To the filmmakers, who HATE piracy...

[ntpiracy.com]

Ntpiracy.com is introducing “HATE PIRACY” badge to promote an anti-piracy message to the world. Only we, the people on earth, can make a piracy free world. No one can do it alone. That is why we will have to do it together. So we come up with an idea of making this “HATE PIRACY” badge and to carry it together to the world.

These days we see various badges of social networking services on various web pages. This is a win-win idea for both social networking service and the host website to promote themselves online. Our idea is not promoting us, we even did not put our web address (URL) here on this badge. Our idea is just to promote this “HATE PIRACY” message. We believe the words, “HATE PIRACY” speak everything about piracy.

Now the question is who can use it? The answer is everyone. From an individual to an organization whoever wants can use it for free. You can use it in your profile picture of messenger, social networking services, on your online photo album or on your web page. We request you to use it, if you see a dream about piracy free world.

So ask yourself - will you use it?

Please visit: http://ntpiracy.com/anti-piracy-idea/hate-piracy-badge-by-ntpiracy.htm for more details.

 

[TheBuck]

Sorry but I think piracy helps the entertainment world in the long run. I will not be using this badge.

 

[ntpiracy.com]

@TheBuck:

It seems you'd love to sacrifice your originals works....

 

[TheBuck]

You can't lose your works with piracy since they are already made sure you can say that you're losing cash with piracy but you could also be picking up more fans in the long run that it doesn't even matter. It's a great way to for your work to get into the hands of so many that may be uncertain of you and and very well could lead to a huge upswing in fans. Yes I know the opposite could happen but since I'm for piracy as a whole I'm looking at the bright side of things.

Also if you're like me and you put your work out on BT sites is it still piracy? Not from my point of view but from yours it very well maybe.

 

[Will Vincent]

if you're like me and you put your work out on BT sites is it still piracy?

Not, that's a method of distribution. A LOT of people make us of bit torrent to distribute content and whatnot. It's just a file transfer method, its use does not automatically equal piracy.

 

[TJones05]

Sorry but I think piracy helps the entertainment world in the long run

I'm split on the piracy issue. It has its pros and cons, but overall I agree with this. I d/l stuff every once in awhile, but if I like it I'll go see it again in theaters or buy it when it comes out on DVD. Even better for the filmmaker, I'll be interested in checking out their next project.

I agree piracy does take away some money from the filmmakers, but I think the actual amount they lose is exaggerated. Yeah, there are those people that only use torrents and never go to the theater or buy DVD's, but at the same time, you can't really consider that to be lost profit because those people were never going to pay to see it anyway.

 

[sonnyboo]

Sorry but I think piracy helps the entertainment world in the long run. I will not be using this badge.

As someone who has had a copyrighted feature film put on Torrent sites, I can say with no doubts we have lost money from that. Several foreign territories will not purchase the movie for DVD distribution because it is already available on torrent sites. We tangibly and irrevocably lost cash money from that.

I don't need fans that do not pay for my work. I guarantee that every filmmaker who claims that they think piracy is a good thing has never had a substantial amount of money invested in their work that gets distributed illegally and you don't make a penny from it. Let's see where you are with a few hundred thousand dollars of your friends and family's money invested in a project and see how you feel when that gets given away for free. You can tell all the people who lost their money, "But hey, we got fans for free on the Internet that will want to see my next project!" and see how well that goes over.

As an independent filmmaker, not making millions of dollars and every penny counts, can you tell me how this helped my career and the entertainment world?

 

[ntpiracy.com]

It's not only for movie...but also for games, software, music.. A BIG loss. That's why our Ntpiracy.com is trying to create awareness to help people to help industries. No one can do it alone. We need support from the people who HATE piracy.

Together we can do it. But it will take time and labor to invest.

 

[TJones05]

As an independent filmmaker, not making millions of dollars and every penny counts, can you tell me how this helped my career and the entertainment world?

I said earlier that there are pros and cons- it's not a black and white issue. There are films that are hurt by piracy, those that helped, and those that aren't affected at all. I will say that I don't think any filmmaker should have to deal with not being able distribute their film because of piracy. That's never alright. I think it's unfortunate that it happened to you and I don't disagree that that form of piracy is a problem that needs to be fixed.

