• For posts related to budget, finanace, legalities, distro, and marketing (including festivals) please post in Film Biz.
    Rule of thumb:
    Filmmaking for directors (creative)
    Film Biz for producers (buisness)

crew Why is it so difficult to find collaborators for a project?

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
I have to assume that I'm not the only one on an independent film form that wants to make an independent film. If you've ever tried making one, you know that it's nearly impossible to have any type of success without a larger group involved. My question is, why are people uninterested in joining teams or groups? As a lone individual, your fate is sealed, if 1000 of us worked together, there is no question we'd get something published. I bought a product yesterday. 12 people got together and worked full time on it for 3 years. It was great, I paid full price for it. They now have funding for the next product, and everyone is happy and headed for a profitable carreer in the industry.

Here's the clip I watched about their team and project. It's just a simple top down shooter, innovation level 0. It was great, no issues, everyone is happy.


I live in a small town, and neighborhood garage bands are common. People get together and practice for years, travelling 50 miles to a practice spot, to split up 200 dollars a gig, once they are good enough. They spend thousands each on equipment, and hundreds of hours just getting to that point, and everyone shows up for that.

If people are as passionate about making film as they say they are, why is the willingness to team up and commit so fractional in filmmaking, compared to music, which is arguably hundreds of times easier to succeed at (at least in terms of getting a set written and playing it for an audience)? Do you think it would be strange to watch 6 people collaborate and spend for years to build a lemonade stand, and then go over to a skyscraper construction forum and find everyone trying to do it solo with no money?
 
I don't have any advice about the collaborator problem, as I'm currently suffering from the opposite (I can't seem to accept the help I'm being offered). I will however offer solidarity on a couple of your other grievances. People telling you to get into crypto for one, Yeah I get that a lot myself. I'm like, HEY, I like my money in my pocket, not in the sky hanging on by a wish & a prayer.

As for watching others with resources squandering them off, I've walked down that mental road before. I've personally watched several deep pocketed people throw money into a rapper (who barely could or even wanted to rap) just because they figured his "looks" would get a lot of people paid. I saw another guy blow his $70,000 inheritance in a coke, green and sex fueled bad summer, or good depending on who you ask.

I've read this entire thread and I think you suffer from the same thing one of my genius friends (mensa confirmed) as well as a couple of HIS friends suffer from: The illogic doesn't make sense. One of the things that make high intelligence people who they are is the fact that they see patterns others tend to miss, and they do it quickly. Erratic behaviors of emotionally or stimuli controlled can make for hard to spot patterns, or no pattern at all. Which can make a heavy thinker crazy. The thing is, smart people can be burdened by the illogical nature of people who are lead by emotions and stimuli. Example, the above mentioned questionably talented rapper-guy (logical conclusion) who several people were spending money due to liking (emotion) his looks (visual stimuli) can be rather vexing to a logical person who believes in linear concepts such as: Talent is rewarded, skill = money, no work no eat and so on.

My advice to you, ignore the incongruous nature of society and focus on you and your own work as best you can. it'll do wonders for you, trust me.
 
Last edited:
Paper money is hanging on by a wish and a reserve bank!
I definitely agree, especially with the politically precarious nature of the US dollar. That's another discussion for another forum I'm sure.
To be clear, I do have a few modest dollars tied up in crypto. However, It's NOT a hail-mary ripple don't fail me now amount. It's just enough to get a better than good working capitol should the jackpot hit. That's the nebulous future, though. Today, I'm still playing the fiat US dollar game for now.
 
Last edited:

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
I don't have any advice about the collaborator problem, as I'm currently suffering from the opposite (I can't seem to accept the help I'm being offered). I will however offer solidarity on a couple of your other grievances. People telling you to get into crypto for one, Yeah I get that a lot myself. I'm like, HEY, I like my money in my pocket, not in the sky hanging on by a wish & a prayer.

As for watching others with resources squandering them off, I've walked down that mental road before. I've personally watched several deep pocketed people throw money into a rapper (who barely could or even wanted to rap) just because they figured his "looks" would get a lot of people paid. I saw another guy blow his $70,000 inheritance in a coke, green and sex fueled bad summer, or good depending on who you ask.

