How should I start?

A

Aspiring Mogul

I have no experience in film making, though I have a large amount of professional and business experience, but I am interesting in making movies.

So how should I start? I am thinking of doing a few shorts every so often, to build up my experience and also to see if this is what I really want to do. I can upload those shorts onto Youtube or an internet channel, but where do I show the shorts in movie theatres? Is there even a microscopic market for short films? If so, then that would be really, really great.
 
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Starting shorts is a good idea in my opinion. Ive been writing and shooting shorts for a couple years now and it's a lot of fun and gets a lot of experience! What I would recommend is to try and experiment with different shooting styles for each short you make. Get a feel for what you like and continue from there! :)

-WGC
 
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There's not really a market for short films. But short films is definitely the way to get started. This craft takes a lot of practice.

Learn the basics, and start doing it!

Also, I highly recommend the 48 Hour Film Project. It's a great way to meet other filmmakers, and a lot of fun.
 
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Aspiring Mogul said:
How short should my shorts be?
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There's Filminute: The International One-Minute Film Festival and several other one-minute-film festivals.

22 minutes or so is a sit-com.

About 43 minutes is a network drama.

Most film festivals want shorts between five and ten minutes - they can squeeze more shorts into the program, so there are more people in the seats.


You'll get LOTS of argument over the above.



Do whatever your story requires. But keep in mind a film isn't just dialog or action. B-roll can establish volumes about the story and the characters - a picture is worth a thousand words isn't just a cliché. Sound has the same power to inform your audience - and the characters. The same applies to set design, wardrobe, hair/MU and, of course, lighting has a huge influence over all of those. It's the myriad of little details that most newb filmmakers ignore, both in front of the camera and behind the camera.
 
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Then you really don’t need to make short films at all. You need a
script you truly believe in and that should be a feature. You need
to hire a producer with some experience and connections. You then
work with that producer and bring on a production manager with
connections and experience to generate a budget you can live with.
Then you and the producer hire a director and you allow them to
hire the production team and the actors.

There is no money to be made in short films. You have never seen
a short film in a theater. You have never paid to watch a short film.
You are just like everyone else.

Now if you want to produce a few short film just to see if exec
production is something you want do, then that's fine. And you
need to to exactly the same thing. Find a script you love and then
hire the people to make it. Or hire a writer to write a script from
your story and then hire the people to make the movie.
 
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directorik said:
Now if you want to produce a few short film just to see if exec
production is something you want do, then that's fine.
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That's the reason - the other is to get experience, but, as you say, I don't need to do that. But, even as an exec producer, I still have to know how it works, and, maybe build up a set of short scenes for my feature. And, as for doing a feature, I'm not sure I can get funding off the bat. I was hoping that, if I did a series of shorts, I can approach financiers at a film market and get them to fund the real thing.

Maybe I should talk to a producer or two, to see who would want to work with me.
 
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Seems you already have the answer to your question.

Exec produce a series of shorts and use them to get financing
for a feature. That's how you should start.
 
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directorik said:
Seems you already have the answer to your question.

Exec produce a series of shorts and use them to get financing
for a feature. That's how you should start.
Click to expand...

You think I should NOT produce the shorts and just get a producer to ante up the money? That would be great, but I'm not sure I know how to do that. How do I get a producer to provide me with the money???

That said, the essence of writing is re-writing, and, as you know, Walt Disney went through many, many versions of Snow White before he settled on his masterpiece. So perhaps a series of shorts, reworking the idea, would be better for me, since I've never held a camera in my life.
 
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In another thread on here before, some have mentioned that a good producer is one with experience in making movies, cause then they know how to hire good director and crew, and know what to look for, and what to get for their film. So maybe getting experience is still good, for a producer as well?
 
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There basically two types of producers.

An executive producer is usually a person representing a financial investor in a film project.

A line producer is a hands-on role which controls the day-to-day financial and production concerns and is there to support the vision of the director during production.

There are various other flavors of producers who support executive and line producers.

Do you want to be a money guy or a get-your-hands-dirty from concept to delivery guy? At the indie level you can combine both roles.

It may sound a bit crazy, but I would still recommend getting on to a few projects as a PA or gofer, and/or as an extra - nothing huge, just a couple of low/micro budget shorts, possibly a feature if you have the time. You learn a lot from being on a set and being involved during post. You don't have to be an expert and know how to do everything, but you should understand the process, what all the jobs/crafts are, their needs and how they interact. This way, when your director asks for something you at least speak the language to a degree and you have a basic understanding of why s/he needs it.

I work with a producer on a regular basis who did just that. I met her when she was a 1st AD. She is incredibly detail oriented. I love working with her, as does everyone else. The thing she does best is to make sure that everyone has complete communications and involvement, that everyone is well fed, and that everyone at least gets transportation money. We all work very hard for her because she's looking out for us, and we have a great deal of fun; that goes a long way to insuring a good film.
 
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Aspiring Mogul said:
You think I should NOT produce the shorts and just get a producer to ante up the money? That would be great, but I'm not sure I know how to do that. How do I get a producer to provide me with the money???
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Quite the opposite. I think you SHOULD produce the shorts. This
seems to be what you very much want to do and you should follow
your plan.

