from shorts to features

sfoster

sfoster

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how do you make the leap as a director of short films to directing a feature length one, with dvd sales on amazon and netflix?

i'm still new to this, but i figure if i can make a couple awesome shorts then my work would inspire confidence and open new doors somehow. seems nearly impossible getting anyone to watch your stuff though
 
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sfoster said:
how do you make the leap as a director of short films to directing a feature length one, with dvd sales on amazon and netflix?

i'm still new to this, but i figure if i can make a couple awesome shorts then my work would inspire confidence and open new doors somehow. seems nearly impossible getting anyone to watch your stuff though
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You figure correctly. Many directors have gotten feature jobs based
on a couple of awesome short films.

As examples look up "Peluca", "Within The Woods", "Bottle Rocket",
"Saw", "Six Shooter" and "The Dirk Diggler Story". Those directors
did it. I don't see why you can't.

You know that it's not easy and success happens rarely - but it does
happen.Showing that you have what it takes by making a couple
awesome shorts is a great path to take. When do you finish your first
awesome short?
 
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directorik said:
You figure correctly. Many directors have gotten feature jobs based
on a couple of awesome short films.

As examples look up "Peluca", "Within The Woods", "Bottle Rocket",
"Saw", "Six Shooter" and "The Dirk Diggler Story". Those directors
did it. I don't see why you can't.

You know that it's not easy and success happens rarely - but it does
happen.Showing that you have what it takes by making a couple
awesome shorts is a great path to take. When do you finish your first
awesome short?
Click to expand...

I've seen Bottle Rocket and Saw, didn't know they started as short films.
Great to know I don't have my head completely in the clouds.

So far all I've done was this funny documentary remix, I think it's fantastic but I couldn't even get my friends to watch it haha.
"The Dance of Seduction"

I'm nearly ready to work with real actors on a 3 minute short!
I have the storyboard finished, locations and actors in mind, but I still need to figure out how to record the dialogue and add a musical score. So much red tape, audio is a whole can of worms I only began looking at this past week.

My first short is a comedy of social faux pas, entitled "Disturbed World Problems"

Second short is a crime thriller, about 20 minutes in length but the script is really rough and so I doubt it would be ready for production anytime this year.
 
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How?

I'm sure you know the answer already.

Write great stories with great characters and interesting dialogue. Get very talented actors. Shot it exquisitely well. All of these are hard to achieve but do-able.

Win some awards and/or generate buzz for your work, agents and work will hopefully come knocking on your door. You may get some Ad work first, or low/moderate budget indie. Obviously you need a degree of luck too, or make your own luck by querying agents, ad agencies etc - making them aware of your work.

To justify a Hollywood budget (avg $60m+) you need a solid body of work behind you and/or high-level contacts and luck too.

Neill Blomkamp's another great example. His $100m+ Elysium will be hitting theaters soon.

District 9 was his big break. He got it via some luck and an amazing short/sample that he shoot that was similar in look and feel to District 9. I saw it a few years back - was set in South Africa too, had a robotic type thing, knocking over an armored car etc. Neill was a visual effects whizz who had a talent for directing.

A producer and Peter Jackson spotted his talent. I think they wanted him to help with Halo but that didn't work out so they managed to get funding to expand his short/sample into a movie - that movie became the box office hit District 9.

IMDB - District 9
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1136608/?ref_=sr_1

The director (Carl Rinsch) of the soon to be released Keanu Reeves samurai epic 47 Ronin is another great example...

...his previous work ... 3 shorts!!!!

47 Ronin
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1335975/

In relation to screenwriting (if you write your own material?), these articles will help you:

How to Write Great Dialogue
http://reelauthors.com/script-analysis-coverage/how-to-write-great-dialogue.php

How to Create Great Characters
http://reelauthors.com/script-analysis-coverage/how-to-create-great-characters.php

Story is King
http://reelauthors.com/script-analysis-coverage/story-is-king.php

Drama and Conflict
http://reelauthors.com/script-analysis-coverage/drama-and-conflict.php
 
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Thanks, I will go through these links.
How did peter jackson discover the district 9 short, did it win a film festival or something?

I decided I wanted to do this about two years ago, I've been watching a ton of classic movies, reading screen writing books, editing books, directing books, etc since then.
 
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sfoster said:
I'm nearly ready to work with real actors on a 3 minute short!
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Your remix is pretty good.

You need to do something original in order to get enough notice to
get a feature job. All the above mentioned short films were original
and creative and if you look them up you will find out how they got
noticed. In most cases the films did well in film festivals.

