Community Project - Starts Now

Justice said:
Honestly, I see everyones point I guess. It just didn't occur to me there would be any concern about it. A shower isn't explicit to me. It just genuinely didn't occur to me that people would feel this way. Part of me feels like you guys must be the pervs. The other part of me feels like I must be fucked up. Whatever! Jerks!
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I'm actually going to go out on a limb here and say that the negative reaction to the idea is probably 90% as a result of the fact that you're a new member and haven't really contributed much on other threads before coming up with this, slightly outlandish, idea.

It just seems quite odd that practically your first post on the forum would be imploring other members to film shower scenes (which are typically assosciated with an element of sexuality)...
 
Justice said:
Honestly, I see everyones point I guess. It just didn't occur to me there would be any concern about it. A shower isn't explicit to me. It just genuinely didn't occur to me that people would feel this way. Part of me feels like you guys must be the pervs. The other part of me feels like I must be fucked up. Whatever! Jerks!
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Adding to the fun..

Justice,
porn (pictures of necked people) is a BAZILLION DOLLAR a year industry. Its NORMAL to think of filming someone in the shower (nudity or no) as sexual. Even nudists accept that the NORM is to view the necked body as a sexual object. Only a naive or immature person would consider it NOT so.

It not "occurring" to you suggest that you are not what the world would call "normal," now thats fine with me, normality is so.. boring, but you need to function in this world of normals, understanding the social taboos is part of that normalization.

Jeezeee, kids these days! I guess thats what comes from growing up playing video games and watching internet porn for 16 hours a day

(that last bit was a joke, don't be hurt!)
 
Whoever asked, snide or not, I'm still interested in the project but it's pretty lonely.

Wheat;
No. Honestly, I couldn't disagree with you more but it's obvious to me that I would be wasting my typing. We won't agree but it's okay because I'm aware that people are different.

To the rest of you.. I forgot I was new and hadn't contributed. I've been reading various parts of this board for a long time. I was a mograph for years and forums like this just feel familiar to me.

Honestly people.. Here's what happened.. I read the thread about how community projects fail. Someone suggested they fail in conceptual. I thought everyone could shoot something that's the same but different. I thought of showering. I have worked at huge ad agencies since I was 18 years old. I'm not shy about throwing out ideas that people may or may not like. It just seemed like it would be an easy exercise that anyone could do, with no budget, and it would be interesting enough to garner attention as a community project. In the past I have been a part of Community projects that have resulted in some participants becoming gainfully employed. It just seemed like a clever idea. I don't know whether or not I want to see any of you naked, but this wasn't in any way conceived with the intent of making anything pornographic. I also lack a shower fetish.

I totally get it though and really I'm flattered that people took time to respond.
 
Instead of showering, maybe we should all get a brazilian wax followed up by an anal bleaching??? Just a trial balloon. What do you guys think.? But hey Justice, why don't you get in on the discussion going on in the other thread. Not as much nudity but it coul dbe fun anyway. :)
 
Justice, first Kudos for keeping it cool, that says good things about you, though may be an abnormal freak, your a NICE abnormal freak.. lol

You cant "disagree" with my statement, its a fact. You may not agree that it should be so, but you can NOT dispute the reality of social norms. Go ask 1000 people if filming someone in the shower is sexual in nature and MOST will say yes. Thus its a normal reaction. Just because we live in a permissive society, don't assume that the definition of normal has changed. It hasn't, its just that nobody really cares if your abnormal.

Murdoc.. you need to work on that "mind \ keyboard" filter thing.. lol..
 
I'm not sure where to start, but here goes.

wheatgrinder said:
porn (pictures of necked people) is a BAZILLION DOLLAR a year industry. Its NORMAL to think of filming someone in the shower (nudity or no) as sexual. Even nudists accept that the NORM is to view the necked body as a sexual object. Only a naive or immature person would consider it NOT so.
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It could be argued that naivete and immaturity are partly at fault for that over-sexualization and/or fear of the naked human body. Sure, nudists or any folks out in public not wearing clothes must be aware that there are people who can't act within social and legal 'norms' and would do said nude folks harm because being naked might mean something sexual to that crazy person. But do we really want to play to the lowest common denominator of our society? If I were a nudist, I wouldn't care if someone sexualizes my naked body, because I would be comfortable with my nudity and myself. It's when someone assaults someone else that there is a problem.


It not "occurring" to you suggest that you are not what the world would call "normal," now thats fine with me, normality is so.. boring, but you need to function in this world of normals, understanding the social taboos is part of that normalization.
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That's a backhanded compliment.


You cant "disagree" with my statement, its a fact. You may not agree that it should be so, but you can NOT dispute the reality of social norms. Go ask 1000 people if filming someone in the shower is sexual in nature and MOST will say yes. Thus its a normal reaction. Just because we live in a permissive society, don't assume that the definition of normal has changed. It hasn't, its just that nobody really cares if your abnormal.
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While that statement isn't false, it's certainly not a whole truth. It all depends on context and location. Firstly, your statement is the most true and holds the most weight in the US. I know you have done your fair share of traveling so I'm surprised to hear you suggest that the whole world has such a prudish view of the naked body. When I first arrived in Warsaw and was being driven to my host family's house, do you want to know what the first ad I saw was? A massive billboard with a fully naked woman on it, nothing hidden, selling soap. I'd never seen anything like it, having grown up in a puritanical society. But no one payed it any mind. Everywhere I've traveled (admittedly it's been limited to europe and canada) I've seen nudity in media in a non-sexual form.
Secondly, what I mean by context is this. If someone came up to me on the street and asked to film me in the shower, would I jump to the conclusion that it was probably something sexual? Yes.

