Writers deserve majority credit

F

Fear

Anyone can act. Just look at Hollywood. Michael Jordan playing a lead role. 8 year children winning Oscars. Australian everything

Anyone can direct. It's communicating an idea and telling people what to do. How fuckin' hard is it? It's not.

NOT anyone can just write a script. Screenwriting is a proper skill that takes years of dedication and frustration to get good at. Without a good script your movie ain't shit. The script is the foundation of the film. Screenwriting is one of the only jobs related to film making that actually requires a particular technique (in the categories of acting, directing and writing)

Many actors have stated that acting is not hard. We can all agree that acting is not hard. It's not. It's playing dress up. That's all the proof I need to enforce that assertion. Brando, Clooney, Depp - All actors who have confessed to the simplicity of the art form.

And it's just common sense to know directing isn't hard. It's fun. If you want hard work, be an asphalt worker. That's hard work

No one ever says writing is easy. Being creative is friggin' exhausting. Waking up everyday and bleeding your brain for ideas is hard work - Mentally

Yet who gets all the credit? Bimbo actors and directors. It's totally twisted. Fts
 
Fear said:
Anyone can act. Just look at Hollywood. Michael Jordan playing a lead role. 8 year children winning Oscars. Australian everything

Anyone can direct. It's communicating an idea and telling people what to do. How fuckin' hard is it? It's not.

NOT anyone can just write a script. Screenwriting is a proper skill that takes years of dedication and frustration to get good at. Without a good script your movie ain't shit. The script is the foundation of the film. Screenwriting is one of the only jobs related to film making that actually requires a particular technique (in the categories of acting, directing and writing)

Many actors have stated that acting is not hard. We can all agree that acting is not hard. It's not. It's playing dress up. That's all the proof I need to enforce that assertion. Brando, Clooney, Depp - All actors who have confessed to the simplicity of the art form.

And it's just common sense to know directing isn't hard. It's fun. If you want hard work, be an asphalt worker. That's hard work

No one ever says writing is easy. Being creative is friggin' exhausting. Waking up everyday and bleeding your brain for ideas is hard work - Mentally

Yet who gets all the credit? Bimbo actors and directors. It's totally twisted. Fts
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You sir are talking utter crap, Every single department wether its carrying cables, making tea, directing the set, acting on set, capturing sound, drawing storyboads and so on are equally as challenging as the other.

do other departments deserve more credit sure.. but the way the world runs is that most people only care for the director and actors.. thats what sells films..
 
Fear said:
NOT anyone can just write a script.
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Of course they can. Writing a good script is hard; but just writing a script is a piece of cake.


Fear said:
Screenwriting is one of the only jobs related to film making that actually requires a particular technique (in the categories of acting, directing and writing).
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What about all the other “catagories”? Acting, directing and writing are only a minute percentage of all the jobs required in the creation of a film. How about cinematography, set design, costume design, sound design... Do they get enough credit?


Fear said:
We can all agree that acting is not hard. It's not. It's playing dress up.
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Can we? Is it? I can’t say I agree.


Fear said:
And it's just common sense to know directing isn't hard...
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Is that right?


Fear said:
Being creative is friggin' exhausting.
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Yep. And acting and directing are both very creative artistic expressions.
 
*removed. this guy punked me once I won't fall for it again*
 
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If acting is so easy where's your Best Actor Oscar?

If directing is so easy where's your Best Director Oscar?


Oh, and by the way, simple is not easy; in fact, simple is usually very difficult to accomplish. The simpler something is the more easily we can see the flaws. This is what you failed to assimilate from the interviews with actors saying it's simple; the challenge is to UNcomplicate the creative process just and let it happen.

And, obviously, communicating is extremely difficult. It has not been clearly communicated to you how much hard work, dedication, intelligence, creativity and discipline all of the other filmmaking crafts require from their practitioners. Without them, there is no film.

Why don't you go out and work as a PA, a set dresser, a shop foreman, an AD, a PSM, H/MU or any of the other dozens of film crafts and then tell us how easy it all is.
 
If acting is so easy i'd love for you to post an amazing monologue of yourself acting.
If directing is so easy I'd love for you to post an amazing short that you directed.

Otherwise I will assume that you're full of shit and talking out your ass. Please don't lead me to this assumption.
 