I've read this entire thread and I think you suffer from the same thing one of my genius friends (mensa confirmed) as well as a couple of HIS friends suffer from: The illogic doesn't make sense. One of the things that make high intelligence people who they are is the fact that they see patterns others tend to miss, and they do it quickly. The thing is, smart people can be burdened by the illogical nature of people who are lead by emotions and stimuli. Example, the above mentioned questionably talented rapper-guy (logical conclusion) who several people were spending money due to liking (emotion) his looks (visual stimuli) can be rather vexing to a logical person who believes in linear concepts such as: Talent is rewarded, skill = money, no work no eat and so on.

My advice to you, ignore the incongruous nature of society and focus on you and your own work as best you can. it'll do wonders for you, trust me.
That's a pretty good reply. I rant a lot, because the illogical nature of the world does indeed grate on me, but I essentially agree with you. You have to disengage with the randomness and create your own path to reason. The thing that bothers me is those patterns you mentioned. I see them everywhere, all the time. It's the ratios. It's not just a few talented people being marginalized and a few untalented people being given carte blanche. It's now almost a landslide of idiocy. A few years back we gave almost 500 million dollars in a single year to a guy who had difficulty using twitter. That's perhaps 500 genius level people who could have made a medical breakthrough, or created a compelling work of artistry, or provided some kind of actual advancement to the world, marginalized to pave the road for a halfwit who literally got tens of thousands of people killed by constantly broadcasting insanely bad medical advice during a pandemic. DJ Khalid barely knows how to use an mp3 player, and cannot sing, play an instrument, or write, but he's a millionaire music star, and I dated a cellist from Yale who told me about her dreams of buying a used car someday. She practices cello in a converted barn her parents rebuilt for her. My dad was an aerospace engineer for NASA, I met a guy who inherited some pigs, that guy made more selling off the pigs than my dad made in his entire life, that guys life skills included wearing a Mets hat, snorting coke, and "wanting to be a rapper someday". These anecdotes are endless, it's basically been the story of my entire life, watching the bottom 10% of my high school class get promoted for being "relatable" It's on every level across the entire reality. You know that AI that I discussed developing? The Turing test capable music engine that started making millions of dollars? It got sidelined by a group of frat guys with more money, in favor of....... a "download manager" which they didn't even write. They watched pirates of silicon valley, bought a program from an actual programmer that didn't have enough money to start a company, and then added spyware to it. Then they advertised it as a program you could install to make your internet speed higher (for those that don't understand the issue here, that's like saying I could sell you a rubber ring to put on your faucet so it would "have more water in it"). To encapsulate, idiots used money they were handed by other idiots to sideline multiple geniuses, then used the opportunity to lie to other idiots, who then paid them astronomical sums to accomplish nothing. They are still wealthy to this day. Anyone with an IQ north of 120 just didn't "fit in" and were then underfunded into guaranteed failure situations, which were later used to retroactively justify the lack of opportunity. (see, I was right to make that guy live month to month, he never even bought one skyscraper with the money he didn't have, but my frat brother that inherited 10 million dollars bought a skyscraper, proving that he is an important businessman that deserves more opportunities) I could cite so many examples. Sorry to be so negative, I doubt it does anyone any good, except perhaps there are other creative people out there being marginalized, and they can read this and at least know they aren't the only ones this happens to. I think at the end of the day, you have to try your best to defy the odds and become an exception to the rules of a society you don't agree with. I apologize for the ranting, it's just a reaction to the frustration of dealing with a world that doesn't always make a lot of sense. Maybe someday I can afford to attend one of Mike Lindells "cyber symposiums" and can learn how to use my computer from a crack addict millionaire who "invented a pillow"
 
There's a saying, ignorance is bliss. Those words ring true as rain. Because sometimes one's eyes can be too wide and all the world's craziness comes through brighter than sol. I used to fret and fume over the seemingly endless (personally perceived) injustices of the world and the unfairness within it. The unrequited love, the unrewarded (again, self perceived) greatness of artistic contribution. This was before I learned to separate my ego from things....well, sorta. Here are a few things that helped me out of those dark times.

Perception is reality, but context helps.
We see the rappers these days with the luxury cars and the mansions. We see the social media influencers taking pictures from private planes. However, you should know that it's actually not that difficult nor expensive to rent a luxury car. There's also a guy from Russia who makes a living booking social media influencers and rappers to take pictures in his private airplane set. Even people aren't renting cars or private jet sets to shoot in, they're using "credit" and going into debt trying to "look the part". There's even videos out there explaining this.


