How do you know if a script is good before purchasing it?

[harmonica44]

I wanted to purchase a feature length script to produce and direct myself, and have been looking around, but so far, I haven't found a script that really pops out. How do other filmmakers tell which scripts are worth making, compared to not, if they just have one shot?

Also, just because you think it's good or bad, does not mean other audiences would. So how does one go about accessing it? Do you just say I like it, let's buy it, and make a movie, and that's it? Especially because it can be hard to get good feedback from many people, in such a small window you have to buy the script, before anyone else does. Does anyone have any advice?

Thanks .

 

[WalterB]

LOL!

H44 has been struggeling for 3 years.
Sfoster puts on his cape and fixes it in 10 minutes...

 

[FilmmakerJ]

LOL!

H44 has been struggeling for 3 years.
Sfoster puts on his cape and fixes it in 10 minutes...

Some things certain people just can't do. And there are those who know enough to do something in 10 minutes or less.

But even so, I would think after 3 years one would at least give something they're struggling with some practice and concerted effort. You learn how to do just about everything eventually. The only way you don't learn is by claiming that you can't and then you don't try.

 

[WalterB]

Some things certain people just can't do. And there are those who know enough to do something in 10 minutes or less.

But even so, I would think after 3 years one would at least give something they're struggling with some practice and concerted effort. You learn how to do just about everything eventually. The only way you don't learn is by claiming that you can't and then you don't try.

You'll find out how this could be the case soon enough...

 

[AudioPostExpert]

I was just told my short before had really bad sound ... I wanted to get someone good before the next one, so I could make the next one worth showing off, without hurting my reputation.

What, you mean you didn't realise on your own that it had bad sound?? Regardless of how much budget you have, how are you going to direct whoever you hire to do your sound if you can't even tell good from bad?

Instead of worrying about your reputation, you should be practising and learning how to direct because you are never going to get a good reputation as a director unless you can actually direct! Why is it so hard for you to understand this?

Once I find one that literally blows my mind, I would feel confident with that one, cause you want your first feature to be really good to sell obviously. I guess it's just a matter of reading and waiting for that mindblower.

Why would you feel confident that your first feature would be good enough to sell when you don't even know how to direct a short yet? Waiting for that mind blowing script is going to benefit you how?

G

 

[harmonica44]

I knew it had bad sound to begin with, I just accepted it. Alright I will give another crack at casting and crewing a short. However, when they ask what I have done before, and I don't have anything with good sound or production value to show them, what can I do to persuade them to join me since I don't have past shorts worthy of showing them when they ask?

 

[AudioPostExpert]

I knew it had bad sound to begin with, I just accepted it.

Knowing it had bad sound is only the first step, didn't you read what I wrote? The next step is being able to identify why it's bad and the step after that is being able to direct your audio post person/s to create what you think is good sound!

However, when they ask what I have done before, and I don't have anything with good sound or production value to show them, what can I do to persuade them to join me since I don't have past shorts worthy of showing them when they ask?

No idea, you're going to have to work that out for yourself, but what's your alternative? Plan A, buy a mind blowing script (which you can't find), sink thousands more into hiring some pros and ending up with a film that looks like it had a fraction of the budget it actually had because you didn't know how to direct the pros you hired?

G

 

[WalterB]

I knew it had bad sound to begin with, I just accepted it. Alright I will give another crack at casting and crewing a short. However, when they ask what I have done before, and I don't have anything with good sound or production value to show them, what can I do to persuade them to join me since I don't have past shorts worthy of showing them when they ask?

Well, you made that one, right?
Just be honest: you're still learning, you know the sound isn't bad, show you know why and why it won't happen again. And be bold: dare to ask!
This is why it is a good idea to start with something really short: it's less of an investment for the cast and crew: so their 'risk' is smaller and your risk as well. Short or long films: they both need you to do your best, but if something is not perfect on something very short, it feels like less of a waste of time.

You have no past short, because you always feel like you need to impress with a feature out of nothing, while almost nobody ever did that.
Remember your first drawing?
Your first writings?
Your first steps?

Make something short.
A parody on a commercial, a mood film, a short little sketch, a shoot out, a fake trailer about a boring movie, whatever, but please make something short that you can actually chew.

(Fake trailer about a boring movie, just making it up as I write:

"In a world where everybody is always busy.
Always showing of their adventures on facebook.
There is one man, who does nothing."
Man just sits in his garden under an umbrella.

Group of people comes by:
"Hey man, we're going to the pub, care to join us?"

Man: "No, thanks"

It's raining: people are running (jogging for fun).
Man sits in the garden under the umbrella.