Ok. I'm sorry. Forgive me. I'm angry and I'm procrastinating. Yes, they are difficult jobs (I do all three) and I have to say writing is the hardest.

Let' analyze this a little further.

How many actors does it take to play a role? 1
How many directors does it take to direct a film? 1 (sometimes 2)
How many people on sound? 2-3
Cinematography? 1

How many writers to write a script? A lot of good movies have upwards of 5 writers being credited! FIVE! (that's why you don't see their names on the poster)

And TV has teams of writers working 12hours per day. A WHOLE ROOM FULL OF EGG HEADS BANGING THEIR HEADS AGAINST THE WALL TO CHURN OUT A SINGLE EPISODE.

Then comes along WILLIAM GOLDMAN and writes Maverick all by himself, and who gets all the credit? Mel Gibson

Although to be fair, TV writers do get significantly more credit than film. Chuck Lorre's name appears on every episode of 2 and a half men. And we all know who Vince Gilligan is

But still, if I had to pick one job out the entire film making process to be done by a master it would be the SCRIPT.
What would you choose? An awesome director? An awesome actor? Awesome cinematography?
 
If I had the choice I would do a mediocre project with an A list actor rather than a A-list script with a mediocre actor.


Bad acting KILLS a great script.
But a great actor can read terrible dialogue and still make it work.
Plus you can actually sell it and get an audience!

This is not a difficult decision at all!

Also a mainstream director doesn't make a film by himself.. it takes dozens and dozens of people. A lot more than 5!!
 
I will say this.. writing is my least favorite part of the process.
Feels like as much work as editing.. but at least with editing you get instant gratification.
 
Bad acting KILLS a great script.
But a great actor can read terrible dialogue and still make it work.
Plus you can actually sell it and get an audience!
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I agree, IT'LL GET YOU AN AUDIENCE. That's my point. People give all credit to films success to the actor. Humans are stupid like that.

But I'm comparing talent here. I think the writer has more talent. The problem is that a film is rarely the result of a single writer. Shawshank Redemption was based on a book by Stephen King. So who should get the credit? The screen writer or the novelist?... I guess that's why writers go largely unheard of (not Europe though, apparently. I hear they idolize writers over there. Not sure if this true)

If I had to choose between a dramatic prison movie written by an amateur but with Morgan Freeman cast. Or the Shawshank Redemption script but with an amateur actor to play the role of Red (and all others) then show the final result to an audience who had never heard of any a-list actor before, I'd bet the pro-script will keep the audience captive longer.

But in reality, people see Morgan Freeman and they automatically like the film, because it's Morgan Freeman, we've grown fond of seeing him and just being able to watch him do stuff on screen for 2hrs warms our hearts. That's just human nature - Emotional.

That being said, acting is a lot easier than writing.

I'd love to show you that monologue but I've been a little cheeky on this site and it'd be silly of me to expose myself now
 
Oh, and by the way, simple is not easy; in fact, simple is usually very difficult to accomplish. The simpler something is the more easily we can see the flaws. This is what you failed to assimilate from the interviews with actors saying it's simple; the challenge is to UNcomplicate the creative process just and let it happen.
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Alcove Audio, c'mon... Creative process? What do actors create? Seriously. They read lines. They havn't created anything. It's the writer who does all the creating. The director is the overlord and the actors are the cattle.

The actors job is to look awesome on screen. Not to create anything.
 
*removed. this guy punked me once I won't fall for it again*
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C'mon mate, grow up. Nothing wrong with a but of heated banter between filmmakers. I think it's sign that we care about what we are doing
 
I think Acting is easy once you get on set and passed the audition/callback part. Those are brutally hard. 30 seconds to impress 3-6 people in a room when 40 guys are waiting in the lobby to do the same? Callbacks when there are 2-3 of you is not as hard now but i lost a major role a couple years ago when it was between me and another dude and I heard his callback and I head the positive support he got. I then changed the way I had it in my mind to be more like him and it was a cluster. I didnt get the part and I was so mad at myself. Have a callback tomorrow and will do it the same way as I did the first time no matter what I hear. So yes and no on acting being hard.
I pay my 10 bucks to go see actors and some directors. Typically not the writers.

It's like this..When I watch my favorite sports team I give credit to the players and sometimes manager. I never think about the General Manager that built the team. That's just the way it is.
 