Point is, just because someone has a platform, doesn't mean they're saying accurate or even good information. So you also have to factor that in when you're attempting to keep your personal peace and finding your creative muse. Yes, it sucks watching those we personally feel are squandering resources you and I could probably use to move mountains. However, best thing we can do is make miracles happen with the resources available. This is where the true talent and genius rises to the top and separates itself from corporate manufactured drivel and filler.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, it sounds like modern film/video production--or at least that which involves animation is way more complex than is modern music production. I would guess the animation itself is the most time consuming. I suppose there are now visual templates that make the process easier.

I'm from the old school. Even though I utilize electronic instruments to create my music, I strive for each song to sound as realistic as possible such that few can tell it isn't several people playing the several instruments/parts on each song.

Again, I wouldn't be able to afford to pay three or four musicians, $250 each for each of ten songs (totaling $10,000), an engineer whatever they charge and the mix and master people whatever they charge for each album.

That's why there are still so many indie bands chasing the increasingly elusive record deal. If any of them realized it is now much less expensive and much more straight forward to do it all yourself, they would all realize what they should have been doing as soon as they started writing music. But because most musicians specialize in one or two instruments and don't care to learn anything else, the dream of the increasingly elusive record deal continues to exist . . .

Being a studio musician/producer at heart, I was never chasing a record deal. I left the stage because I didn't enjoy being there. If I chased anything, it was retirement from full-time teaching. I finally caught up to retirement, so I can now focus on writing and recording music full-time, whether or not I ever break even on what I have spent on equipment. Actually, I am still afloat on that front considering what I made performing years ago.

Now, if I have to start purchasing my own video equipment (which wouldn't surprise me), that may change.

I would rather find these "like minded people" you refer to, so that I can produce my first music video. That is the main reason I am here . . .
 
Last edited:
Yeah, it sounds like modern film/video production--or at least that which involves animation is way more complex than is modern music production. I would guess the animation itself is the most time consuming. I suppose there are now visual templates that make the process easier.

I'm from the old school. Even though I utilize electronic instruments to create my music, I strive for each song to sound as realistic as possible such that few can tell it isn't several people playing the several instruments/parts on each song.

Again, I wouldn't be able to afford to pay three or four musicians, $250 each for each of ten songs (totaling $10,000), an engineer whatever they charge and the mix and master people whatever they charge for each album.

That's why there are still so many indie bands chasing the increasingly elusive record deal. If any of them realized it is now much less expensive and much more straight forward to do it all yourself, they would all realize what they should have been doing as soon as they started writing music. But because most musicians specialize in one or two instruments and don't care to learn anything else, the dream of the increasingly elusive record deal continues to exist . . .

Being a studio musician/producer at heart, I was never chasing a record deal. I left the stage because I didn't enjoy being there. If I chased anything, it was retirement from full-time teaching. I finally caught up to retirement, so I can now focus on writing and recording music full-time, whether or not I ever break even on what I have spent on equipment. Actually, I am still afloat on that front considering what I made performing years ago.

Now if I have to start purchasing my own video equipment (which wouldn't surprise me), that may change.

I would rather find these "like minded people" you refer to, so that I can produce my first music video. That is the main reason I am here . . .
Not sure what the quote etiquette is here so pardon me if I quoted too much of your post. Anyway, are people really still chasing record deals in 2021? That sounds so crazy to me. Last I checked, major labels were struggling due to the snakey tactic of trying to sneak 360 deals on artist.

It's interesting you bring up music however, because in a way it helps me offer advice in this thread. These days, I use my music sales and ASCAP checks (my hobby) to fund my filmmaking ventures (my Passion).

Problem is the above mentioned: music is my hobby, but it was once my passion. It was in fact my first passion. I created enough content over those years to be able to create a pretty decent cash cow. (Example: leasing out songs and getting them placed elsewhere).

But yeah, the heck with getting signed in 2021, 2022 and beyond in regards to music.
 
MarQii, I must assume you either have friends or relatives in the music business, grew up near a major music center or went to music school? The reason I ask this is that most musicians--especially those who grew up in the middle of nowhere have no clue there are ways to make money making music other than touring for a major label. I, on the other hand am aware of other avenues. Also, as mentioned in another post, most musicians love being on stage. It sounds as though what you do and what you did in the past had nothing to do with the stage? Glad you have experienced the type of success you sought.
 
Last edited:
You see my point? You were born into connections.
Wow. I fell right into that one. Lol. I see what you're saying. You're also correct in your comment about music equipment and video equipment. Here's the thing though, when you said you composed all of your pieces of music yourself, Trent rezner (sp) immediately came to mind.

