You stopped watching at the right time, my friend.
Why does no one want to be a Producer?
- Thread starter NickClapper
- Start date
Risk all and take the blame when things go wrong.
I have no capacity for it. Phone calls to location owners, scheduling shoots, paperwork paperwork paperwork...it all takes time, time I could be writing, storyboarding and otherwise working on the creative elements of a film.
I used to think I could produce and direct, but in reality I would just reduce the scope of the project to fit into the limited producing I wanted to do. Don't want to find a school that will allow me to shoot a movie in? Change the location to the backyard or garage. Creative suicide.
These last two years I've been blessed to have formed working creative partnerships with two very different producers who each believe in my talents as a director and writer/director respectively. It's a matter of me picking up the phone: "Say, I've got a great idea for a horror film in a Christmas tree lot; think we can arrange that?" and the project begins. Or my phone rings: "Joe, think we can come up with something in a construction lot? I can line one up end of November."
I don't want to be a producer because I'm terrible at it, and I let the many jobs that a producer must do reduce my creativity.
I used to think I could produce and direct, but in reality I would just reduce the scope of the project to fit into the limited producing I wanted to do. Don't want to find a school that will allow me to shoot a movie in? Change the location to the backyard or garage. Creative suicide.
These last two years I've been blessed to have formed working creative partnerships with two very different producers who each believe in my talents as a director and writer/director respectively. It's a matter of me picking up the phone: "Say, I've got a great idea for a horror film in a Christmas tree lot; think we can arrange that?" and the project begins. Or my phone rings: "Joe, think we can come up with something in a construction lot? I can line one up end of November."
I don't want to be a producer because I'm terrible at it, and I let the many jobs that a producer must do reduce my creativity.
I'm not a big enough prick to be a producer.
Long and short of it.
Long and short of it.
I just have to say that the only big shot producer I've known was also one of the nicest people I've met...
So probably not a prerequisite!
Every single person (except myself) in my immediate clique of friends are trying to become producers, with varying degrees of commitment & success. All of them have this line memorised, btw:
'I have numerous projects in varying stages of development....'
So my experience is very unlike yours.
Every single person (except myself) in my immediate clique of friends are trying to become producers, with varying degrees of commitment & success. All of them have this line memorised, btw:
'I have numerous projects in varying stages of development....'
So my experience is very unlike yours.
Ha!
That said, and I don't know your immediate clique of friends, do any of them want to be a producer as a first choice sort of thing? Or is it just a fall back/way to get into directing and/or acting?
Only one wants to be a director, but he wants to be a producer as well.
All the others just want to be producers of some kind.
What is sadly ironic is that on the lowest budget indie films, the director is usually a producer as well. The lines are completely blurred as to what aspects of each job they are doing. It also muddles that control and creativity involved in being a producer as opposed to a director.
The producer is the director's BOSS not his/her BITCH. A producer hires a director to do that job. On the indie level, the producer hires himself to direct, even when they may not be qualified to direct because the artistry of that job is lost due to inexperience.
WHY do people want to direct instead of produce? Because of the misplaced "Auteur Theory" that the DIRECTOR is the "Author" of a film. In Hollywood since the late 1970's, producers have the power and control over their films. Steven Spielberg produces everything he directs uncredited, but also has a strong female producer (See Kathleen Kennedy or Bonnie Curtis). Ridley Scott always produces his own material. Same with Bryan Singer, and most other directors with a definitive style and a lot of say over their own movies.
Take for example the whole phenomena over directors like Quentin Tarantino, Kevin Smith, and Ron Howard. Each one has a great deal of their "style" being owed to their producers Lawrence Bender, Scott Mosier, and Brian Grazer. The producers are not nearly as well known as the directors.
Why do people not want to be producers?
Director is just a sexier title and it's about the ego of getting more recognition for your work, even when it isn't deserved. It's also about not being capable of collaborating and working with a director who can share the producer's vision, or a willingness to give someone the creative space to direct and add their own vision to your production.
