When is the best time to try to make a deal with a distributor?

[Ardeus]

I'm working on a doc series and I finished the 1st chapter. It will take me 4-5 months to complete the series.

I am submitting the 1st chapter to film festivals and I already got positive answers from 4 small festivals. I am still waiting for replies from some bigger ones, but I think that the odds for any award are low.

I received a contact from a distributor and I was wondering if it's best to wait a few more months until I got more participations in festivals and the series is complete.

My original plan was to put some extra value on the films through festival participation and only then try to find distribution deals.

Maybe I am wrong and I should try to go ahead and try to find a distributor rigt now?

 

[AudioPostExpert]

So far everything I've done has been targeted to the internet.
Although soon I will embark on a short film targeted toward legit festivals.

There are no tech specs for most internet self distribution (Youtube, Vimeo and the like) and most smaller film festivals also have little or no tech audio specs. So providing your dialogue is at least fairly clearly audible you'll probably get by. I'm talking here about commercial distributor/broadcaster requirements.

G

 

[sfoster]

There are no tech specs for most internet self distribution (Youtube, Vimeo and the like) and most smaller film festivals also have little or no tech audio specs. So providing your dialogue is at least fairly clearly audible you'll probably get by. I'm talking here about commercial distributor/broadcaster requirements.

G

I won't be aiming for a small festival.. I'm trying to make a masterpiece
by legit festivals.. I'm referring to top tier .. odds are against me but life is short and the story is there

 

[directorik]

The competition is so great that it seems foolish to even think
about the subject of presenting a movie that isn't up to the
needed standards. I'm reading more than just a bit of hubris in
some of the responses; the thought that the story is so good
someone else will put up the hundreds of thousands needed to
bring it up to the needed standards.

Maybe that happened 15/20 years ago for one or two movies.
But I think that's not a realistic expectation.

 

[Ardeus]

In a way, this discussion may be helpful as a reality check and in providing information regarding a serious aproach to producing for broadcast, but I am glad I didn't have it before.

At the very least I would have entered the project with much less confidence and if I had entered this path of digging into the broadcast requirements, I am not sure I would have decided to go ahead with the project.

I would have been able to comply with a few of the requirements, but not all.

The odds of micro budget productions making any money is tiny to start with, but if you then read something like the bbc technical requirements... The tiny seems close to impossible.

I am used to do everything in a film: writing, filming, editing, 3d animation, music, etc. That's the reason I love filmmaking, it allows me to use all this stuff in one single activity, with a single purpose: to tell a story. It's great fun.

This series is the 2nd part of a trilogy. I couldn't make any money with the first series and although the odds for this one are better, it will probably end up on youtube after the festival season is over.

And I must confess the following: if I go into production of the third part of the trilogy, I think I won't care about broadcasting standards.

I just don't believe that having complied with broadcasting requirements will affect the level of enjoyment the viewer has when watching the films in the place where 99.9% of these micro-budget films get finally to be seen: youtube.

 

[AudioPostExpert]

1. The odds of micro budget productions making any money is tiny to start with, but if you then read something like the bbc technical requirements... The tiny seems close to impossible.

2. I am used to do everything in a film: writing, filming, editing, 3d animation, music, etc. That's the reason I love filmmaking, it allows me to use all this stuff in one single activity, with a single purpose: to tell a story. It's great fun.

3. And I must confess the following: if I go into production of the third part of the trilogy, I think I won't care about broadcasting standards.

4. I just don't believe that having complied with broadcasting requirements will affect the level of enjoyment the viewer has when watching the films in the place where 99.9% of these micro-budget films get finally to be seen: youtube.

1. Actually, from an audio perspective, the BBC's technical specifications are quite straight forward compared to some of the major broadcasters: 5.1 mix, LoRo stereo mixdown and undipped M&E 5.1. Although of course meeting the tech specs is just the first step of passing QC and the BBC has pretty high standards.

2. You said your goal was to make a doco and get into some film festivals. You've done all the work yourself, achieved your goals and had fun, well done! As a professional though, IE., selling commercial products, you would have to change your approach, to meet the demands and requirements of the market. That means you won't be able to do it all yourself, you'll need to employ various professionals who have the knowledge and equipment to meet those demands.

3. It seems to me that like a lot of amateur filmmakers, what you really want is to make money in the commercial market but remain essentially an amateur filmmaker. Unfortunately, the business doesn't work that way, if you want to play in the commercial broadcast market then you have no choice but to meet commercial broadcast standards. It sounds to me that you enjoy all the aspects of being an amateur filmmaker, so why would you want to change?

4. Broadcast standards don't exist just to make it difficult for film/program makers! They exist (and have evolved) precisely for the reason of helping to meet viewer enjoyment expectations, given the limitations of the media and the need to be profitable. Whether you believe that or not is up to you of course. That doesn't mean to say that one can't enjoy content on Youtube which doesn't meet commercial technical standards, sometimes it's charm is that it's completely amateur, but in the vast majority of narrative cases the level of enjoyment would by definition be affected/improved.