That's another thing about 2021, with the variable super scale down of studio infrastructure, it pretty much makes the entry barrier into music very small. These days, all you need is a laptop, a focusrite (no endorsement) and a ton of daw software to create industry competitive product.

With newer iPhones, the bar for video production entry is getting lower as well. I'm not quite sure if filmmaking will become as doable as music production, but it's looking like things are heading that way.
 
@Nate North All in all, I realize you're facing some pretty steep obstacles, mainly being location and family obligation. The latter makes you in my opinion a good person, because I know 1 person who would quickly leave his parents in the lurch if he were you. I'm thankful that I can say that I ONLY know ONE like that (quality over quantity applies to friendship, too).

If I were YOU however, I would double down on reaching out to people, with my first priority being to find a strong pitch person. Because in my experience, a successful creative company has the "art" people as well as the "money" people. Art people are terrible money people in my experience, because usually the better they are the less they care about money. Money people on the other hand are s**t as creative people. Even worse when they're in power (ie: creative control). You can see evidence of this by the fact that most successful AAA video games look exactly like each other. Because money people chase the bottom line, graphs, figures, pie charts, key demographics and so on.

Second thing I would do is find others with good skill, reach out to them and make personal visits. Your parents, well I would set it up to where I could take a weekend to travel. Do your parents have friends? Maybe swallow your disgust of being surrounded by your "inferiors" and use them as a weekend lifeline for your parents while you travel on business, perhaps?

P.s.: I've taken some time to check out your project, the art stands out to me. I've yet to take the software on a run but I will get to that.

I'm sure you've done your homework so you probably already know what I'm about to say already, money makes things efficient, but it doesn't guarantee success. For example, let's say I have a couple of billion dollars in the bank. With that money I'm sure I can at the very least get a sit down with the "people representing" the rock, John Cena, Robert Downey Jr and Henry Cavill. But seeing as I'm only MarQii BenJii, the head of a 5 person production company (on it's best day), I could still get a polite no due to my name strength, despite having the theoretical billions

The point of that? Build your name and product up and the connections will chase you
 
Last edited:

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
"@Nate North All in all, I realize you're facing some pretty steep obstacles, mainly being location and family obligation. The latter makes you in my opinion a good person, because I know 1 person who would quickly leave his parents in the lurch if he were you. I'm thankful that I can say that I ONLY know ONE like that (quality over quantity applies to friendship, too)."

I don't think you can win by being a s@#t person. I mean, obviously you can win, but then you're just a POS standing there with a trophy. That in my mind does not constitute a win. I could have easily manufactured fame and fortune if I abandoned ethics, but to me that's a pyrrhic victory. I try to always remember what the original goal was, and for me, stepping on other people to get to the top was never part of that vision. I lived in Mountain View for about a decade, and there were good people and bad, but the worst ones had no idea that they were bad, they were just happy and exited at their own genius every time they cooked up another extended warranty or shop at home jewelry channel to cheat faceless throngs of consumers out of their limited resources.

Logistically, the world favors the sociopathic personality. You can make it much farther telling people what they want to hear and cashing checks than you can being truthful. As I said before though, selling integrity for money is a bad trade. I think it's a much better trade for people who never had any integrity to begin with. That ratio works out.

If I were YOU however, I would double down on reaching out to people, with my first priority being to find a strong pitch person. Because in my experience, a successful creative company has the "art" people as well as the "money" people. Art people are terrible money people in my experience, because usually the better they are the less they care about money. Money people on the other hand are s**t as creative people. Even worse when they're in power (ie: creative control). You can see evidence of this by the fact that most successful AAA video games look exactly like each other. Because money people chase the bottom line, graphs, figures, pie charts, key demographics and so on.

I agree with all of that, and I do search, but like so many segments of this overall campaign, I'm the only one dedicated enough to do the work, especially sans salary. Sweat equity is normal, but in 2021, people won't even show up for a job they want, such as game designer or filmmaker. A large combination of factors that I won't get into here have created a situation where rewards are dubious for about 99% of the people, and about 1% can fail upward. Capitalism has probably seen better days. I feel we are trending strongly towards establishing an American caste system, and I suspect it will come wrapped in a flag, and labeled as the height of patriotism. I don't see some huge conspiracy, just a systemic snowballing Pareto distribution. It's all pretty logical, the more resources you have, the more efficient you can become. The more wealth you have, the easier it is to diversify investment, making that wealth more stable. The larger and more stable that resource base, the higher likelihood that activity X is never going to eat into the principle.