Sun is shining.
Two sexy girls with a broken down car, right in front of his garden.
"Could you give us a ride?"
"Nah, sorry."

"LAZY. Not coming to your cinema, because nothing happens."

Door of the restroom. Sounds of flushing.
"Well, almost nothing.")

My apologies for the not-formatting: got no time for that...

 

[sfoster]

Some things certain people just can't do. And there are those who know enough to do something in 10 minutes or less.

It's weird isn't it? Like holding a boom pole.
Literally you just need to point a microphone at the base of their throat.

But I've had 3 people try to help me out and somehow none of them can accomplish this mind numbingly simple task. I'll look and the microphone is pointed somewhere else entirely. It's mind boggling that they don't have the "talent" to point something in a direction.

h44 (re: pm) at the 26 mark, I took a sound of the dude folding paper from the next scene and I added it in so there is more paper folding noises before the visual transition.

If your audio transitions exactly at the same time as the visuals it is not smooth. This is one of the very first things I ever learned editing my own stuff, perhaps you have missed it because you relied on an audio engineer and denied yourself the learning experience firsthand.

 

[FilmmakerJ]

It's weird isn't it? Like holding a boom pole.
Literally you just need to point a microphone at the base of their throat.

But I've had 3 people try to help me out and somehow none of them can accomplish this mind numbingly simple task. I'll look and the microphone is pointed somewhere else entirely. It's mind boggling that they don't have the "talent" to point something in a direction.

Well I wasn't really meaning something that simple, lol. But you're totally right.

If your audio transitions exactly at the same time as the visuals it is not smooth. This is one of the very first things I ever learned editing my own stuff, perhaps you have missed it because you relied on an audio engineer and denied yourself the learning experience firsthand.

It's about hiding the cut.

Even when changing scenes or locations, you have to allow each cut to flow organically, unless a particular transition or cut calls for something more jarring.

 

[harmonica44]

Okay thanks. I see what you mean. I can try to take a peace if the sound, of him opening the file and put it there before. How do I make it sound different though, like it's coming from the next room, rather than it being the exact same sound?

And yes I do not mind doing a 1 page script, but I think everyone else does. One thing I have noticed from helping other people with their projects is that cast and crew seem to be more interested in doing longer scripts. One guy I helped with his feature, was able to get actors and crew to travel in from all over. He only payed for their transportation and food, he didn't pay them actual rates and they worked for free otherwise. However, I don't think they would have traveled from all over to do a 1 page script.

Not that I need actors and crew to travel in from out of town necessarily, I am just saying that perhaps the reason why people are not interested in the sad girl idea, is because it's a 1 page script with not enough going on in it, to perhaps satisfy them. The short film I made way before there, was 11 pages, and I got a lot more cast and crew auditioning for that back then, compared to the sad girl script, which is pretty much no one. Is it because maybe people just aren't interested in the story and like longer projects?

 

[FilmmakerJ]

Okay thanks. I see what you mean. I can try to take a peace if the sound, of him opening the file and put it there before. How do I make it sound different though, like it's coming from the next room, rather than it being the exact same sound?

~APE can give you a better explanation. But I would say you first have to deafen the sound by experimenting with the clip's EQ. This effect can be found in different place depending on what program you use. But it almost always shows up as a series of 5 or 10 or 20 vertical bars that affect different frequencies in your overall sound. And so your task, in this case, would be to turn down the higher frequencies on the right side of the EQ window, and mess around with the ones in the middle to sort of soften the sound.

Then, depending on where this other room is, you might need to shift the sound from appearing in both speakers to appearing more in the right or the left, but not all the way. You just shift it so that it is slightly softer in one speaker, and slightly louder in the other. And the more you shift this, the farther right or farther left a sound appears to be.

You might also want to add a small hollow reverb if the sound is coming from another room down the hall, so that it feels as if it is bouncing off the walls in that hallway towards the mic that was on set. In this case, "hollow" would mean that you make the reverb less wet I think. There's actually a slider that calls itself "Wet" or "Wetness," which I believe refers to how piercing and ringing the reverb appears.

And yes I do not mind doing a 1 page script, but I think everyone else does. One thing I have noticed from helping other people with their projects is that cast and crew seem to be more interested in doing longer scripts. One guy I helped with his feature, was able to get actors and crew to travel in from all over. He only payed for their transportation and food, he didn't pay them actual rates and they worked for free otherwise. However, I don't think they would have traveled from all over to do a 1 page script.