There is a common misunderstanding that the "producer" provides
the money. The Executive Producer is the person providing the money;
either personally or is the person who puts the investors together.
The "Producer" is the person who runs the day to day operation of the
production. The Producer is paid - they earn a salary for doing their
job like the writer or the director or the DP. They do not provide the
executive producer the money to make a movie.

If you want to be the producer and have someone else finance the
short films then you need to do pretty much what I have already mentioned;
You need to find a script (or find a writer to write a script) and hire a director
who will then hire the actors and the crew - with your input, of course, after
all you (the producer) will be the boss.
 
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That's why I was thinking of doing a few shorts, to know people in the business and get some experience. Thing is, I already have a business, which is doing well, and I'm not going to trade it for another trade which may pay less.

But, Directorik, if I don't do shorts, and I have no experience in the film business, do I just go to a financier with a script and a proposed film crew and ask for a million dollars???
 
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Aspiring Mogul said:
But, Directorik, if I don't do shorts, and I have no experience in the film business, do I just go to a financier with a script and a proposed film crew and ask for a million dollars???
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That's exactly what you do.

As executive producer.

You find a great script, you put together a team of talented, experienced
people (producer, director, DP, editor, composer) and shop it around to
people with money. That's what an execProducer does. No filmmaking
experience needed. Lot's of experience in business needed.

Or you can make several short films.
Or you can work as a PA on several movies and work your way up.

There are many paths to making a movie. The several short films way is
one of them. And I know it's one you feel is a good one. You should do it!

Who knows? You could put together a team and make one, excellent short
film and that could attract investors to put up money for a feature. It's
happened in the past and it will happen again.
 
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Without divulging any prying details, in your current profession, does the industry have a fairly regulated and formal route to ascend to your current position?
Do you have professional peers that have achieved the same position through differing routes?

The film industry has almost no practical regulation whatsoever.
By hook or by crook, aside from releases, copyrights and taxes, if you can get marketable product produced then that's all you really need.

Regarding myself and the film biz, I'm more interested at some point in eventually running a studio rather than being a director. If I'm not mistaken, I think that kinda puts the two of us in nearly the same boat.
And like you, I'm not cutting my put-food-on-the-table job in order to pursue this high fiscal risk endeavor. That'd be just retarded on an epic scale.

My approach is to cultivate a working knowledge of pretty much all the jobs I'd be asking people to perform below me (that way I won't be asking for the ridiculous and impossible) and to have a fairly good handle on all the jobs above me.

So, now I've finished learning how to write a basic spec screenplay (shorts, of course), have a fair handle on what professionals expect from those, and am now learning fundamental camera operation and things that go into costs to actually produce a short from the spec screenplays.
From having now been briefly on the filmmaking side of the spec screenplay I can better craft one with some practical sensibilities because, honestly, spending anything more than vacation money on a short is just wasteful. There's no return on them other than self-education and experience - which are both invaluable towards eventually transposing those skill sets onto feature filmmaking.
I (facetiously) love reading pie-in-the-sky short spec screenplays with zero regard for costs vs. return.
Pfft. Ha!

Now, at some point I'll start hassling other people to start working with me and I'm quite sure I'll experience all the ridiculousness I see Harmonica, MDM, USSinners and everyone else around here seems to shoal up upon, but... eh... that's business.
Surely with your own food-on-the-table job you know what happens when you post a open position:
- 300 people come to fill out an application
- 200 people actually submit resumes
- 50 people have any business worth calling back
- 20 of those will commit to an interview
- 10 will show up for the interview
- 2 maybe 3 are not fruitcakes in real life.
- and the one candidate that you offer the job only works for two weeks before quitting.
- sigh.

I suspect putting together a "professional" film crew will be much the same.


Time to start screening projects.
Break down costs.
Tweak product to market.
Find cast and crew yourself or assign to a line producer.
Find financing and distribution as executive producer.
Supervise the whole sausage making process from a productive distance.

At least, I think that's how it'll go. ;)
 
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Without divulging any prying details, in your current profession, does the industry have a fairly regulated and formal route to ascend to your current position?
Do you have professional peers that have achieved the same position through differing routes?
Click to expand...

My profession is pretty traditional, with a handful of routes. But most people go to college, get training, get licensed, and start working. I own my firm, which is doing well, but, the more busy I am, the less time I have to learn a new skill.


Regarding myself and the film biz, I'm more interested at some point in eventually running a studio rather than being a director. If I'm not mistaken, I think that kinda puts the two of us in nearly the same boat.
Click to expand...

I am also not interested in being a director, so we are in the same boat.


From having now been briefly on the filmmaking side of the spec screenplay I can better craft one with some practical sensibilities because, honestly, spending anything more than vacation money on a short is just wasteful. There's no return on them other than self-education and experience - which are both invaluable towards eventually transposing those skill sets onto feature filmmaking.
Click to expand...

I was going to spend money on shorts, to get experience, and maybe the contacts to approach someone to fund a feature film.

That said, recently, I am taught to be conservative, and not to go into anything without experience and training. I was very nervous recently about trying something new, but everyone assured me it was easy. Then, when I did it, I realized they were right, and I was like a little kid, wanting to do it again and again.

Maybe Directorik is correct - perhaps I should try his approach, because I do have business experience and substantial knowledge. But I should hook up with a senior producer who can act as a mentor. Any one out there knows someone who wants to guide me?
 
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