About to Shoot on RED
- Thread starter Godchoo
- Start date
Don't fall in love with the technology. It's only as good as the people using it.
If you don't have the money to use Red, then don't. Plan on incurring extra costs for renting gear, buying the media, anyone who's expertise you require, and in post.
Don't record your audio direct to the camera. If you do make sure you take every precaution you would if you were recording to a seperate audio device.
Plan every shot in advance and really think about what order to shoot them in. Allow a lot of time for setup. It can take 20 min or more to change your shot if you don't have a camera tech. My DP did it solo and it killed our schedule. Big rookie mistake on my part. If you have the $ get the DP an assistant.
Make sure you only record to virgin media. Rip the files right there on set so if anything is corrupt you can get it again before you leave the set. We had MAJOR issues with a few corrupt frames that killed us in editing and we completely lost a dangerous stunt and had to reshoot it.
Get good lenses. The red zoom lens is good, but I rented a set of primes and it made a HUGE difference. Make sure you have the right glass to get the shots you need.
At 4k everything matters. Be very aware of your set. At that resolution everything is visible. If you are trying to hide something then don't put it in front of a Red. Lighting is critical. Far more so than in most digital shooting.
If you don't have the money to use Red, then don't. Plan on incurring extra costs for renting gear, buying the media, anyone who's expertise you require, and in post.
Don't record your audio direct to the camera. If you do make sure you take every precaution you would if you were recording to a seperate audio device.
Plan every shot in advance and really think about what order to shoot them in. Allow a lot of time for setup. It can take 20 min or more to change your shot if you don't have a camera tech. My DP did it solo and it killed our schedule. Big rookie mistake on my part. If you have the $ get the DP an assistant.
Make sure you only record to virgin media. Rip the files right there on set so if anything is corrupt you can get it again before you leave the set. We had MAJOR issues with a few corrupt frames that killed us in editing and we completely lost a dangerous stunt and had to reshoot it.
Get good lenses. The red zoom lens is good, but I rented a set of primes and it made a HUGE difference. Make sure you have the right glass to get the shots you need.
At 4k everything matters. Be very aware of your set. At that resolution everything is visible. If you are trying to hide something then don't put it in front of a Red. Lighting is critical. Far more so than in most digital shooting.
Know your post workflow before you shoot. If you're cutting in AVID or FCP or especailly Adobe Premiere Pro CS4-CS5, getting some test shots and making sure you can import and playback the footage ahead of time will relieve a lot of headaches.
If you're using CF cards, then have a loader/laptop on set to offload often. If you're using hard drives, you don't have to copy as often, but still offload the drives during long lighting setups. Also, redundant back ups - as in copy to 2 hard drives immediately and do not rely on any single drive to house your footage. You can never be too safe.
Check the footage in RED CINE during the shoot and get some idea with the DP about color and schemes, even though you don't have to commit to it on the spot. Remember, the data is RAW coming off the sensor, so it can be pretty odd to look at first. Just know that with 4K data and the REDRAW codec you have a lot more wiggle room to play with the look later.
I had no problem at all working with 4K red footage in Adobe Premiere CS4.2.1 and it was rather easy to edit normally.
If you're using CF cards, then have a loader/laptop on set to offload often. If you're using hard drives, you don't have to copy as often, but still offload the drives during long lighting setups. Also, redundant back ups - as in copy to 2 hard drives immediately and do not rely on any single drive to house your footage. You can never be too safe.
Check the footage in RED CINE during the shoot and get some idea with the DP about color and schemes, even though you don't have to commit to it on the spot. Remember, the data is RAW coming off the sensor, so it can be pretty odd to look at first. Just know that with 4K data and the REDRAW codec you have a lot more wiggle room to play with the look later.
I had no problem at all working with 4K red footage in Adobe Premiere CS4.2.1 and it was rather easy to edit normally.
I have spent the last half hour trying to find information on the Red camera. I can't seem to find out about the Scarlet either. I can't believe google isn't my friend today 
My biggest question is what does the Scarlet cost and am I paying for the whole camera or the body like with the Red.
My first instinct is to not even look at this camera line AT ALL. But I want to look at least....
Somebody give me a website or something!! For both cameras.
-- spinner
My biggest question is what does the Scarlet cost and am I paying for the whole camera or the body like with the Red.
My first instinct is to not even look at this camera line AT ALL. But I want to look at least....
Somebody give me a website or something!! For both cameras.
-- spinner
Type in Red camera in google and go to their official site. from their u can check out links or go to their forum where theres a section and thread for everything.
I have spent the last half hour trying to find information on the Red camera. I can't seem to find out about the Scarlet either. I can't believe google isn't my friend today
My biggest question is what does the Scarlet cost and am I paying for the whole camera or the body like with the Red.
My first instinct is to not even look at this camera line AT ALL. But I want to look at least....
Somebody give me a website or something!! For both cameras.
-- spinner
www.Red.com
Scaret isnt out. and youd be paying for just the body. Unles you get the shitty fixed lens scarlet.
