The difficulties of shooting a film...

DanielRutterFilms

DanielRutterFilms

I know I don't need to remind anyone hear the many problems and things that could go wrong within a shoot.

As some of you know, I'm only an ametuer film maker... with no professional experience. I'm looking to take a leap from the ametuer status over to the coveted "Intermediate Indie" status... but I've run into problems regarding my project, and I'm deadly afraid I'll lose interest and not see it through.

Now, to explain this... I need to drag off subject. I'm a big fan of what is known as "Guerilla filmmaking"... most of my short films were done this way, and I never bothered with permissions or anything like that. I figured that when I was ready for the leap, I'd do it.

So, now that I feel ready... I've approached the local council to seek approval for use of two locations in my town for a two day shoot. No fees have been charged, but they refuse to say anything unless I have $20 million dollars Public Liability Insurance. What... the... hell? WHERE AM I GONNA GET THAT?!?!?! My film has a budget of less than 2000 bucks (of which filming equipment is to be purchased with)... I'm not backed by any studio (or anyone else for that matter) here! So I'm left with the big question... Should I still go through with it? I want to make this film. I can make it WITH or WITHOUT council approval, but I run a great deal of risk. Shooting "Guerilla" style seems so much easier, I don't have to wait around for someone to read/approve my claim... and I can get this thing into Post and into the festivals.
But, this leaves me out in the cold with my original intentions. Do it professionally, red tape and all... and *hopefully* get noticed... both by other Directors, and even those offering grants to the best of the best.

While this isn't the only issue hindering my project (Police approval, waiting on actors to get back to me.. etc), it's a bigg'un... and I'm very much deterred.

Sorry if this seems more of a rant than something that the forumers can discuss... Also, apologies for my spelling.
 
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indietalk said:
Hey hey hey, who says indie is intermediate between amateur and pro?! ;)
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I didn't mean it like that. Indie isn't a "status" as opposed to an ametuer Indie Film maker or a Professional Indie Film Maker.

What I was basically trying to say, was that I wanted to take the next step UP... away from the AMETUER status.
Sorry... considering I was born and raised in an English speaking country, my understanding of the language is sometimes... warped.
 
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I was just kidding around. If you want to move from amateur, it's really all about getting organized. As a director you have to get rid of the belief that you can do everything on set, and be able to delegate power effectively. A well oiled crew, that shows up on time, and an AD that keeps everyone on schedule and the shoot day moving along.

If you have some funds, and a screenplay, the best way to do this is pick a date for shooting, put it on the calendar, and start your pre-production. Procrastination (or self-doubt) is the real killer.
 
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indietalk said:
Hey hey hey, who says indie is intermediate between amateur and pro?!
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I've actually published saying that on Clive's 1000 dollar film site :P I also delineated that indie and indy (independant) are separate entities mostly dealing with budget.

I say he's bumping into the issues that you encounter when moving past the "Guerilla" filmmaking stage.

My best advice is that you stick to private property with indemnity forms for your cast/crew and for the location as well saying if something happens you won't sue them and that if you do something to their property, you're liable for damages.

On private property, you're outside the purview of the legal system (unless you're actually killing people). The other option is to call around to the towns near you and ask what their regulations are pertaining to your shoot and location permissions. Some small towns have no policy in place, which makes it free and clear for you as a tax paying citizen of the country :) (Rash Assumption that this will apply down under as well as state side).

Good Luck!
 
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Sorry, I didn't read the whole post. Let me address one issue.

$20,000,000 of insurance coverage doesn't cost 20 mil, that's the coverage. Did you price it?
 
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A well oiled crew, that shows up on time, and an AD that keeps everyone on schedule and the shoot day moving along.
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See. That was another issue... I'm the only one on crew. I AM the director, the AD, the editor, the financier.... etc. It's just me behind the camera... and my actors in front (hopefully). I'm litterally doing the "one man film crew"...

$20,000,000 of insurance coverage doesn't cost 20 mil, that's the coverage. Did you price it?
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I've been making a few phonecalls and waiting to hear back...
At first when they told me I needed $20mill of cover, I was like... "ITS A SMALL F*CKING BUDGET! I don't have a spare $20mill just sitting around. But then I realised that its like getting car, house or goods insurance... you pay a fee, get the benefit (and maybe get ripped off in the process)...
 
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DanielRutterFilms said:
See. That was another issue... I'm the only one on crew. I AM the director, the AD, the editor, the financier.... etc. It's just me behind the camera... and my actors in front (hopefully). I'm litterally doing the "one man film crew"...
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A one man crew is cool, but it will start to show as your films get bigger, that only one person was doing everything. Eventually it will become impossible. A hired crew would be part of your graduation of status plan.
 
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Thanks; I've checked that out, sent them an email... and now will wait (patiently) for reply.