At the same time, for me at least, there have been times when a downloaded a film introduced me to a filmmaker or actor whose work I would have never had the opportunity to see otherwise. Maybe I'm in the minority, but like I said in my earlier post, I feel that I owe it to the filmmaker to see their film in theaters (if I can) or buy the DVD. And then, on top of that, I pay to see their future projects.

There's a difference between the people that d/l a movie because it's not playing at their theater and those that d/l it with the intention to profit off of another person's work. I'm not saying either one is right, but there is a difference. I think as the industry begins to better adapt to the internet and also fighting piracy, things will begin to even out. For me, getting Netflix has pretty much eliminated my need to download movies so I think things like that will play a part in the solution.

 

[sonnyboo]

I said earlier that there are pros and cons- it's not a black and white issue.

There are no pro's for me. The version of the film that is on the torrent sites is an early rough cut with temp sound and temp FX. So without any kind of context, this is how people are introduced to my film and my work.

I cannot re-iterate enough that this attitude comes from people who have not invested significant amounts of money into a project, nor were responsible for raising the money from investors that wanted to see a return on said investment. Your attitude towards piracy is as a consumer that is saving money, not the artist and business person who is losing revenue.

When you have promised people you will do everything in your power to try to get their money back, and your movie is free on a torrent site, I wonder if you will feel the same way...

 

[M1chae1]

Piracy has gotten so bad (our last distributed feature, NUN OF THAT, is being pirated like crazy), that our director has decided to only screen our next feature ATOMIC BRAIN INVASION, for the first two years of release before putting it on DVD.

Whether he is going to follow through with that promise...I do not know, but I'm behind him 100%.

 

[Tinalera]

I knew someone who was into sound, who was a bit of a hypocrite(and he admitted as such): He Abhorred music piracy and ranted to those who did it, but had no problem with downloading movies-go figure.

I'm torn on it myself. I can see both sides. Those who want their work to get noticed and are just trying to get exposure, I can see why piracy isn't as big a deal. But for those who are trying to get money back on their investment, I can see why it's dislilked.

BTW, SonnyBoo-this goes back to the BlockBuster Thread-what's your opinion of BB signing the deal with the studios to get "first dibs" on distribution of films-would this do anything for piracy?

Also, didn't I hear a while ago something about studios contemplating putting out "no frills" versions of their films for free on the net, with the idea that you like what you see, go to the theatre to see the "full effect" as it were?

 

[TakedownsandFalls]

As someone who has had a copyrighted feature film put on Torrent sites, I can say with no doubts we have lost money from that. Several foreign territories will not purchase the movie for DVD distribution because it is already available on torrent sites. We tangibly and irrevocably lost cash money from that.

I don't need fans that do not pay for my work. I guarantee that every filmmaker who claims that they think piracy is a good thing has never had a substantial amount of money invested in their work that gets distributed illegally and you don't make a penny from it. Let's see where you are with a few hundred thousand dollars of your friends and family's money invested in a project and see how you feel when that gets given away for free. You can tell all the people who lost their money, "But hey, we got fans for free on the Internet that will want to see my next project!" and see how well that goes over.

As an independent filmmaker, not making millions of dollars and every penny counts, can you tell me how this helped my career and the entertainment world?

Totally agree with you sonnyboo. As a producer of a independent documentary "Takedowns and Falls" I see no benefit whatsoever in piracy of our film. We are pro-active to do our best to keep the film off torrents. We have ROI and payments to make, if you support piracy you really are not a filmmaker. And the argument of helping your career or future films is naive, who is going to fund your next film if your current film does not make money?

 

[sonnyboo]

BTW, SonnyBoo-this goes back to the BlockBuster Thread-what's your opinion of BB signing the deal with the studios to get "first dibs" on distribution of films-would this do anything for piracy?

Blockbuster is paying, and paying extra for that right. Whoever gets this makes more money for their film, so I'm for it.

Also, didn't I hear a while ago something about studios contemplating putting out "no frills" versions of their films for free on the net, with the idea that you like what you see, go to the theatre to see the "full effect" as it were?

