• Wondering which camera, gear, computer, or software to buy? Ask in our Gear Guide.

Shoot with sun behind or in front

Hi,

I got some helpful advice here on lighting before I shot my last short (which was also my first). This time I'm going to be shooting mostly outside on a park bench in the morning and I'm wondering whether to have the morning sun lighting their faces or shoot toward the sun and let it light their shoulders and hair and then maybe bounce some light back at their faces.

A few months ago I would have thought the answer was easy--let the sun light their faces--but I've done a few videography jobs lately in the evening and I like the highlights (if that's the right word) you get on shoulders and hair when the setting sun (which is much like a rising sun) is behind the subject.

What would you do?

By the way, electrical lighting is not an option. I'll be in the middle of a big park.

Tom
 
I'm going to venture into an area I generally don't stray to very often... time for some artsy fartsy.. ;)

What is the tone of the story?

Is it an enlightening, uplifting, awakening situation? Or is it more depressing?

I think symbolically it's more fitting to have the morning sun lighting your characters face if the tone of the story is more positive, if it's a more depressing, sad, dark story, it probably makes more sense to have the sun to the characters back. This would let you keep their face somewhat in shadow if that works for the story.

In either case, you'll want to bounce at least some light onto the opposite side. If the sun is at their back, bounce some onto their face.. if it's to their face, bounce some back onto their head/shoulders.

Anyway, without more information about the story and the location there's really no way anyone can answer this question. Either might work, but what works best for the story, the location, and the type of shots you plan to get?
 
Here is the absolute end-all answer to your question. Go to the park with a friend, in the morning. Tell them to sit in the bench. Record a small amount of test-footage. Go back to the same location in the afternoon. Get the same kind of test-footage. Compare the two examples side by side. You decide.
 
I totally agree with both Will and especially CF, I can't stress enough how much time test shoots will save you on set! Knowing what you're going to do before you walk onto a set technically allows you to concentrate on the performance once you hit set. Better product in the long run with the same amount of set time.
 
I would test too and make note of the weather that day, but in general I would go for morning.

You can position the actors facing or back to the sun, and if some unforeseeable worse case scenario should arise, at least you'll have the whole days light to reshoot in, where as in the afternoon should something happen, then you would be racing against the on coming darkness and have to reassemble your cast and crew for another whole day.

-Thanks-
 
Last edited:
Lots of good advice. Thanks.

Yeah, taking mood into consideration is a good point. The mood is complex. It's a serious conversation treated with gentle irony.

I like morning and evening light, but the park will be MUCH quieter in the morning (which reminds of my other issue--lav or shotgun mic) and the scene takes place in the morning so it'll be a bonus if the actors look a little sleepy.

So I did some test shots (me setting up tripod then running into the shot, sitting on bench, feeling like idiot). I think I've decided on backlit--I really like the rim of light on shoulder, hair, side of face, but I will need to bounce a lot of light toward the actors, so I'm trying to figure out how to do that. I've got two portable stands that are made for holding a studio backdrop. Maybe they can hold some cardboard wrapped in something shiny. I just read a tip elsewhere about using an emergency blanket. If I'm lucky, I'll get a chance to try it out during the week before we shoot next Saturday (weather permitting).

t
 
Always prep, always prep. Test shoots won't stop everything going belly-up, but if you're playing percentages, you've got a hell of a better chance running a smooth shoot with a prep day.

Also, get a baking tray, whether our baking trays are similar across the pond pond pond-- Here you can get some cheap disposable reflective boards, usually used for light baking, they work a charm.
 
Last edited:
I just learned this new trick.

Have the sun behind and out of the frame. Set the cam to expose for sky detail, now Bounce the sun light right into the face...

It will still look like the sun is rising into their faces, cause your bouncing it back hard.. but the sky wont be all blown..
 
Maybe they can hold some cardboard wrapped in something shiny.

Get yourself some white foamcore, or some beadboard.

White should bounce plenty of light from the sun, but you could always glue some foil or an emergency blanket to the back side, to have a brighter silver reflector.

Of course you would also do well to pick up a 3 in 1 or 5 in 1 bounce.. they're invaluable. :)
 
We did the scene today. I'll try to post a few clips when I get a chance. I already looked at them. They look 'okay'. We couldn't bounce quite enough light and stay out of the frame. It was always a compromise--over-expose shoulders and hair or under-expose faces. We had a white shower curtain set up on a frame from a studio backdrop, 3 foam-core boards duct-taped to sticks stuck in the ground and one 3' diameter reflector which I rented.
 
Don't underestimate the power of post production. When color grading, you can always mask out the pricipals and enhance them only. This allows you to not wash out your pretty back ground while making them the best they can be.
 
We did the scene today. I'll try to post a few clips when I get a chance. I already looked at them. They look 'okay'. We couldn't bounce quite enough light and stay out of the frame. It was always a compromise--over-expose shoulders and hair or under-expose faces. We had a white shower curtain set up on a frame from a studio backdrop, 3 foam-core boards duct-taped to sticks stuck in the ground and one 3' diameter reflector which I rented.

I haven't had a chance to upload any clips, but here are a few set photos. You can see our little set-up:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/faintscrawl/sets/72157624617438037/with/4899477193/
 
This is basically a 1-light 3-point lighting system... you can emulate the same thing by blasting a light as a rim light on your subject, then bounce to key and fill at different distances to vary the ratio. Well done!
 
hello, i'm in a similar situation and i did a little test intro for my 2nd short, i tried 3 different benches, the one i used for the shots at the end was the worst set up but i wanted to use those specific shots. unfortunately, being in scotland the weather will most likely be different by the time i go from a mid shot to a close-up. if anyone has any tips or ideas i'd be glad to hear them.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tmXKVb35a4

how do u embed from yt??
 
Last edited:
YT link fixed... press edit on your post to see how (video code in yt tags).

I think they're quite good looking shots. To deal with the sun moving, you may have to shoot different framings on separate days to get the lighting consistent.
 
cheers knightly, there's already some good tips here so i didn't want to start a new thread for the same question really. hoping to do it in one day so will just need to hope the weather is favourable, and will take a reflector disc along.
 
Thanks. Yes, we started shooting at about 9ish. The sun was behind at the time. Of course, you never realize how fast the damn sun moves until you try shooting outdoors. We had to shift the reflectors quite often to keep up with the sun. I think we finished at 11:30, when the sun was more overhead obviously. I haven't put it together yet. Hopefully the change in light isn't too obvious. We shot in sequence, following the script so the change will hopefully be gradual, not shocking. It's about a 6 minute scene, I'm guessing, once it's edited.
 
Back
Top