That said, anyone interested in taking on that role is welcome to talk to me about it. I agree with you about how art and business people work. I just wish I met smarter business people. Sure, using your analytics correctly takes some wit, but they can show a staggering lack of imagination at times, as you mentioned. Is it so hard to factor originality into the equation Ubisoft? Yes open world shooters sold well, but how new was the idea when you gathered those statistics? I could get into the peter principle, and other aspects, but explaining why I meet so many incompetent middle management types is a whole other conversation. A perceptual disagreement that I have with money people is that having money is in and of itself a "skill" People here in the Midwest tell me trump is a great businessman, better than anyone. I try to explain it to them. If you give me 20 dollars and I double it, I'm a good businessman. If you give another guy 4000 dollars and he looses 90% of it, he is a terrible businessman. But he has 400 dollars. They think that he is 10x the businessman I am, because he has 10x the money. I would say I am 20x the businessman he is, because he turned 100% into 10% and I took 100% and turned it into 200% which is 20x 10%. There was a kid in Chicago that started a hot dog stand on 100 bucks and ended up with 70k in 2 years. That 10 year old is a far better businessman that a guy who got promoted to leader of the free world based on his "business success" It was one of the first things they told me when I arrived in silicon valley to set up shop. "Don't be intimidated when you meet a millionaire, that's just a guy that was handed 2 million dollars and lost half of it."

Second thing I would do is find others with good skill, reach out to them and make personal visits. Your parents, well I would set it up to where I could take a weekend to travel. Do your parents have friends? Maybe swallow your disgust of being surrounded by your "inferiors" and use them as a weekend lifeline for your parents while you travel on business, perhaps?

I know this is intended as helpful, but it's not very practical for me. I do appreciate the attempt anyway. One issue is that the cross-index of specialized skills combined with free time, enthusiasm, and certain personality traits lends itself to a global approach, rather than a US only approach. When I was building that first AI, I learned a great deal about large scale filtering operations. Let's say I have a million people that wanted to help me. and 1% of those had the free time to help. that's 10k people. Now what if I cross index that with base level talent, and find out only 5% have that. Now I'm down to 500 people. Now it's time to find out how many of them can get along, use an advanced CGI workflow, etc. You end up with an incredibly small number of people. Take a look at this forum. It's the no 1 indie film forum on the internet. It's worldwide. Sometimes I show up here, or one of my crew, and we find we are the only person on the entire site.

About me and my aloof perceptions of the people around me. It's not as universal as some have made it out to be. In the Silicon Valley, I found a lot of peers and I didn't say these things that make me sound like a condescending #$%#$ now. Here in BFE I'm a multiplatform researcher and developer in the midst of what looks like the cast of He Haw. You can judge me if you like, but this place is not filled with great minds. I've now managed to gather up a decent little team of international creatives, composers, programmers, finance specialists, artists, etc. I like and respect each one of them, and have nothing negative to say about them. I intend to mentor them, but just as often they end up teaching me things. So seeing people as inferior is "context driven" if you take my meaning. I added a new collaborator recently (from this forum) who writes me letters so intelligent I really have to break a sweat to keep up with him. On the practical level, I can't let a bunch of drunk hillbillies watch my Alzheimer's effected mother and make sure she doesn't leave the stove on and die in a fire. It's a real concern. Things like that take constant vigilance.

P.s.: I've taken some time to check out your project, the art stands out to me. I've yet to take the software on a run but I will get to that.

I'm sure you've done your homework so you probably already know what I'm about to say already, money makes things efficient, but it doesn't guarantee success. For example, let's say I have a couple of billion dollars in the bank. With that money I'm sure I can at the very least get a sit down with the "people representing" the rock, John Cena, Robert Downey Jr and Henry Cavill. But seeing as I'm only MarQii BenJii, the head of a 5 person production company (on it's best day), I could still get a polite no due to my name strength, despite having the theoretical billions

The point of that? Build your name and product up and the connections will chase you