Most people only want the film and don't care about extras. We're filmmakers, so we're very biased. I don't think this plan would work if it ever came to light.

 

[aceofspades70]

"Yeah, there are those people that only use torrents and never go to the theater or buy DVD's, but at the same time, you can't really consider that to be lost profit because those people were never going to pay to see it anyway."

Exactly.

 

[TheBuck]

I have not seen any of Snonnys or M1chae1 films but is it possible that they (just guessing here the few disto companies that it was sent to) just did not like the film and that's why they did not pick it up? I find it very hard to believe that a distro would not pick up a movie if they felt they could make a profit off of it regardless if it's out on the web for free DL.

I know that many of you think that once a digital pirate has downloaded the movie that they will not go and buy it. To that I say wrong. If you think about the sheer number of households with broadband connection which is around 60% and the number of residents in the U.S are about 300,000,000 so that would be for 150,000,000 and if even if only 10% of them bought the pirated item in question that would 15,000,000. And unless any of us here big big time Hollywood players that's more than anyone of our films will ever sell.

I think people should really stop blaming piracy and start blaming their crappy projects. Now I'm not saying Sonny or M1chae1 have done crappy projects because I have not seen their work.

I think it was Tool who a few years back released a free album and still made money because people like their stuff and even though they got it for free still gave money to them because it was good. Film makers of all sorts need to realize that just because they made something does not mean it's good and should make money. Hell if it was any other type of job if you do poorly enough you get canned.

 

[aceofspades70]

Well, someone did say once to make better films.

Well, note taken.

 

[Zensteve]

I can see both sides. Those who want their work to get noticed and are just trying to get exposure, I can see why piracy isn't as big a deal.

If the rights-holders are content with giving their own work(s) away... it ain't piracy.

 

[sonnyboo]

People who download a movie without paying should not get to see the movie. They are getting a product for free and illegally. It is revenue lost. If the film was well made, how does any of that change? It doesn't matter if the film is good or bad if it gets pirated.

I would like to hear from someone who has invested or raised money who thinks pirating of their movie is okay, then I want to find out if their investors or distributors agree with this position and would ever want to work with them again...

I just don't see any logic in the business plan to think that piracy is not affecting their bottom line. It is the "business" half of "movie business". A distributor is losing money when people can get their product for free. I don't see how that is "regardless of being available online". That's as ludicrous as saying "I don't see why a car salesman wouldn't still be able to sell cars even if anyone can take a taxi for free"; sure there are some people who will still buy but not nearly as many, and if it's not as profitable, the car distributors won't want to buy as many cars to sell.

Metaphor aside, it doesn't matter if the movie is good or not. It's a product and piracy makes it less valuable.

 

[Buddy Greenfield]

I’ve mentioned this before, and I will again.

I think there is a niche for Indie film to innovate a new approach to making money and films by raising funds (For advertising IN the films) upfront.

The more it’s pirated (Or viewed or down loaded), the more advertising circulation value it has.

This won’t fit every filmmaker or their objectives, but If you can’t stop people from getting films free, then why not get paid for them to get films for free?

If you can raise 5k in advertising, then you make a 5k film. You won’t get rich, (But were you getting rich anyways?) but maybe you won’t go broke either. If you raise a 100k and hope to make a profit, but get screwed by piracy, then how much better off are you?

How this advertising might be integrated creatively in a film I don’t know, but it could be part of a new reason why some people might watch a film in the 1st place.

With the influence of social networking and it’s built in advertising possibilities, this is just waiting to happen.

We watch coming attractions at the theaters, and it’s just advertising, product placement has been around forever, and it’s just advertising, radio used to have like The Westing House Orchestra, and it was just advertising. We see products and companies with their own message boards, we see “Create a short film/commercial for our product and win some nonsense..” ,we see people go viral and make a career out of it.

All of this is a perfect storm for Indie film to meet inexpensive advertising and free distribution, but someone has to go for it and crack making more money on a film in advertising (by giving it away) than they lose on it to piracy trying to sell it.

Sometims you have to mug the mugger.

-Thanks-