Right now, today, you have nothing to encourage someone to put
time, effort and money into you as a director. You need to make
those two awesome shorts. Keep in mind that your first two or three
(or five) may not be so awesome that you get a deal directing a
feature. Think of this journey as a long term deal, not a quick way
to features. I would suggest planning on making five 3 to 5 minute
shorts over the next 6 months as you work on your crime thriller.
Just imagine how much more comfortable you will be in January of
2014 if you have five finished short films than if you have one. Your
knowledge of lighting and audio will give you the confidence you need
to make that awesome crime thriller.
 
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directorik said:
Keep in mind that your first two or three
(or five) may not be so awesome that you get a deal directing a
feature. Think of this journey as a long term deal, not a quick way
to features. I would suggest planning on making five 3 to 5 minute
shorts over the next 6 months as you work on your crime thriller.
Just imagine how much more comfortable you will be in January of
2014 if you have five finished short films than if you have one. Your
knowledge of lighting and audio will give you the confidence you need
to make that awesome crime thriller.
Click to expand...

Thanks for watching my remix! Glad you liked it.

If I quickly churn out 5 small shorts, the quality will suffer.
Won't that drive potential investors away? I want everything I film to be innovative and interesting, to establish a branding and make people want to be a part of any project I'm attached to.

I figured the one quick short plus a good script would inspire enough confidence for people to commit to the 20 minute crime thriller. I'll consider your advice about maybe writing another 3 minute short, with a chase scene or something fun. It depends on how the production values of Disturbed World Problems turns out.
 
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sfoster said:
How did peter jackson discover the district 9 short, did it win a film festival or something?
Click to expand...

I don't know - some google-ing might uncover the answer. I don't think it was a festival though. I think someone simply brought it to Peter's attention. He liked it so much, he brought Neill to Peter's production company in New Zealand - originally for Halo.

I did manage to find the short though! Stunning stuff. Bear in mind Neill was a visual effects/CGI whizz prior to trying his hand at directing.

Neill Blomkamp's original sci-fi short/sample
http://vimeo.com/1431107
 
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sfoster said:
If I quickly churn out 5 small shorts, the quality will suffer.
Won't that drive potential investors away?
Click to expand...
Maybe you could use the practice of making five or six short films.
Maybe you don't show your first films to investors. Maybe you use
them as a learning experience - getting better and better each time.

Or maybe you will make an awesome short the first time out that
will attract investors. No need for you to be involved in anything
that isn't innovative and interesting. I wasn't that good starting out.
I had to work up to being good enough to attract investors for my
first feature. I shot an average of eight films (on film) a year for two
years (starting at 14) until I made one I felt comfortable to submit
to a film festival and another four films (on film) before I attracted
the investors for my first feature when I was 20. That is why I
suggested the path of making many movies. I can't imagine that
by making five short films will cause your quality to suffer. Seems to
me you could only get better and better.

I look forward to seeing your first short.
 
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IndiePaul said:
I don't know - some google-ing might uncover the answer.
Click to expand...

Haha yeah, I deserved that :)
Thanks for the link to the short!

directorik said:
Maybe you could use the practice of making five or six short films.
Maybe you don't show your first films to investors. Maybe you use
them as a learning experience - getting better and better each time.

Or maybe you will make an awesome short the first time out that
will attract investors. No need for you to be involved in anything
that isn't innovative and interesting. I wasn't that good starting out.
I had to work up to being good enough to attract investors for my
first feature. I shot an average of eight films (on film) a year for two
years (starting at 14) until I made one I felt comfortable to submit
to a film festival and another four films (on film) before I attracted
the investors for my first feature when I was 20. That is why I
suggested the path of making many movies. I can't imagine that
by making five short films will cause your quality to suffer. Seems to
me you could only get better and better.

I look forward to seeing your first short.
Click to expand...

That's fantastic that you're so accomplished in the field, I appreciate it all the more that you're taking the time to give me advice.

Did you write all of those shorts you were filming?

It took me a while to get my short script to place where I am happy and confident with it, and it's only 3 pages! If I tried to film it after the first month I know it would have been of a much lower quality. That's what I mean by the quality would suffer.. trying to rush the product to fit a timeline.. but you're right that experience benefits, I definitely can't deny that.

