Protecting Your Idea/Story

Beatlesfan1225

Beatlesfan1225

Hello Everyone,

So I am extremely naive to this side of filmmaking, so I hope that through this thread, I can learn a good deal. I'm currently working on a production that I am remarkably proud of: it's a very long and complicated story that I've considered writing into a book, but as of late, I've been working on the screenplay.

I am extremely cautious as to who I am talking to about the project, because I do honestly believe that it's a very unique concept that I badly would not want someone to take from me. However, this is becoming increasingly more difficult as I start to collaborate with other individuals (some of which from this forum!) on the project.

Currently, I've been keeping the screenplay tightly under wraps, so I am trying to figure out the implications to sharing the story with collaborators. I have a fifteen page document that acts as a synopsis of sorts, and describes much of the back story and plot of the tale. Obviously, at fifteen pages, it certainly embraces a style of brevity, but there is no question that if someone was to obtain the document, they'd have the overall understanding of the story and concept.

I need to be able to share this document with my collaborators, so we can begin numerous tasks regarding the pre-production of this project, but I wanted to inquire here first as to whether or not anyone has suggestions on how I should go about protecting the idea/story before it circulates my group of collaborators.

Thank you so much for any help you can give me!
 
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directorik said:
Here in the States registering the copyright is $35. Save $5 each week
and one would have enough in 6 weeks. Is money the issue? Why jump
through all those hoops of Matt's method when you can simply register
the copyright officially for $35? Why such resistance to registering the
copyright officially? Why try a method that has been proven to NOT work
in the US when it's $35 to register the copyright?

Okay, so let us say – for the sake of argument – that the NZ method will
hold up in the US courts. It does not address the actual issue:

Someone stealing Brett's idea, writing a screenplay, getting the financing
and making the movie before he does. Then having the money to go after
that person in court.

Brett; the bottom line is you cannot so completely protect your story, your
concept, your idea, than no one would dare write their own script, finance
the project and make the movie before you do. Maybe you can have a
dated document that proves you came up with it first but then what? Your
story, concept and idea is already out in the public - it's already a finished
movie taken from you. Do you want money if that happens? What if the
film doesn't make much money? Then what do you want?

I agree with zen; go for it. Use the poorman's copyright. I can't figure out
how that method will stop someone from taking this very unique concept
from you.

Last thing to think about; is your concept really so good (I'm not asking if
it's unique) that someone will take it from you, write their own script, finance
the project and make the movie before you do? Is this a legit fear?
Click to expand...


Thanks for this post, it's certainly helpful. If you look at the thread, though, I don't think anyone is opposed to getting an actual copyright, I certainly wasn't in the OP. I wasn't sure of what to get at all, and the first idea presented was the poor man's copyright.

As for getting an actual copyright, WHAT exactly is that protecting? Is it protecting a script, a synopsis, idea? I'm a bit confused by this.

To answer the last question you posed me, I do have a legitimate fear of the idea/story being taken, yes. Do I think that someone is going to turn around and finance a film and make it before I do? No, realistically, the chances of that are minimal. I am worried about it showing up as a short story or a book, perhaps on a website or literary publication, yes, that is an actual worry I do have. Thus, I want to protect the story, if that is at all possible, as much as I can, at least.
 
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So, after reading through the thread, it seems like we've reached quite a crossroads. The Poor Man's Copyright is full of legal gray area, and likely wouldn't hold up in court. The $35 US copyright is inexpensive to file, but could be drastically expensive to defend if you ever need to contend the idea, which is highly unlikely anyway.

So, is the verdict essentially, people who have great ideas (Or believe they do, anyway) need to hold them close to their chest, get them accomplished with as little collaboration as possible to avoid compromising said ideas, and then release the product? And obviously this would only really apply to low/no budget writers and filmmakers who couldn't afford to defend their idea in court.

Again, though, I want it to be known that I'm thinking outside of the scope of film - I do think it's fairly easy for someone to snatch up a great story and send it off to literary mags and whatnot. At least, easier than it would be for that person to finance and create a film of the idea. One way or another though, that person is still benefitting from your original idea.
 
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Now I think of it, someone else did have a similar conundrum...the answer came down to basically one thing from what I gathered...work only with people you trust. If you don't trust them with your work, don't work with them.
 
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Beatlesfan1225 said:
Thanks for this post, it's certainly helpful. If you look at the thread, though, I don't think anyone is opposed to getting an actual copyright, I certainly wasn't in the OP. I wasn't sure of what to get at all, and the first idea presented was the poor man's copyright.

