Question about continuity.

H

harmonica44

I had to cut a scene shoot short, cause we didn't get the scene space as long as I'd hoped. Now I might be able go back in a week and finish. They need to confirm, but also have to make sure weather conditions are similar so it all matches up. I also have to make the set look very much the same as it did before in order to match. I will try to get as many close ups of the actors I can without it looking too funny. This was I can block out the differences of the set as much as possible.

Now here's the big thing. The actors hair. By the time we get the next chance to finish this scene, the hair could have grown noticeably. Who knows. I heard that on the show 24, the actors have to get their hair cut, every five days to match up in the 24 hour plot continuity. So any advice on how I can do that. I don't think I can go to a barber, show them some footage and they will be good enough to do it right, instead of risk cutting off too much hair of course.
 
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harmonica44 said:
I had to cut a scene shoot short, cause we didn't get the scene space as long as I'd hoped. Now I might be able go back in a week and finish. They need to confirm, but also have to make sure weather conditions are similar so it all matches up. I also have to make the set look very much the same as it did before in order to match. I will try to get as many close ups of the actors I can without it looking too funny. This was I can block out the differences of the set as much as possible.

Now here's the big thing. The actors hair. By the time we get the next chance to finish this scene, the hair could have grown noticeably. Who knows. I heard that on the show 24, the actors have to get their hair cut, every five days to match up in the 24 hour plot continuity. So any advice on how I can do that. I don't think I can go to a barber, show them some footage and they will be good enough to do it right, instead of risk cutting off too much hair of course.
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Re-shoot it and don't drive yourself bananas. It will go quickly because you already did it once. All your problems go away with one decision.
 
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Feutus Lapdance said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSnCu43QzeY

Shave joure actor bald.....Problem.... solft.
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Call it 'art.' Apparently you can do anything if it's called 'art.' Personally, my first short is purely 'artistic' which means I can do anything. Long hair, short hair, afros, bring it all on.

If anyone pulls you up on it, just say it's philosophy as art. Specifically, the difference in the actor is down to the Jungian overtones commenting on the changing nature of the individual challenging Nietsche's commentary on the nature of being. These are two, polarised outlooks on how the individual changes and evolves which is why the actor's T-shirt just turned red and his hair grew.

Works every time.
 
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CamVader said:
Re-shoot it and don't drive yourself bananas. It will go quickly because you already did it once. All your problems go away with one decision.
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I can't reshoot it. The one actor is not available anymore, unless I wait till an indefinite time till when he says yes he can again. I can only get one of two actors to come back. I'm going through the footage so far, and I found at least one shot with both actors in. One actor nailed the shot, and the other actor did not. I couldn't do another retake cause we had to stop cause the location was not available anymore, and we already went overtime a little. Plus I won't have the location for too many weeks longer, and the actor, who knows when he will say he's available again.

So for that shot at least I will have to take the actor who screwed up, and reshoot his footage, then split screen it with the other actor, making it looking like they are talking to each other.

It will be more drama just to reshoot the whole thing, rather than get the one actor who is available now, and making his hair and look, the same since.
 
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harmonica44 said:
So for that shot at least I will have to take the actor who screwed up, and reshoot his footage, then split screen it with the other actor, making it looking like they are talking to each other.
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Bro... This won't work. You would need the camera in the exact same position and angle, exact same statins and focus set the same way, exact same lighting... The list goes on. EVEN if you had all the measurements and angles marked I don't think you could set it up again.

Can't get the actor? Rewrite it. Make it a phone call. Put a diff actor in. Or cut the scene. Or reshoot everything with a new actor playing the part.

Remember harmy, this first short is school. It's like a kindergartener's clay ashtray. Nobody cares how it turns out, just that you're making it and learnin so that come project #2 you'll understand more technique. Then the 3rd will be even better. Come 397 you might have yourself a damn fine feature film.

Or shoot, do the splitscreen thing and learn the hard way.
 
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Well I want to do something. What about shooting the other scenes aside from the split screen, with just the actor. The thing is I doubt I will be able to do the scene all in one day. There is a lot to do, and working with the locations I have, none are available for long enough. Plus the weather changes and at this time of year there is only a limited amount of sunlight that looks the same for so long. So I doubt I will be able to do it all one go.

I don't have the exact measurements and angles marked but I know approximately where everything was set, including the lights. Maybe not the exact inches. Any other way besides split screening? Maybe green screening the background?
 
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Not talking about the scenario but the career-filmmaking approach in general. When you bite off a little at a time you don't choke, dig a little at a time you don't get buried, swim too far and drown... Pick your metaphor. Basically by taking on a mammoth project it makes it hard to finish then no one wins.

What would I do in your scenario?
Rewrite it. Make it a phone call. Put a diff actor in. Or cut the scene. Or reshoot everything with a new actor playing the part.
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If you absolutely, world will end, HAVE to have that scene, shooting the one actor by himself could work, just a little harder to cut together.

Filmmakers do find themselves in tough scenarios here and there. Even Marty McFly was recast a few weeks into production, and in many productions scenes have been cut or rewritten on the set. It happens
 
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Yeah. I mean the thing is, this is not the kind of scene that can have the same effect in a phone call. It's like the scene In Few Good Men for example:


SPOILERS

Remember when Tom Cruise tried to get Jack Nicholson to confess his sins, on the witness stand, and they did it face to face? If he tried to get him to confess his sins over a phone call, and they weren't even looking at each other, how much would the scene diminish?

Well I will do the shots with one actor with the lights in the same places. Not exactly the same but real close. And hopefully the sunlight will look the same next time the location is available. If that doesn't work I'll wait till the other actor is available again, or if not get someone else. But I got an opportunity with this other actor now, and if I wait, than he won't be available later. And he has three more scenes that need to be shot, along with the other actors all together.