The producer is the director's BOSS not his/her BITCH. A producer hires a director to do that job. On the indie level, the producer hires himself to direct, even when they may not be qualified to direct because the artistry of that job is lost due to inexperience.
WHY do people want to direct instead of produce? Because of the misplaced "Auteur Theory" that the DIRECTOR is the "Author" of a film. In Hollywood since the late 1970's, producers have the power and control over their films. Steven Spielberg produces everything he directs uncredited, but also has a strong female producer (See Kathleen Kennedy or Bonnie Curtis). Ridley Scott always produces his own material. Same with Bryan Singer, and most other directors with a definitive style and a lot of say over their own movies.
Take for example the whole phenomena over directors like Quentin Tarantino, Kevin Smith, and Ron Howard. Each one has a great deal of their "style" being owed to their producers Lawrence Bender, Scott Mosier, and Brian Grazer. The producers are not nearly as well known as the directors.
Why do people not want to be producers?
Director is just a sexier title and it's about the ego of getting more recognition for your work, even when it isn't deserved. It's also about not being capable of collaborating and working with a director who can share the producer's vision, or a willingness to give someone the creative space to direct and add their own vision to your production.
I got one for ya.
I wrote, directed and PRODUCED Gun Town. Ok, so follow me real close here;
I cast my own actors by myself, lined up accommodations, arranged for a cook to feed us, lined up all locations, wrote and took care of all my own contracts, hired a DP, created the shoot schedule, and probably a few smaller things I can't remember.
So yes, I produced the film.
I Co-Produced a film this year (not mine) and did the following:
Lined up locations, lined up several vehicles, helped set up accommodations, drove people around, helped set equipment up, helped with casting, did a bit of cooking, and maybe a couple of small things I can't remember right now. Yet I was given a "co-producer" credit.
I'm not complaining, but maybe that's why no one wants to, a shit ton of work involved for someone who will actually do it, and little or no pay? You can get burned out real fast.
Simply put, money motivates people a whole lot better.
I wrote, directed and PRODUCED Gun Town. Ok, so follow me real close here;
I cast my own actors by myself, lined up accommodations, arranged for a cook to feed us, lined up all locations, wrote and took care of all my own contracts, hired a DP, created the shoot schedule, and probably a few smaller things I can't remember.
So yes, I produced the film.
I Co-Produced a film this year (not mine) and did the following:
Lined up locations, lined up several vehicles, helped set up accommodations, drove people around, helped set equipment up, helped with casting, did a bit of cooking, and maybe a couple of small things I can't remember right now. Yet I was given a "co-producer" credit.
I'm not complaining, but maybe that's why no one wants to, a shit ton of work involved for someone who will actually do it, and little or no pay? You can get burned out real fast.
Simply put, money motivates people a whole lot better.
But I would argue that money is rarely if ever the motivation for doing indie films...
There are plenty of roles in films which are a lot of work for little pay (director, producer, actor). All these jobs rise, roughly proportionally, in terms of pay the larger the production and the scale of the release.
If it was simply a matter of money, surely no one would make first-time indie films?
There are plenty of roles in films which are a lot of work for little pay (director, producer, actor). All these jobs rise, roughly proportionally, in terms of pay the larger the production and the scale of the release.
If it was simply a matter of money, surely no one would make first-time indie films?
I had a very good on set collaboration with Kelly Johnston, on THE AWAKENING. At the time, he was a noob. He wanted to get the movie made and he knew what feel he wanted from it. He just didn't know how to approach it and get it done. He convinced me to grab my equipment and direct, shoot, edit, score and co-write the thing. He asked, "how about if I co-direct?" I gave him a resounding "No" and I told him that he needed to produce. "What does that mean?" he asked. I told him that since he was financing the project, he needed to gather the actors, secure the locations and buy the costumes and props.