And for the OP
RED hates 3rd party gear, so make sure you have the right external monitor and other accessories, or you'll be in for a head ache.
It wont be out for a while, so don't worry about it.
Good audio recording to a separate device can have higher bit rates and less compression. This gives the audio editing team a lot more data and quality to work with.
I had the audio re-synched in post production before we edited. We recorded to the RED, but only as a reference.
(apologies for the blunt wording, pretty tired, very long day on set today and we're not getting our proper turn around.)
Make sure that you DP/OP and your ACs are familiar with the camera. Know what build version you are using, and if it is an older build (like 20 for example), see if your tech's can update the firmware before you shoot.
Overheating is not as much of an issue as it used to be, but it is still an issue. Make sure that you have at least 2 drives (3 is better), at least 4 batteries and 2 chargers. If you are using CF cards, the more the merrier. You'll get about 8 minutes of roll per card. (16GB).
<caps lock for emphasis> IF YOU ARE USING CF CARDS, BE ECONOMICAL WITH CALLING ROLL AND CUT. NOTHING IS MORE ANNOYING THAN HEARING THE CALL FOR ROLL CAMERA THEN WATCHING THE % AVAILABLE TICK AWAY WHILE KEYS HAVE A CONVERSATION FOR THE NEXT 3 OR 4 MINUTES. <end annoying caps lock>. This gets more annoying when you yell at our ACs because of a roll out after pulling one of these "roll for 4 minutes while people figure out what they are doing" tricks.
Lessie, make sure that your crew has the manual that is for the correct build version of the camera.
Never aim a laser at the sensor, and never aim it at the sun either - both things can and will damage the sensor.
x2 on getting your shooter a good 1st AC, 2nd AC, and DIT. Forget "if you have the money." FIND the money. RED One is a touchy, finiky B^&ch, and she will shaft you at every opportunity.
Get used to reboot times when you change batteries, and hopefully those awesome ACs you find will know to fit battery changes and magazine changes into times when camera can be down for a few minutes.
PULL FOCUS!!!!!! Cannot emphasize that enough. If you plan to ever project this footage, don't just trust eye focus on the small LCDs. Even the big monitor can steer you astray in certain circumstances.
And take all the above advice regarding post workflow.
Don't make your DP/operator hand hold the thing for 12 hours. It's murderous.
Do NOT try to use a fully built RED on support gear that cannot hold the weight. This goes for tripod heads, jib arms, car mounts, anything. Yes, the *body* only weighs 17lbs, but when you throw on handles, top and bottom rods, battery cage, battery, drive, top handle, glass, matte box, follow focus, and any audio kit for jam sync or scratch tracks it can easily top 50 lbs. Support gear not designed for the weight WILL fail.
Your DP should occasionally be viewing the raw sensor image to ensure that exposure is in bounds regardless of your look settings.
Remember that when you plug in the EVF and RED lcd, you will loose menu display at video village. Scripty might wonder what happened to the mag/clip display, and there will be no indication that camera is rolling on the monitor at village.
Backups, Backups, Backups. Do it on set. Don't wait till later to backup your data. Make copies.
If the FFD (backfocus) is not set by your rental house, make sure that someone in your camera crew knows how to A: check it, and B: fix it if it is off.
If you are using the base RED battery cage, have your crew check it. A wonky one can really ruin your day by randomly shutting down the camera when it looses power.
I could probably think of more, but I'm pretty out of it at this point.
RE: Scarlett. At his point that thing is vaporware, and there are rumors of it going extinct before it is even on the market.
Spinner, the last info on Scarlett is that there is a fixed lens version and that pricing for the other versions are for body only as with the One. Again though, vaporware that may never come to market.
Edit: Certain frame rates only work at 2K, and even then only on a drive, not a CF card. There is a chart in the manual (again, use the manual that matches your build) which details what frame rates you can shoot at what resolution and on which media. You *can* shoot higher frame rates at 3K, but I have talked to a few DIT and Editor types who have had problems mixing 3K and 4K footage, and thus prefer to overcrank at 2K if the frame rate goes over a certain speed. Remember that doing so is essentially cropping the sensor, thus giving you a field of view that is equivilant to 2x the focal length of your lens. IE: a 25mm lens at 2K gives a similar field of view as a 50mm at 4K. This is not really a "zoom" or "punch in" effect, it is an effect similar to crop factor on SLR cameras.
Make sure that you DP/OP and your ACs are familiar with the camera. Know what build version you are using, and if it is an older build (like 20 for example), see if your tech's can update the firmware before you shoot.
Overheating is not as much of an issue as it used to be, but it is still an issue. Make sure that you have at least 2 drives (3 is better), at least 4 batteries and 2 chargers. If you are using CF cards, the more the merrier. You'll get about 8 minutes of roll per card. (16GB).
<caps lock for emphasis> IF YOU ARE USING CF CARDS, BE ECONOMICAL WITH CALLING ROLL AND CUT. NOTHING IS MORE ANNOYING THAN HEARING THE CALL FOR ROLL CAMERA THEN WATCHING THE % AVAILABLE TICK AWAY WHILE KEYS HAVE A CONVERSATION FOR THE NEXT 3 OR 4 MINUTES. <end annoying caps lock>. This gets more annoying when you yell at our ACs because of a roll out after pulling one of these "roll for 4 minutes while people figure out what they are doing" tricks.