But let me put this question out there, for how many of you is showering typically a sexual experience?

So, bearing your answer to that question in mind, is this idea for an experimental film bad? Does it have to imply something sexual? Can it not be some interesting glimpse into human nature?


wheatgrinder said:
though may be an abnormal freak, your a NICE abnormal freak.. lol
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Another backhanded compliment. But I guess you get points for the lol :rolleyes:

Murdoc.. you need to work on that "mind \ keyboard" filter thing.. lol..
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lol, I thought it was funny.
 
I don't think this is as bad as everyone thinks it is. Nudity is not required. Just meant to show the variation on how people do something. Everyone showers, and its basically just standing under water and bathing yourself, but no one does it the exact same way.

On the other hand, there could be better subjects to tackle with this type of idea. Making breakfast was a good one, or even just getting ready for work in the morning or your morning routine (or any time of day). I think that would actually be a good concept, since some people wake up really early when it's still dark, some people wake up when the sun is out, and some people don't get ready for work until it's night and dark again.
 
Dreadylocks said:
But let me put this question out there, for how many of you is showering typically a sexual experience?

So, bearing your answer to that question in mind, is this idea for an experimental film bad? Does it have to imply something sexual? Can it not be some interesting glimpse into human nature?
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I think the US/Europe division is an interesting point, and the idea in itself is not a bad one. Routine actions like showering are private yet done by everyone, which would certainly make it an interesting study. The concept's fairly sound, but - as Smith points out - asking a group of complete strangers for footage of something usually done in private really isn't a very good idea.
 
Morning routine would be better. Seven minutes per segment in the shower would be extremely boring to watch. And watching someone shower that long is voyeurism, plain and simple. It's also seeing someone at the height of vulnerability whether or not you actually show full nudity on camera. Hitchcock made this scene famous and emblazoned the vulnerability aspect in everyone's mind without showing any nudity.

Hell, a George Carlin only takes about a minute - armpits, asshole, crotch and teeth.

So, all of you wannabe directors, go out and shoot hot women showering together with full nudity, and send me the segments so I can stitch them together into an artistic film. K thanks bye. :D
 
Justice said:
Whoever asked, snide or not, I'm still interested in the project but it's pretty lonely.
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That was me. And it was not snide. Relax a bit, Justice. As you
can see this is a pretty cool group of people. You called us jerks
and we are still on board.

Justice said:
Wheat;
No. Honestly, I couldn't disagree with you more but it's obvious to me that I would be wasting my typing. We won't agree but it's okay because I'm aware that people are different.
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A discussion isn't always about agreement. It is not a waste of
time to have a discussion.

Justice said:
I'm not shy about throwing out ideas that people may or may not like.
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Honestly that isn't how it seems. People offered their opinion
on your idea and you called us jerks. I'm glad you're cool about
it now. This is a very interesting idea that has caused us all to
voice our opinion.

The main reason these projects fail is because the person originating
it gets upset when people don't instantly jump right in and do exactly
what they want. This is a group of very creative people. If you want
it to succeed you need to guide the project. Allow other opinions, don't
get offended when opinions are expressed and don't call names. Then
adjust your personal goal and allow the creativity of the rest of us to
grow.

Maybe showering isn't what most people want to do. Are you open
to other ideas?
 
Justice said:
I'm not shy about throwing out ideas that people may or may not like.
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I also come from environments like these... and the reactions tend toward this in the environments I've seen, with the appropriate thick skin (which you seem to have) in all the members.

So that specific idea was shot down, let's pick a different topic and make it happen. Moving forward, ever forward.
 
mahdy said:
...

btw, do i look like under 18?? :no:
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Age is irrelevant. There are plenty of adult children (i.e. adults who act like children) in the world. :lol:

And if you're referring to your avatar, rarely are those representative of someone's actual looks. Mine is the rare exception. I look exactly like that.
 
If anyone was offended by "jerks!" I should say I was trying to be ironic or something. For this whole thing, I apologize for anything offensive. By no means my intention.

I see people eat all the time. It also lacks a constant. Same with morning routines to be honest. I accept the idea is a flop.

Dready, thank you. You materialized a lot of what I would have said if I went down that path. I just didn't want to get too into defending myself or the idea.

End of day, if I'd stumbled upon this thread, made by someone I didn't know, I'd probably participate. So although I understand everyones disagreement, I know I'm innocent enough. Again, I am really just flattered it's being discussed.

So let's start over..

Hi, I'm Justice. I'm from the US. I am currently in Madison, WI. I've lived most everywhere else. I haven't made much but I'm working on it. I hope to make motion pictures someday. And I don't have a shower fetish.
 
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