Fear said:
C'mon mate, grow up. Nothing wrong with a but of heated banter between filmmakers. I think it's sign that we care about what we are doing
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I love heated banter.

You ask for advice, get answers and then say "Just joking". That's not
heated banter. That's you trolling. You even said you were just trolling
us. And I take you at your word.

You want to banter. I'm in. You want to troll. I'm out. Others will take
your bait.
 
I think Acting is easy once you get on set and passed the audition/callback part. Those are brutally hard. 30 seconds to impress 3-6 people in a room when 40 guys are waiting in the lobby to do the same? Callbacks when there are 2-3 of you is not as hard now but i lost a major role a couple years ago when it was between me and another dude and I heard his callback and I head the positive support he got. I then changed the way I had it in my mind to be more like him and it was a cluster. I didnt get the part and I was so mad at myself. Have a callback tomorrow and will do it the same way as I did the first time no matter what I hear. So yes and no on acting being hard.
I pay my 10 bucks to go see actors and some directors. Typically not the writers.

It's like this..When I watch my favorite sports team I give credit to the players and sometimes manager. I never think about the General Manager that built the team. That's just the way it is.
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That's it. Like Michael Caine said "I'm not getting paid millions of dollars to act in movies. I'm getting paid millions of dollars for the 10years of work I put in to be able to act in movies".

To me it's more like Karaoke. Anyone can get up sing a classic. Maybe some can sing it better than the original. But the credit goes to the who create it.

But like I said, credit is blurry when it comes to writers. One guy writes the script and it sells then Hollywood pays 3 others to re-write it resulting in the original artist getting little recognition. Your only option is to go the Tarantino route and write/direct your own films that way you can slap your name on the front cover.
 
You want to banter. I'm in. You want to troll. I'm out. Others will take
your bait.
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Then why'd you bother to even comment on the thread?! Lol. just being a tease or what?

If you have an opinion on the topic then state it. I've obviously made a valid point that people are sharing their input in. Even if I turned around and said "huh! Trolled ya'll! Writers don't deserve shit!" That wouldn't make the thread any less legitimate.

So go on, Rik. Tell us what you think about writers not getting no cred
 
Fear said:
Then why'd you bother to even comment on the thread?!
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An excellent question.

I posted my thoughts. Later I realized who you are so I removed
my post. It won't happen again. You aren't interested in my
thoughts. But it's good that others want to play into your game.

Have fun!
 
Of course writers deserve a lot of credit. No one less than Steven Spielberg has said as much. And of course it's no surprise they are generally shat upon. But like it's been said, writers hardly make the movie. I'm fairly persuaded by the notion that it's the editors, if anyone, who deserve the lion's share of credit for a film's story.

Of course, I wouldn't be the first to say film is a collaboration. And unfortunately, it seems to be the reality that writers often get short shrifted by everyone else. But, any writer, by now, should probably know that's what they should expect from the business.

That's why I'm currently persuaded that it's probably generally better for a writer to stick to writing novels, or whatever else, if they want artistic control or credit where credit is due.

The downside of that is: do people even read for their entertainment anymore even now? Clearly some do. But how many? How many care about books anymore? And worse, how relevant will reading fiction for entertainment be in five, ten, fifteen years, and so on?

And, this is not my original idea, but perhaps it belongs to Robert McKee. I have little trouble believing that most of those rewrites make the typical screenplay better. Okay, if we start questioning whether that's true in light of the Hollywood formula mill or pandering to focus groups, well, that might not be exactly so. Or, it might be worth debating. I don't know. I guess it's complicated.

Like it's been said, when it comes to movies, yes, the writer might come up with the basis of the story. But it's all these other craftsmen and tradesmen who bring it to viewable/sellable reality.
 
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Read this advice from Bryan Singer on the film script.

What's the trick to adapting a book for the screen?

The trick is your movie is separate from that book. Do whatever it takes to make the story make sense on screen. The biggest mistake a filmmaker or screenwriter can make is to get mired down in details from the book that don't work on-screen. A film is written three times: once on the page, once on the set, and once again in the editing room. You're constantly recreating what that movie is every time you go in to work with those materials.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alex-simon/great-conversations-bryan_b_7465494.html

So, the writer, actors & director, and editors ALL write the script.
 
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