Thanks for taking the time to check out our project, It's still early in development, but coming along pretty well in some areas. I agree with most of what you are saying there, and understood this from day one. I complain about money not because I think it's the solution to everything, but because I actually don't need nearly as much to succeed as others. This thing is 95% intelligent design, and 5% spending. But we can't get that 5%, because a guy that throws a football NEEDS 30 million dollars a year to accomplish that. I'm running a team of a half dozen active members, maybe 20 total extended staff, on $9 a day. That's not a misprint. Nobody can buy a video card, because that pathetic sum goes to overhead like web domain, software services, stock assets, etc. We could do more with 200k a year than I've seen people do with 10 million, but not a dime of support, ever. I watched a redneck buy a 55k dollar truck the other day. That's more money than every person on my team has been paid in a year. combined, including the side jobs they work on to free up enough time to put in 20 hours a week or so on Save Point. Conversely, and in seeming disagreement with what I just said, I could make this a success with brute force, but only because I'm quite efficient at leveraging it. Our first recruiting ad was terrible, I had a 25 dollar ad budget. I got 3 interns. It I had the kind of money a hillbilly spends on a 3rd redundant pickup truck he saw in a country music video, I'd have and army of developers by now. Honestly I'm thinking of selling everything I own and just self funding this to a small degree, because by ratio, it's always been a very successful idea, it's just so badly underfunded that I'm an ant carrying a leaf, and a leaf isn't worth much. I go to kickstarter, and find that you can't raise money without already having it. I go to get free workers, and can't pay to connect with them efficiently. I go to patreon, and I need a finished product before I can raise money. Build up my name? I'm an expert digital marketer, with no budget. I can get massive results on the cheap, and I can't afford the cheap.

And before anyone starts in on the expert marketer thing, I don't mean I'm a great presenter of ideas, I just mean I can use a digital advertising budget very effectively. Virtually every campaign I've ever worked on has yielded better than average results. Even that terrible first ad I made for Save Point returned almost 4x the national average in clickthrough. I had a 25 dollar ad budget. I had finally saved up enough money to run one ad campaign for 500 dollars, and days before launch, a problem materialized out of nowhere that costs 500 dollars to solve. That just gets me back to square one, after months of work.
 
Last edited:

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
The frustration comes from the fact that I do know how to make this work, and I could likely build this thing up on the cheap. You would be amazed at what I could accomplish with 5 grand a month. This thing would likely already be working if I had the resources 1 person spends on one car. This thing is intended to be a global product serving millions over a decade. If we actually pulled it off, the profits could become astronomical as advantages compounded.
 
Love this thread and this conversation in general because each generation deals with it and ultimately learns the hard lesson. You are lucky to have a voice. You are lucky to get your work completed. You are lucky to get your work seen by more than 50 people. It's such a delicate art form, film is, and I think many people learn along the way it really is more about community and kindness rather than "do this for/with me now."
 

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
Love this thread and this conversation in general because each generation deals with it and ultimately learns the hard lesson. You are lucky to have a voice. You are lucky to get your work completed. You are lucky to get your work seen by more than 50 people. It's such a delicate art form, film is, and I think many people learn along the way it really is more about community and kindness rather than "do this for/with me now."
I think it's a hard part of growing up to learn to accept that getting life right needs to be it's own reward. That's the true path. Being a worthwhile person whether it's profitable or not. Sometimes it feels like the world rewards in inverted ways, but I was thinking about it. Yesterday a guy posted a movie poster here, monochromatic garbage that literally had the word "teensploitation" printed on the cover. At first I got angry, and the kneejerk was, look at this guy, making terrible wasteoid garbage with enough funding to finish his film while I enter month 7 with 0 dollars in support, less than a teenager makes in an afternoon on YouTube. But then I looked at the amount of help and interest I'd gotten in this thread, 1 response to his, and that was me making fun of him to amuse myself, something approaching 6000 views on this thread. Then I thought, maybe I'm perceiving this whole thing wrong. Money is a major problem for me, so I think I see it in the distortion of a Mercator projection, but looking at those numbers, I can tell people in general are a lot more interested in something ambitious or philanthropically minded than they are in trash, and I have to say that's reassuring, even if it doesn't come with the financial help I need.
 

Nate North

Business Member
indieBIZ
It has recently come to my attention via another post that certain forum members have had to resort to their imagination in picturing what I looked like. I never bothered to post any photos, because I didn't find it relevant, but having seen the horrifying fruits of said imagination, I feel compelled to set the record straight. So after 6000 views, and hundreds of comments, here is what I look like, in case anyone else was forming some terrifying mental picture of a one armed man with fangs and an eyepatch, or perhaps a discount store kim jong un.

Experience the terror of my true visage!!!

 
Top