I post these pics, so you can see the closeness of our collaboration. Kelly was always over my shoulder, but in supportive way. I joined the project because I wanted to be able to really have fun with it and put my stamp on it. Another producer, Erik, wrote the initial story, but he and Kelly agreed that I could write the final script and they let me loose with it. By writing the script, I could really internalize the material and have a feel for where it should go. I feel I do best when I internalize a story and then communicate it with the kind of scenes I like to create.
Kelly did all the "producer" things. He secured the locations (something I suck at), he rounded up a contingent of ex-marines, army and air force guys (something I probably would suck at) and he detail checked uniforms and protocol so that what played on screen was fairly authentic. Kelly was an 8 year marine veteran, so he was perfect for this.
Kelly didn't just watch me put together a scene, he asked why I was doing what I was doing. As long as it was logical, he didn't question it. I have to say that the guy had a very good oversight instinct. He knew what kind of project he wanted and that brings me to the point of what a good producer does - he sees the vision through, from concept to release. As much as I like to think I did, it was he who kept us on the path.
The Industry Producer:
Let me give you a good example of producer oversight - POLTERGEIST. Director Tobe Hooper never made another movie that looked like that. The "feel" of it was Spielberg, through and through. An involved producer can spin the vision.
In the past, Hollywood was the producer's world and guys like David O. Selznik ruled it. Producer, Howard Hawks, didn't direct THE THING, Christian Nyby did. Yet, it is known as Howard Hawk's THE THING. (Contrast that with director John Carpenter's THE THING, years later.) The guy who largely changed the public perception of filmmaking was Alfred Hitchcock. People started going to movies, just because Hitch directed them. Guys like Stanley Kubrick paved the way for movies being made by creative auteurs, more so than producers and studios.
I think a lot of people like to be a producer. The problem is the word "producer" can mean an associate who contributed something for free, all the way up to the man/woman controlling the money and the vision. An actor can be an executive producer by waiving their huge payday and working for scale. It can be pretty vague.
Nowadays, it's usually the director's movie. Joe Carnahan is known for writing and directing the movie NARC. It's his baby. Ever watch the opening credits for NARC? This is hilarious:
Hollywood is full of producers, but I think indies could benefit from having a good producer, with vision and organization to make it happen. A lot of what works is about chemistry. A producer with a good eye for talent can create a juggernaut.
I post these pics, so you can see the closeness of our collaboration. Kelly was always over my shoulder, but in supportive way. I joined the project because I wanted to be able to really have fun with it and put my stamp on it. Another producer, Erik, wrote the initial story, but he and Kelly agreed that I could write the final script and they let me loose with it. By writing the script, I could really internalize the material and have a feel for where it should go. I feel I do best when I internalize a story and then communicate it with the kind of scenes I like to create.
Kelly did all the "producer" things. He secured the locations (something I suck at), he rounded up a contingent of ex-marines, army and air force guys (something I probably would suck at) and he detail checked uniforms and protocol so that what played on screen was fairly authentic. Kelly was an 8 year marine veteran, so he was perfect for this.
Kelly didn't just watch me put together a scene, he asked why I was doing what I was doing. As long as it was logical, he didn't question it. I have to say that the guy had a very good oversight instinct. He knew what kind of project he wanted and that brings me to the point of what a good producer does - he sees the vision through, from concept to release. As much as I like to think I did, it was he who kept us on the path.
The Industry Producer:
Let me give you a good example of producer oversight - POLTERGEIST. Director Tobe Hooper never made another movie that looked like that. The "feel" of it was Spielberg, through and through. An involved producer can spin the vision.
In the past, Hollywood was the producer's world and guys like David O. Selznik ruled it. Producer, Howard Hawks, didn't direct THE THING, Christian Nyby did. Yet, it is known as Howard Hawk's THE THING. (Contrast that with director John Carpenter's THE THING, years later.) The guy who largely changed the public perception of filmmaking was Alfred Hitchcock. People started going to movies, just because Hitch directed them. Guys like Stanley Kubrick paved the way for movies being made by creative auteurs, more so than producers and studios.