I'm already 30 years old, my friends all have real jobs, some of them have kids. It's not easy for me to get people together and try to film something on a whim. I need to have a script that inspires people with it's vision, otherwise I feel like I would be wasting everyone elses time (even if it is a benefit to my skillset to have the practice). Still, maybe I can write a small two person scene or something..

Come to think of it, I did do a little exercise where I asked a neighbor to walk my dog around the city. I filmed him for about 2 hours and then got a 6 minute walking video out of it. More of an exercise in editing, I had no screenplay or storyboards. I had just finished an editing book at the time :)
 
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sfoster said:
If I quickly churn out 5 small shorts, the quality will suffer.
Won't that drive potential investors away? I want everything I film to be innovative and interesting, to establish a branding and make people want to be a part of any project I'm attached to.
Click to expand...

You should make (at least) a few short films. If you think making some (bad) shorts could drive away potential investors, don't show it around or put it on the internet, just make it for practice!
 
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sfoster said:
I am definitely way better suited for film than television. Maybe if I could find some original short scripts online that I didn't have to write myself.
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There are a good amount of websites to look around for scripts (my favorite being SimplyScripts.com), and you can also ask around here on IndieTalk for free screenplays and screenwriters that are willing to work for free. Heck, I'll write you a screenplay if you want. But don't expect anything amazing, I'm more of a director than a writer :D.
 
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sfoster said:
I still need to figure out how to record the dialogue and add a musical score. So much red tape, audio is a whole can of worms I only began looking at this past week.
Click to expand...

There are plenty of royalty free music sites and composers on websites, such as IT, that are willing to work for free. I just contacted a composer here today actually :D

There are plenty of audio people, such as AA and APE that can answer probably almost all audio questions you could possibly have.

Good luck!
 
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ChimpPhobiaFilms said:
You should make (at least) a few short films. If you think making some (bad) shorts could drive away potential investors, don't show it around or put it on the internet, just make it for practice!
Click to expand...

i don't have any minions... i'm assuming i would have to coerce friends but that seems unlikely

ChimpPhobiaFilms said:
There are a good amount of websites to look around for scripts (my favorite being SimplyScripts.com), and you can also ask around here on IndieTalk for free screenplays and screenwriters that are willing to work for free. Heck, I'll write you a screenplay if you want. But don't expect anything amazing, I'm more of a director than a writer :D.
Click to expand...

I guess I need to get a feel for the screen writing community here!
If someone else wrote it that takes some of the pressure off me :D

ChimpPhobiaFilms said:
There are plenty of royalty free music sites and composers on websites, such as IT, that are willing to work for free.
Click to expand...

What is IT?
 
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sfoster said:
i don't have any minions... i'm assuming i would have to coerce friends but that seems unlikely
Click to expand...

Don't need any :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSVuf7VoxpQ

sfoster said:
I guess I need to get a feel for the screen writing community here! If someone else wrote it that takes some of the pressure off me :D
Click to expand...

You can start a thread on it :)



sfoster said:
What is IT?
Click to expand...

3390182310_f86c82cb95.jpg


This is the third time I've seen this question. Wow.

IndieTalk
 
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sfoster said:
If I tried to film it after the first month I know it would have been of a much lower quality. That's what I mean by the quality would suffer.. trying to rush the product to fit a timeline..
Click to expand...
Your entire career will be a rush to complete a project in a
specific timeline. And it will always be not enough time. What
better way to prepare for that then to start now? You want
investors to feel comfortable hiring you as a director? Show
that you can work under a specific timeline and still put out
a good product.

sfoster said:
I'm already 30 years old, my friends all have real jobs, some of them have kids. It's not easy for me to get people together and try to film something on a whim.
Click to expand...
You knew it wasn't going to be easy. I didn't suggest you do
something on a whim. I suggested you seriously commit to
making several short films. Not a small, two person scene
shot on a whim, but several real short films. Not easy - which
is why so few beginning filmmakers do it. Most wait until their
idea is something that will inspire people with their vision. So
you are among the vast majority.


You're 30. Your 20 minute crime thriller won't be ready to shoot
anytime this year. What are you going to do for the next six
months? Wait and think and hope and write and storyboard?
That's easier.

Anyway... you don't need a lecture from me. You know your
limitations.
 
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directorik said:
Your 20 minute crime thriller won't be ready to shoot
anytime this year. What are you going to do for the next six
months? Wait and think and hope and write and storyboard?
That's easier.
Click to expand...

Yes write, storyboard and think mostly.. also learn about audio.
Okay okay I will see if I can write some other short stories.

it's at least worth a shot
 
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