As for getting an actual copyright, WHAT exactly is that protecting? Is it protecting a script, a synopsis, idea? I'm a bit confused by this.
Click to expand...
Copyright protects the words on the script. It protects lines of dialogue to an extent. Obviously, you can't copyright two people saying hello to each other, but you get the idea.

Copyright does protect the idea and characters to an extent. If you create a universe for your film that the script requires, that is also protected by copyright. An example is that nobody can legally write their own star trek episodes without it being encumbered. Fan fiction still exists, but it is encumbered, and if any of those fans pushed too hard, they're get a c&d and potentially sued. Derivative works like that are not the same as parody, which is allowed.

Standard IANAL disclaimers apply.
 
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Beatlesfan1225 said:
Thanks for this post, it's certainly helpful. If you look at the thread, though, I don't think anyone is opposed to getting an actual copyright, I certainly wasn't in the OP.
Click to expand...
I did look at the thread. In fact, I commented several times on the thread.
Sometimes a thread takes side issues. I addressed your OP and I got into
a discussion with Matt about copyright. My discussion with Matt took off
because it was an interesting discussion and for that couple of days you
were not responding. Doesn't mean I didn't look at the thread.

Beatlesfan1225 said:
As for getting an actual copyright, WHAT exactly is that protecting? Is it protecting a script, a synopsis, idea? I'm a bit confused by this.
Click to expand...
http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html#protect

Beatlesfan1225 said:
To answer the last question you posed me, I do have a legitimate fear of the idea/story being taken, yes. Do I think that someone is going to turn around and finance a film and make it before I do? No, realistically, the chances of that are minimal. I am worried about it showing up as a short story or a book, perhaps on a website or literary publication, yes, that is an actual worry I do have. Thus, I want to protect the story, if that is at all possible, as much as I can, at least.
Click to expand...
Where does this fear come from? The people around you? You do not
trust them to not take your unique idea and write a short story or
novel and publish it? People you don't know? How do you think someone
might get a hold of your story? From someone you show your story to?

I respect that you fear this happening. I'm curious as to who you think
might steal your idea.

Okay, you are not asking about copyright – you are asking how to protect
your story from being taken by someone else and showing up in a book
or a short story or on a website.

The answer is; there is nothing can do to protect your story. Registering
the copyright isn't like putting the idea/story into a vault or having constant
protection. The major studios with hundreds of millions of dollars of legal
protection are losing hundreds of millions in copyright infringement.

You can register the copyright but that will not stop someone you show your
script to from writing a short story or a novel based on your story. You will
never know until it is published. After it's published you can take the person
to court and even win a copyright lawsuit. If you can afford it. And even then
your story is "out there".

At least consider my questions. The "stealing" of an idea/story isn't something
that happens often. If you honestly fear someone you know will take your
story or show it to someone who will take it then as Matt already said, the only
thing you can do is limit who you show it to. Show it ONLY to people you fully
trust.
 
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directorik said:
I did look at the thread. In fact, I commented several times on the thread.

I respect that you fear this happening. I'm curious as to who you think
might steal your idea.

Okay, you are not asking about copyright – you are asking how to protect
your story from being taken by someone else and showing up in a book
or a short story or on a website.

The answer is; there is nothing can do to protect your story. Registering
the copyright isn't like putting the idea/story into a vault or having constant
protection. The major studios with hundreds of millions of dollars of legal
protection are losing hundreds of millions in copyright infringement.

You can register the copyright but that will not stop someone you show your
script to from writing a short story or a novel based on your story. You will
never know until it is published. After it's published you can take the person
to court and even win a copyright lawsuit. If you can afford it. And even then
your story is "out there".
Click to expand...

I'll also add that making a film is a collaborative effort. You need a lot of people to help get a movie made - from the cast, to the crew, to the producers, etc. At some point you need to get people excited about the project in order to get the momentum going. You'll need cash or you'll need people to donate their time, or, in the case of screenwriters, you'll need people to buy your script of get representation for you. In other words, your story kind of becomes your currency. As directorik points out above, these people are going to be helping you make the movie, they should be trusted people then, right?

Also, do take to heart what keeps being repeated here: You can't copyright an idea. Many people have the same ideas for movies at almost the same time. Over the years, I think I have read at least three blog posts or articles by screenwriters that mentioned how they remember sitting in a theater, seeing the trailer for Groundhog Day, and nearly fainting because they themselves had long been sketching out the idea of a comedy about a man who relives the same day in his life over and over again.

Not one of these articles thought that the screenwriters of the Bill Murray movie had stolen from them. Most of them didn't even have a complete script at the time.

This doesn't mean theft doesn't happen. Sometimes it is blatant and sometimes, at least in my opinion, it is a little subconscious. For instance, Coming to America was pretty obviously ripped-off, but I've read of other cases where I think that the core idea of a certain script got around and then somebody heard of it and wrote a better script (or at least a more marketable one) based of the idea and that script got made.

