Mumblecore

NickClapper said:
I'm afraid we're going to disagree again :P

Mumblecore is totally about the look. There's a reason why almost all the films that I've seen by people on this forum couldn't be bracketed as mumblecore. They're trying to put across a story with limited resources, but it doesn't turn out as mumblecore. Mumblecore as a movement may have started as a way to do something different with low budget movies, but you look at the resources and backing the Duplass brothers get nowadays and then ask yourself why they are still producing things in the same style they had when they actually had limited resources.

I'm firmly off the impression in film that if you can categorise a group of films into any technique then that technique is deliberate. And, I would emphasise, I have nothing against some mumblecore films, but it is a very easy thing to get wrong.
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The Duplass Bros. are not making mumblecore anymore.
 
After hearing all sorts of hype in forty different directions I ignored all of it and watched "Puffy Chair." My own reaction was "not bad, worth watching once."

All the hype was due to its minimal budget and inexperienced cast and crew achieving something watch-able. It's kind of like back in the early days of rap and techno or even the garage bands of the 60's - some people taking the technological cast-offs of the "professionals", pushing the traditional boundaries and creating something unique. What immediately comes to mind is that most were on-hit wonders.

Oh, Cracker - "Puffy Chair" did, in fact have audio post/sound design; and the guys/gal who did it have some respectable credits.
 
Camcorder. Script. Actors.
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Puffy Chair camera was, as spinner says, a Panasonic AG-DVX 100, hardly a camcorder.

Mumblecore films traditionally only have a very loose script, if one at all, and the rest is improvised.

Mumblecore films, again 'traditionally', don't use professional actors but try to exploit real life sentiments.

I think what you're describing is any sort of low budget indie filmmaking, rather than mumblecore specifically.
 
ROC said:
So what would a film like "he's just not that into you" be considered?

It's not low budget (from the actors it seems like they spent a fortune plus the advertising)

And how about Valentine's Day in that same vein?

Would those still be considered "mumblecore"?
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No.
 
Cracker Funk From The Other Thread said:
Okay, here's what I like about mumblecore -- it bridges the gap between the Haves and the Have Nots. A movie like "Puffy Chair" proves that ANYBODY can do it.

I have about as basic a setup as anyone on this forum would want -- a T2i, a Rode NTG2 and a Zoom H4n (audio equipment borrowed). That's a really inexpensive setup. However, it's inexpensive to me, because I'm a professional bartender. It's inexpensive to the vast majority of the people on this forum, most of whom have full-time "day jobs".

It's not even slightly inexpensive to that snot-nosed kid in the inner-city, or that rural small-town, or that trailer park. That kid who loves watching movies and dreams of making them some day. But his dream is a pie in the sky, because he finds it ever so difficult to muster the money needed to get even this basic setup.

To that kid, I present "Puffy Chair". You don't need expensive equipment to tell a good story. All you need is a passion for filmmaking, a desire to learn the craft, a cheap camera, and a solid story.
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How is this somehow new? :huh:

I do not understand your POV on this, CrackerFunk.

Edit: You own more sound gear than I do, btw. :)
 
spinner said:
For the record:



Cheap is relative in this field. But be that as it may, it means that if you want to be a filmmaker, you will use the equipment at your disposal, at least to get started.



This film was shot on a PRO-sumer camera, a Panasonic AG-DVX 100. At the time, it was a $2500 camera. I know, I have one. It ain't a camcorder.




Anyone with a "boom operator" has audio gear of some kind. The DVX with a good professional microphone will give you good audio. There are two ways of controling the light coming into a DVX. I use ambient light all the time, but I use the neutral density, iris and white balance like crazy. That's why the lighting doesn't suck.



So, okay, this guy gets the "Kevin Smith" award for that year. But even Smith doesn't make films like that anymore. And I would bet this guy doesn't either. Call it whatever you want, its still indie filmmaking. Many people -- myself included -- call it 'guerilla filmmaking'. The audio was good because he must have worked with it during the editing process. Did I mention the DVX has meters on it to set your levels? And I would bet he didn't use iMovie to edit this.

It's just indie filmmaking, dude. We're all doing it....:yes:


...and yeah, I thought mumblecore was some form of Emo I hadn't heard about...:D

-- spinner :cool:
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Is it "just indie filmmaking"? Cuz I don't see anyone on this forum doing it. How many of you have grabbed your camera, with nothing else, and made a freaking feature film? Nobody. Hell, even I got an external audio recorder. And some lights. No, he just put a camcorder in front of his actors, and pressed "record".

Yes, it's indie filmmaking, but it's indie filmmaking with a different bent, a different emphasis, a different methodology. Why is Duplass the only one of us to break the ranks, with nothing more than camcorder? (BTW -- according to the manufacturers, even multi-thousand-dollar cameras are still "camcorders").
 
Wow! What a response!

To me, mumblecore means you have a no-budget, largely improvised film without professional actors that tends to be mainly about relationships. You could also throw in the idea that the characters tend to grow in small ways rather than making big life changes.

I can see both sides of the issue when it comes to Zen and CF's discussion. But I would argue that mumblecore is simply a type of indie rather than a rebranding of the entire indie industry. I see a lot of indie films that don't fit the mumblecore ideals, but every mumblecore film I've seen fits the indie ideals.
 
Zensteve said:
It's called "rebranding"
:secret:
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:lol:

Okay, I'm about to watch that movie you suggested to me. As a tit-for-tat, can I strongly suggest "Puffy Chair"? Alcove actually gave the movie a very fair review. It's not a great movie, but enjoyable. And for that, I think it's quite remarkable that it was shot with NOTHING. Crew? Hahaha! The crew is the dude holding the camera. Seriously, just watch it -- it's ultra-low-budget indie filmmaking to the extreme, and yet, somehow good (probably because it's talky, half-improvised, and relationship-driven, the hallmarks of mumblecore).



P.S. That was fun. I enjoy a good debate with people who are cool with good debates. I've had too many go sour, and this kind of exchange of ideas is what I appreciate. Also, well-said, Nick.
 
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I'm sorry, I just don't see the difference.

I have worked with two different people over the last two months doing what this mumblecore is supposed to be. I'm not impressed that mumblecore has to be a feature, as per:

How many of you have grabbed your camera, with nothing else, and made a freaking feature film? Nobody.
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Big deal. That is what most people are trying to do. I am starting with shorts because you learn on shorts. And your description of mumblecore is how I do it.

But I know the extent of your argument can't be that they have a finished full length feature, but this is the ONLY difference I see. Also, I saw The Puffy Chair. (shrug). I suppose '"Primer" is "mumblecore"? What about "Once"....?

By the way, if your film is talky, there's a problem with the script. And before you say Woody Allen, the script has to move the film along. If it is just talky, that's a bad film. Is there a genre called Crapcore?:D

...by the way 2: El Mariachi was made -- Rodriguez says -- on a budget of $7000. And I thought alot of it was on 3/4? The blow-up for theatres was paid for by the Weinsteins....I think....where is that book.....?

-- spinner :cool:
 
I don't know how you can compare "Primer" or "Once" to "Puffy Chair". The difference in production value is extremely marked, in that the former two have it, and the latter has literally none. "Puffy Chair" is literally a person with a camera. There is no comparison, budget-wise.

And it's not a question of making a full-length feature that makes it remarkeable. It's that people actually want to watch it. That's never happened before.
 
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