I know I will probably have to use the original take with the one actor screwing up, instead of split screening or green screening. But most movies where the lighting or background doesn't match up, viewers are willing to accept that more, than an obvious actors screwing up his line, and breaking out of character, aren't they?
 
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harmonica44 said:
Yeah. I mean the thing is, this is not the kind of scene that can have the same effect in a phone call. It's like the scene In Few Good Men for example:


SPOILERS

Remember when Tom Cruise tried to get Jack Nicholson to confess his sins, on the witness stand, and they did it face to face? If he tried to get him to confess his sins over a phone call, and they weren't even looking at each other, how much would the scene diminish?
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Yes, but think of how much more 'artistic' the whole piece would have been if Jack Nicholson had been wearing a giant afro which kept appearing and disappearing between the scenes. Remember you don't have to buy into the Hollywood BS - you're your own man - make art.
 
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harmonica44 said:
Yeah. I mean the thing is, this is not the kind of scene that can have the same effect in a phone call. It's like the scene In Few Good Men for example:


SPOILERS

Remember when Tom Cruise tried to get Jack Nicholson to confess his sins, on the witness stand, and they did it face to face? If he tried to get him to confess his sins over a phone call, and they weren't even looking at each other, how much would the scene diminish?

Well I will do the shots with one actor with the lights in the same places. Not exactly the same but real close. And hopefully the sunlight will look the same next time the location is available. If that doesn't work I'll wait till the other actor is available again, or if not get someone else. But I got an opportunity with this other actor now, and if I wait, than he won't be available later. And he has three more scenes that need to be shot, along with the other actors all together.

I know I will probably have to use the original take with the one actor screwing up, instead of split screening or green screening. But most movies where the lighting or background doesn't match up, viewers are willing to accept that more, than an obvious actors screwing up his line, and breaking out of character, aren't they?
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Sometimes we paint ourselves into a corner. It happens. The pro's do it, as Paul mentioned, and it was unintentional for them, too.

You can't negotiate your way out of it. Sometimes we have to accept 'no' for an answer and move on to the next best option. Being married to every idea you have is going to make you very old, very fast. Be flexible, brother, or feel free to bang your head against the wall. Peace.
 
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Like Paul said, forget the split-screen idea. For all intents and purposes, it's basically impossible.

What you could do, instead, is to get a stand-in for the person who can't make the 2nd shoot. Shoot over-the-shoulder, with only a little of your stand-in in the frame. Do it right, and nobody will notice.

As for the hair, don't sweat it. In my experience, differences in hair have to be rather extreme for people to notice. You're gonna shoot again in a week? Maybe two weeks? Hair don't grow that fast.
 
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Work it out bro! This is filmmaking. It is what happens and you adapt and work it out without a forum post every step. Just sayin'.
 
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Well I can't do the over the shoulder thing cause the scene is already shot from behind one actor, looking over his shoulder to another actor. So I can't do a stand in since it's the actor where you see his face that is shown.

The one actor is available to shoot in the same location and that location should be available again next week. I'll get him in there and shoot some scenes with him. I'll stick the storyboard and see if I can get good stuff to cut and paste together. If not I'll ask them both to reshoot sometime, and I'll probably have to look for a different location. One that I can keep for sure, with no getting kicked off early.

If I can't do the split screen, I have to cut that actor out of the take, which I wasn't able to retake again in time. So I mean, I could zoom in, in post to get that actor out of frame, but it would look too close to other actor, while he's talking and it would look blurry. The other option is to reshoot next week with just the one actor and dub that other actors dialogue off screen, while the cam is on the other guy. However I am going to have to shoot a lot of shots of the one actor, and paste it with the rest of the scene. The camera will be on one actor, while the other guy is talking. However the camera is going to be on the guy maybe at least 60% more of the time, so I hope it doesn't come off two one sided in the end.

Another thing is the location will look different by next week. Some of the objects and furniture will be gone. So I'll have to shoot a lot of close ups of the one actor, but the other footage of the other actor will be further way, when cutting back and forth. Hope cutting back and forth, between wide angle to close up, during a conversation, won't look too weird either. I could get the one actor who screwed up the take to ADR over it. He said his lines but just didn't say them convincingly in that take. Maybe if I can get him to dub over it with a different tone of voice, the screw up will come off more convincing. Worth a try.

The biggest problem is one other scene. Since I wasn't able to finish, the one actor goes from sitting to standing in the cuts, with not cuts in between of him getting up. Originally this was not continuous but the one way I can save the scene is if I cut part out of the middle that doesn't work, unless I zoom in in post, over the actors shoulder, all the way to a close up of the other guys face while talking. Then cut back to the other guy and all of a sudden he's sitting.
 
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Dude, you're negotiating again and making a mountain out of a mole hill. Re-shoot, re-write, and do it over. You're contemplating ADR when you can't even operate your camera with minimal proficiency? Really?

You may be sent back to pathetic noob status, wait....I'm getting a transmission from the forum collective. It's garbled because of the immense response and our limited bandwidth....hold on...it's getting clearer...the message has been decoded.

Stop posting your inane incompetence and get a little humility. You argue every piece of advice given to you and then move on to your next complete and total failure. Then you ask for advice, ignore it, and then move on to your next complete and total failure.

Stop! Shut up and listen!...if you don't, I'll tell you how I really feel. :) Seriously, bro, you appear as dense as cobalt. Can we expect more from you? Huh? Are you done yet?

~straightens tie~

That said, I wish you well on this film. :cool:
 
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