to go off, why didn't you just get an imitation? If I was DP and someone walked onto set with a real gun, unloaded it and wanted to shoot with it and pull the trigger in the scene I would say we're not shooting this scene until we get an imitation weapon. And if the Director or Producer said we're shooting with it, I would say you can find yourself a new DP. No film is worth risking lives. Assumption is the mother of all f*ckups so when you, who has no knowledge about a gun assumes that it will be fine even after advice from an expert saying you can't do this... What happens if she dies? Guess who's liable - not the guy who lent you the firearm and said we can't shoot with the gun like this. It will be you, the guy who threw caution to the wind and said 'ah what could go wrong'.

The actor stepped in and said "Why don't we just try it without the barrel? He's the gun expert. Let's bow to his expertise." Really?
I finished with common sense. "If you weren't going to give me a gun. Why did you agree to? I'd have gotten one from somewhere else."
It's that simple COMMON FUCKING SENSE.
The simple common sense of 'let's not shoot an actress with a real gun because even if it's unloaded she could die or be seriously injured'? You'd rather risk her life..? Honestly I'd have cut the shot or rescheduled and found an imitation weapon. I know absolutely nothing about guns either. But if someone with gun expertise gave me one and said 'it's not safe unless we dismantle it', I wouldn't be like 'what the f*ck is wrong with you it needs to look real, put it back together and just use it'.

For anyone who thinks it's just a prop, it doesn't matter. YES it does. It does if quality means anything. There's so much that can't be controlled shooting micro-budget that stupid shit like this shouldn't be one of them. If you COMMIT to lending a gun, lend a gun.
He lent you a gun. You didn't take safety precautions and are now blaming him because he knows that a real gun is unsafe.

In an indie micro-budget, the Director often needs to wear a lot of hats. To me it sounds like you've either hired a crew with experience and your inexperience has made them weary (as shown through things like the gun situation) or you've hired a crew with inexperience and gotten angry at them because they're inexperienced. Either way, if you're unhappy with your crew - fire them. Don't complain and try and tell an ex-cop that common sense dictates that you should put a live firearm to an actor's face..

I don't know you at all, I'm simply lending my professional opinion. Hey, it's a public forum, you pretty much asked for it. This is nothing against you personally, but maybe you need to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. Look at the other's perspectives and look at yourself as a filmmaker. To me it seems you've been a bit of a douche and essentially said you don't care if you significantly injure an actor because 'we need to make it believable'. You eventually throw a tantrum, throw in the towel and wonder why the crew have no respect for you. Hey, it's cool we all make mistakes and we can all be douchey from time to time. But, blaming people for things doesn't fix anything. You're calling the shots so it's your head and your ass on the line. If those people weren't pulling their weight, you fix it. You don't just complain.
 
Last edited:
Jax: No offense, but this is one thread on a very long story. But, I enjoyed your stupid response to the gun incident.

I may know nothing about guns, but I DO KNOW - AN UNLOADED GUN CAN NOT SHOOT YOU WITH A BULLET. No STUPID ASS MORONIC EXCUSES.

Did you not read that he WOULD NOT answer the question 5 times? You know WHY? Guess? AN UNLOADED GUN CAN NOT SHOOT YOU WITH A BULLET.

Oh and just one other thing, because I'm not a MORON. If he'd have put the barrel and pin back in the gun and handed it to me, I'd have pointed it at myself and pulled the trigger to show that a gun WITHOUT BULLETS CAN NOT SHOOT YOU WITH A BULLET.

For some stupid reason, a gun I know is not loaded will not scare me.
 
Crazy shit happens.

And that was with all of the proper experts on set. You don't mess around with guns, man. It could be that your DP was worried that one take with the perfectly-safe unloaded gun might lead to more takes and then more takes, at different times, and who knows -- maybe somewhere down the line, the gun becomes loaded, by accident or not, and then you do another take and something goes wrong...

It might not have been that one particular instance he was worried about. It's possible that maybe he just wanted to set the precedent that you don't use real guns on set, without all of the proper staff to run all of the proper checks and balances (which you didn't have). He may have been acting on principle, but didn't think it was worth the effort to argue with you.
 
Back
Top