I'm referring to top tier [festivals].. odds are against me but life is short and the story is there

Even if you meet their tech specs, the odds are still very much against you but if you don't meet their tech specs, there are no odds (!) as it's guaranteed you won't get screened.

G

 

[Ardeus]

I see this more and more as an expensive hobby, given the chances of making any money in micro-budget films, unless you don't use your own funds at all.

When I see friends that have projects of turning their hobbies into a business I always fear for them, because loving too much an activity makes it difficult to be objective and pragmatic and often leads to failure.

The same is even more likely to happen with people that love making films and I guess that you're looking at me the same way I look at my friends when they tell me their projects.

On the other side, there's that old saying "every old sock meets an old shoe"...

Just recently, I decided to submit the first film of the first series to a few film festivals. It's a 25 minutes film with high narcoleptic potencial with a single fish inside an aquarium. A small film festival chose it as one of the 3 films that will be on their loop reel during the gala dinner.

There's always hope that things may still work out, that there will be someone in the broadcasting business that will see your work with same enthusiasm you do. In my case, I would of course do my best to comply with whatever standards they request. But I'm not going through that trouble before it's really needed.

Complying with all the technical requirements of broadcasters implies a great deal of research and money. I question the advise of complying with all that when maybe less than 0.1% of the films will ever be considered for broadcasting, regardless if they comply with those standards or not.

 

[GuerrillaAngel]

I see this more and more as an expensive hobby

Ding!

 

[Sweetie]

I question the advise of complying with all that when maybe less than 0.1% of the films will ever be considered for broadcasting, regardless if they comply with those standards or not.

Or is it that only 0.1% of films get considered for broadcasting due to most fail to comply with the required standards? What comes first? Or is it the producers/filmmakers who don't consider the needs of their customers are doomed to fail anyway?

loving too much an activity makes it difficult to be objective and pragmatic and often leads to failure.

I think it's a people thing. Those who lack objectivity often lead to failure. Those who lack passion usually don't get their work to a point where they can be successful.... You may have differing experiences.

 

[Ardeus]

Yes. Disregarding customers is the key to failure in any business.

Mixing business, passion and art and try to make them work together is a difficult job, even when there's lots of people editing each others ideas.

I found a video where a guy talks for a while about statistics concerning Sundance. He says that of all the selected films, 20% get some kind of distribution. Of those, only a small percentage brake even.

I wonder how many of the films selected for Sundance comply with broadcasting requirements.

I believe that a compromise solution may be to try to prevent situations that are unfixable later if the need arises to comply with broadcasting requirements. It should be easy to pinpoint a dozen things to take into account before starting and that don't involve spending loads of money.

 

[Sweetie]

Yes. Disregarding customers is the key to failure in any business.

Sometimes the trick is to know who your customer is. As a filmmaker, unless you are self distributing, the distributor is your main customer. Just food for thought.

It should be easy to pinpoint a dozen things to take into account before starting and that don't involve spending loads of money.

Spending loads of money is subjective. You can make deals to reduce the cost, but the real trick is to know what you need in advance so you only get the work that you need done and be able to take advantage of efficiencies of having a well designed work flow. The best way to do that is to know your final requirements (and your options for distribution) and work best towards that.

 

[Ardeus]

When I started working on this series I had no idea that there would be so much work just after the 1st chapter was completed in order to try be among the 0.001% of films that make money.

This thread as made me revise my priorities.

I decided that my main goal is to have the series finished.

To do so, I can't spend so much time and effort on marketing and trying to find my way through distribution. I'll do just a few things that I identified that have the highest chances to bring some return, but I won't do everything I can, not even a fraction.

I love making films, but this is a hobby and a wonderful way of integrating all kind of arts a technologies into a single project... and that's it.

I noticed that as soon as I started submitting the films to festivals, frustration started to get its foot into my life (and I'm talking with my belly full because I already managed to get into a few festivals).

It got much worse when I had to look deeper into all that I had to do in order to get into distribution.

Why the hell would I decide to fill such a wonderful experience (making a film about something I love) with frustration and obstacles?

I gave an interview some time ago and I was asked who was my target audience. I quickly answered "my self" and laughed before continuing with a more serious answer. I shouldn't have laughed and I shouldn't have added anything beyond "my self".

And of course, I want some recognition. That may come from film festivals (that most likely I can't attend because they are too far) and most importantly from web forums that are interested in this subject, facebook and youtube comments. I decided that's more than enough to make me happy.

If more happens, I would be even happier, but I am not willing to go the extra mile for that at the cost of turning a great, marvelous experience into a frustrating one.