I think a lot of people like to be a producer. The problem is the word "producer" can mean an associate who contributed something for free, all the way up to the man/woman controlling the money and the vision. An actor can be an executive producer by waiving their huge payday and working for scale. It can be pretty vague.
Nowadays, it's usually the director's movie. Joe Carnahan is known for writing and directing the movie NARC. It's his baby. Ever watch the opening credits for NARC? This is hilarious:
Hollywood is full of producers, but I think indies could benefit from having a good producer, with vision and organization to make it happen. A lot of what works is about chemistry. A producer with a good eye for talent can create a juggernaut.
I'm kinda surprised to hear you say this. Though I've never stepped foot on a professional set, I'd like to think I have at least a rough understanding of how things work. I don't recall anyone implying that the producer is anybody's bitch. And yeah, as producer of my own work, I understand that so many of the most important (creative) decisions that I make are being made by Joseph the producer, not Joseph the director. But those decisions were all mostly made during pre-production, in choosing who to get to do which job, and communicating with them how the whole thing will fit together. Yes, that's an art, and kudos to those who enjoy it.
But once production starts, director is a whole lot more than just a sexier title. During production, it is the director who is in the trenches, so to say. It is the director who has the most immediate impact on the entire flow of the movie. And for me, that's just plain more fun. Ego has absolutely nothing to do with it. Having done both jobs on every one of my own productions, I can tell you that it is simply a matter of which is more fun, and which feels more like work to me.
QFT
The Golden Rule: He who has the gold, makes the rules.
The only medium in which producers get more credit for a creative work is television.
Reminds of a joke I MAY have told before.
Two producers are sitting at a bar in LA having a drink. A beautiful young woman walks in and sits down at the other end of the bar. Producer 1 looks at Producer 2 and says "I could fuck her". Producer 2 cranes his neck to take a look at her, thinks for a moment and says "Out of what?"
Two producers are sitting at a bar in LA having a drink. A beautiful young woman walks in and sits down at the other end of the bar. Producer 1 looks at Producer 2 and says "I could fuck her". Producer 2 cranes his neck to take a look at her, thinks for a moment and says "Out of what?"
Ha!
Best Producer related joke I've heard in a while...What I would say is that when I originally posted I was more referring to the indie producer than the Hollywood producer. I guess being a Hollywood producer is accepted to be great, just as being a Hollywood director is. But unlike with a director very few people seem willing to go through the motions of doing the grunt work on indie films in order to try and work their way up as a Producer...
I WANT TO MEET YOUR FRIENDS, STEVE!
Like pretty much everybody on here, I've had to produce all my own stuff. I will say this: producing is a lot easier with money than without, though it's technically also the producer's job to find the money. By that rationale alone, I SUCK at producing!
I WANT TO MEET YOUR FRIENDS, STEVE!
Like pretty much everybody on here, I've had to produce all my own stuff. I will say this: producing is a lot easier with money than without, though it's technically also the producer's job to find the money. By that rationale alone, I SUCK at producing!
Strange as this may seem I'd be happy to take on a Producing role with a film, without trying to use it to pole vault into directing. To a certain extent both appeal to me, but at the moment I'd say I'm probably better equipped to produce than direct.
I just think that I'm part of a rare breed who detect some glamour in the role of an independent producer
So if anyone in London needs a producer I'd be happy to help 
It's becasue there are so many myths on what a producer actually does. Most creative types view the producer as a burden, or just the money. And while that does exist, that's the exception, not the rule.
Yes, there are many producing credits on films that are absolutely meaningless, but that doesn't mean there isn't one or two creative producers on a project.
Yes, there are many producing credits on films that are absolutely meaningless, but that doesn't mean there isn't one or two creative producers on a project.