I guess the question I should ask you guys is:
Stick with "Guerilla shoots" or attempt the not-so-beaten track of professionalism?
 
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DanielRutterFilms said:
Thanks; I've checked that out, sent them an email... and now will wait (patiently) for reply.

I guess the question I should ask you guys is:
Stick with "Guerilla shoots" or attempt the not-so-beaten track of professionalism?
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It seems like you want to increase professionalism, so stay within your means and get a little more pro with each shoot. In other words, each shoot, break one less law :lol:
(As the site owner I must add that I do not condone breaking any laws ;) )
 
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What are your locations? Unfortunately, one of the big steps toward being more professional does involve insurance... I've run into this about 4 times with my current project, my first attempt at a feature. Howevers, i think that indie is totally right, professional is much more about the organization then anything else...

It sounds like you are worried about what will happen during post red tape wise, I would worry more about getting caught while in production. You can always use the "Well I talked to someone in your office and they said it was okay..." excuse to stay un-arrested, but you will probably have to move and unless you have a plan b that you can execute instantly your cast and crew is going to be pissed and lose confidence in you. Alsoes, if you have a lot of violence/violent props like guns and you don't have permission to be where you are you can end up in a lot of trouble. Like, police having "shoot if you don't comply" orders type of trouble.

That being said, I shoot exterior locations in my city all the time without permission and I've never gotten in trouble. It all depends on how much attention you think you are going to draw to yourself.

Also, don't be discouraged!! indie film is i known for nothing if not inconvenient set backs, and annoying restrictions. It's all part of the fun and glamour of having no money. Do your best to work with it and use what resources you do have to their maximum capability. It's much better to be the person with no budget, no insurance and guerilla tactics making an awesome movie then it is to be the person with $10,000 from their parents making a terrible senior film project.
 
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What are your locations?
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The towns main park. They're very proud of this park, and seem to think I'll destroy it. Although... all effect I'm doing are digital, and I'm not even shooting action scenes in this area.
The other location is the plaza, in the main street. I don't have any photos with me, but it's basically a well-lit area in the centre of town where I'd pictured the scene as I was writing it.

It sounds like you are worried about what will happen during post red tape wise
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I'm a little worried about that. If I go Guerilla, the council can sue me.... and thats not a good thing for a director to have to his name. Besides that, I want to respect the law.


Alsoes, if you have a lot of violence/violent props like guns...
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As the movie is somewhat of an "action/drama"... there will be guns involved. But, that being said... they're only toys, all effects are digital (muzzle flash, sound effects). There's no disturbance in the town, with gunshots going off. Although... I really don't want to be arrested for walking around town with what could be classed as a "replica pistol"...



Also, don't be discouraged!!
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I do try not to be. I love making films, and I want to move up and work with people who KNOW what they've gotta do. Like actors... I hated working with the actors I had for my experimental films. They had no acting experience, and when they realised they had "speaking" roles... well that just scared them. Besides... they were kids, so it was really hard to have kids portraying violence and being taken seriously.

Thanks for the lengthy reply.
 
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If nothing else you should have some one to handle the sound and boom mic for you; one of the hallmarks of amateur filmmaking is poor sound.

You have to learn to be flexible; a large portion of your frustration is that you are absolutely locked onto those specific locations. Be creative and look for alternatives - that's your job!

An option for your location woes could be green screen.
 
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DanielRutterFilms said:
As the movie is somewhat of an "action/drama"... there will be guns involved. But, that being said... they're only toys,
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A panicked parent nearby can have the fuzz on you in minutes, if the coppers aren't aware of going on...

...and at twenty feet a "toy" gun can look as just as realistic as you want - with an appropriate response.

Don't do it, without authorities being clued in.

There's several threads on the forums, from experiences with this. Some even linked images of the newspapers they ended up in, when arrested. :lol:

It doesn't matter if your effects are all post - running about with what appears to be a weapon is just bad news, especially if you are dodging trying to work with local authorities.
 
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with non-firing prop guns, I always notify the police (non-emergency number) 1/2 hour before they come out and invite an officer to come inspect them... then another call when they are being put away.

I have all of the pertinent laws and local regs printed out and in my AD's binder and have modified my airsoft guns to be unable to fire anything (pressure pin removed and back of barrel blocked)... I prove their lack of function by firing the gun into my palm when the officer arrives, which they have - and given their blessing to our productions, with good luck stamped all over them for the competitions they've been for.

The guns also only go to the specific actor who will be using them and don't get waved around when we are between takes.

Go for no laws broken and switch locations if you need to.
 
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I wish I could legally use airsoft in Australia... They're cheap, and realistic. And theres a wide range of guns out there. Sadly, I'm stuck with toys.
I always intended to inform the cops of the use of weaponry, but I'm unsure of how to approach them. Any ideas? the last thing I want is for them to confiscate my guns after all the time I spent trying to find them.
 
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