But, in the end, remember this: If you truly have a great idea along with a great script, MOST people will: A) Want to buy it from you. or B.) Want to help you make it.
 
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I HATE IT. ITS STUPID. YOUR IDEA IS LAME.

get used to it!

Your idea aint worth the electrons its typed in. Ideas are cheap. I have a hundred great ideas by breakfast. EXECUTION, EXECUTION, EXECUTION.

You have an idea that is so complex that even you say its complex = bad script
Your idea is so great, that even HINTING at what it is would give it away = its not original
You have an story that lives or dies by one single gimick\trick = weak story

None of the above may be true for your project, but I promise some teenage iphone only short film with bad acting, horrible sound, story holes and a weak ending, is 1000 times better than any story you've left unwritten, unread and un-filmed.

Nobody cares about your idea if they cant read it!

I'v gone to consultations with directors\producers that ask me to sign and NDA (non disclosure agreement) before they will let me see the script. Thats fine, Ill sign, read the script and tell them the same thing. FYI: None of those scripts ever made it to screen.

At my low budget\no budget level, If you ask me to sign an NDA, Ill pretty much write your project off with a 10% chance of screening.

Let go, if its a beautiful thing, everyone will know it.
 
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directorik said:
Where does this fear come from? The people around you? You do not
trust them to not take your unique idea and write a short story or
novel and publish it? People you don't know? How do you think someone
might get a hold of your story? From someone you show your story to?

At least consider my questions. The "stealing" of an idea/story isn't something
that happens often. If you honestly fear someone you know will take your
story or show it to someone who will take it then as Matt already said, the only
thing you can do is limit who you show it to. Show it ONLY to people you fully
trust.
Click to expand...

I suppose the fear comes from my personal experience of having a heavily involvement with creative writers and publishing their work over the past year as the EIC of an independent literary publication. We'd get dozens of absolutely wonderful short stories into us, many of which were very original and potentially could have been adapted into novels or even screenplays. Having been on the receiving end of the chaos of writers trying to get published into a real publication, I have a little different view of the matter.
Not trying to sound narcissistic, but I'd publish my story/idea if it came onto my desk at my magazine. So, I'd assume that other editors of other publications may consider it as well.

I think that's where my fear comes from, I'd hate to be reading one of the many literary publications I have worked with or operated, and see my own idea/story, written by someone else.

Obviously, the core of the matter, as you've answered me already, is to keep your ideas and scripts close to home, and only to people you can trust. Then, you work on getting them executed, because an idea isn't worth anything, but a finished product of an idea is. The fear I had personally, which led to my creation of this thread, is that sometimes a project gets too big for yourself or your known collaborators to handle. For example, if someone I've been working with over the internet, or met in this forum, is writing the score for the film, or perhaps creating promotional materials, (Oddly enough, I am working with two Indietalk users on both of those things for this project.) I need to share with them the story and my ideas for it.

But, in all honesty, you are all right, the chances of an idea being stolen are very, very minimal, and the people you collaborate with are likely doing so to help achieve a vision you have, and they'd like to see created as well, and not to steal your ideas for their own. I think I was more curious as to what the legal process would be, if you DID want to protect something, which, as I've learned from this thread, you could technically copyright the words of your screenplay or book, which could provide a level of protection should you absolutely feel you need it.
 
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Most people will not steal an idea. And most of the time, texting while driving won't get you into an accident. Still doesn't make it a smart thing to be careless :)

I do have one sci-fi idea that is fantastic, 10 second pitch I've made everyone loves it. No way in hell I would ever post it on a film making forum :lol:
 
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Oh, I think with the right budget and execution most any of these stories with general outlines could seriously compete with Hollywood standard products: http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=49444

Get it done. In a timely fashion. And you'll have nothing to worry about.

Ideas are... not even worth a dime a dozen or a peso per kilo.
Execution is when you have something ACTUALLY defensible.
 
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Two things I did not see mentioned.

To win a lawsuit you have to prove financial harm. If a guy obviously stole your script but made no money from it and didn't cause you to lose money, no case.

In the US, one automatically has copyright as soon as pen leaves paper.

Yes, you can blow $35 to "register" it, but it is NOT required. You may want/have to register if there's big bucks involved, but in the vast majority of cases (most every one here), forget about it. If someone does steal a script, its not likely they'll make money on it or stop YOU from making money.
 
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Beatlesfan1225

Appreciate your response and not flying off the handle.. you took it in the spirit it was intended.

your response was "blah blah FEAR blah blah FEAR FEAR. blah blah..." :)

NO FEAR!
 
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