Not that I need actors and crew to travel in from out of town necessarily, I am just saying that perhaps the reason why people are not interested in the sad girl idea, is because it's a 1 page script with not enough going on in it, to perhaps satisfy them. The short film I made way before there, was 11 pages, and I got a lot more cast and crew auditioning for that back then, compared to the sad girl script, which is pretty much no one. Is it because maybe people just aren't interested in the story and like longer projects?

How long would a 1 page script really be? 1 minute, 2 minutes tops?

The reason why actors wouldn't mind committing to a feature-length film for no pay and room-and-board + travel, is because it is a multiple week-long shoot. They have more that they can contribute, they will likely get a lot more screen time, and they will have more to work with and work off of based upon their dialogue, their directions, and the story's twists and turns.

Getting anyone to work on a 1 page script, however creative it may be, is never going to be easy, because who wants to be involved with a 1 minute project, unless it's a commercial? A 1 page script can still take a lot out of you and a lot of time and commitment depending upon it's demands. But ultimately it's such a small result in the end that it doesn't seem as worth it to get involved with because you might only appear in the film for a few seconds.

A much better thing to do might be to create 3 to 4 1-page scripts, shoot them all in a row with a group of actors who rotate within each, some are used, some aren't for each, and then you are then able to edit multiple micro-short films that allows these actors to portray multiple characters that expands their experience and repertoire.

I don't know if that's the best solution for your issue, but it seems like a pretty cool idea someone ought to try. It would give you a brand new filmography in pretty short order and it would allow you to experiment a lot more. But each 1 page script would have to be pretty darn clever and have like a twist or a punch line to make them effective and memorable.

 

[WalterB]

It could be the idea, the script, to who you present it, the way you present it or the way you present yourself.
I personally I never heard someone say: 'no, it's too short.'

Post your casting call for that idea in here and let's see what it communicates.

PS.
I made several 1 to 2 minute shorts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_le1-C1_a4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMvutwXb2Rg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbBgh-Fwg8w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4LAm7WgwRo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4y9WeLP0rY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2Ob2XCeoME

Some people did drive 4 hours to be part of it.
Team (cast and crew) size varied from 3 to 16.
Amongst them are experienced professionals who act or work as crew for a living, but also aspiring actors/actresses with mostly modeling experience and some friends who liked to help out on set.
Most of them were shot in 1 day (except for the one with the lightsabers: the second half was shot on the next day).

So my experience is that 1 minute or 2 minutes is not a problem as long as you can present a cool idea in a good way.
(Besides that: I never communicate "it's a 1 or 2 or 3 page script", I communicate the idea, the mood, the desired endresult and if the script is already finished while casting, I'll send it to the people who are interested.)

Getting people to commit to multiple days or weeks of shooting without pay requires not just a good script, but also a great portfolio that ensures people you know what you are doing. And that is H44 position now: he needs to build that portfolio first by starting simpler and shorter.
Actually: it has been his position for the past 4 years.

 

[sfoster]

Okay thanks. I see what you mean. I can try to take a peace if the sound, of him opening the file and put it there before. How do I make it sound different though, like it's coming from the next room, rather than it being the exact same sound?

i didn't make it sound different at all. I just put it there to smooth out the transition and it worked. With what I did you won't have actors declining to be in your production just because of the sound.

 

[harmonica44]

It sounds like it's coming from further away though in one shot, then it's closer in the next shot. You didn't do that?

 

[sfoster]

This is what I did - I chopped out ambient parts of your sound track, then I layered and faded them appropriately.

I used no new sound I just cut and pasted what you already had.

Now the transitions are smooth instead of jarring.

You can see here that i faded it in over time, so it started off quieter. That's probably why it sounds further away at the start.

When you fade in new audio tracks it helps a lot to make it sound smooth and continuous.

 

[harmonica44]

Okay thanks. As long as others do not notice that it's a fade, and it sounds natural.

 

[WalterB]

When you listen to music, do you noticed all the fades?
Or do you just hear the music?
I recorded and mixed a few songs my self, believe me: the faders just keep on moving
And in sound for film there is a lot of fading going on....

Stop obsessing in such a way.
If you only think tht 'the audience' will try to catch you on something, you'll never finish anything.

 

[harmonica44]

I notice it in music, but in music that's normal to me. During regular dialogue scenes, to have sound fade of a noise that is coming from the room, may seem unnatural, depending on the circumstances.

 

[sfoster]

There is an expression "Don't let perfect get in the way of good"

 

[WalterB]

....................depending on the circumstances.

THIS!

Depending on circumstances is the rule of all rules!

You discard an option before seeing/hearing it in context, because you make silly rules and out of context assumptions based on theory you don't really understand, while the filmmaking thing is about context and circumstances.
As long as you only look for problems, you will only find problems.