Lessie, make sure that your crew has the manual that is for the correct build version of the camera.
Never aim a laser at the sensor, and never aim it at the sun either - both things can and will damage the sensor.
x2 on getting your shooter a good 1st AC, 2nd AC, and DIT. Forget "if you have the money." FIND the money. RED One is a touchy, finiky B^&ch, and she will shaft you at every opportunity.
Get used to reboot times when you change batteries, and hopefully those awesome ACs you find will know to fit battery changes and magazine changes into times when camera can be down for a few minutes.
PULL FOCUS!!!!!! Cannot emphasize that enough. If you plan to ever project this footage, don't just trust eye focus on the small LCDs. Even the big monitor can steer you astray in certain circumstances.
And take all the above advice regarding post workflow.
Don't make your DP/operator hand hold the thing for 12 hours. It's murderous.
Do NOT try to use a fully built RED on support gear that cannot hold the weight. This goes for tripod heads, jib arms, car mounts, anything. Yes, the *body* only weighs 17lbs, but when you throw on handles, top and bottom rods, battery cage, battery, drive, top handle, glass, matte box, follow focus, and any audio kit for jam sync or scratch tracks it can easily top 50 lbs. Support gear not designed for the weight WILL fail.
Your DP should occasionally be viewing the raw sensor image to ensure that exposure is in bounds regardless of your look settings.
Remember that when you plug in the EVF and RED lcd, you will loose menu display at video village. Scripty might wonder what happened to the mag/clip display, and there will be no indication that camera is rolling on the monitor at village.
Backups, Backups, Backups. Do it on set. Don't wait till later to backup your data. Make copies.
If the FFD (backfocus) is not set by your rental house, make sure that someone in your camera crew knows how to A: check it, and B: fix it if it is off.
If you are using the base RED battery cage, have your crew check it. A wonky one can really ruin your day by randomly shutting down the camera when it looses power.
I could probably think of more, but I'm pretty out of it at this point.
RE: Scarlett. At his point that thing is vaporware, and there are rumors of it going extinct before it is even on the market.
Spinner, the last info on Scarlett is that there is a fixed lens version and that pricing for the other versions are for body only as with the One. Again though, vaporware that may never come to market.
Edit: Certain frame rates only work at 2K, and even then only on a drive, not a CF card. There is a chart in the manual (again, use the manual that matches your build) which details what frame rates you can shoot at what resolution and on which media. You *can* shoot higher frame rates at 3K, but I have talked to a few DIT and Editor types who have had problems mixing 3K and 4K footage, and thus prefer to overcrank at 2K if the frame rate goes over a certain speed. Remember that doing so is essentially cropping the sensor, thus giving you a field of view that is equivilant to 2x the focal length of your lens. IE: a 25mm lens at 2K gives a similar field of view as a 50mm at 4K. This is not really a "zoom" or "punch in" effect, it is an effect similar to crop factor on SLR cameras.
Last edited:
You are directing. Are you shooting and operating, too?
I've operated the RED twice. A very difficult experience
even though I make a portion of my living as a camera
operator. I'm glad we had a REDtek on set.
Some excellent advice from David. I'll ad: Do NOT record
audio directly to that camera. It has that capability but
it's really not set up for it. Record audio separately.
I had major issues with Avid not being able to pull the audio from the files. 1 editor quit because he couldn't manage the audio portion of the workflow. I don't think this is very common, but I found enough similar stories in Red forums that I would avoid it in the future.
Also, on some takes the camera would only output 1 channel of audio even though it was recording all 3. We'd spend 5 minutes fixing it, and it would mess up again 5 takes later.
Beyond this I wouldn't want a DP or Camera tech to have any oversight of audio and I wouldn't want a sound guy touching that camera.
The only exception I would make is if you have a camera tech who knows the RED very well and has SIGNIFICANT prior experience in sound recording. Barring that, keep them seperate.
Agreed on the audio notes. Scratch track is pretty much the only use for in-camera audio on the RED.
Also, if you happen to be using drives, don't wait all day to download. This is another thing that is best managed at opportunity. Just like battery changes, don't wait till it runs out - swap it while the Director is working with talent, or while grip-ology is getting build.
Don't be tempted to keep going because you have 320GB to play with. At a bare minimum, make sure you download at lunch - but even that is a: risky, and b: makes your download times pretty long.
Also, just finished a 2 day shoot where our only download station was a producer's macbook. No software on which to view the *.R3D files, all we could do was check the proxy files. Ugh, please, for the sake of all that is sane in film making, don't repeat this one!
Here:
http://www.red.com/support/index
Make sure your DIT (or at least the person acting as your DIT) has access to the hardware and software s/he needs to do the job.
Also, if you happen to be using drives, don't wait all day to download. This is another thing that is best managed at opportunity. Just like battery changes, don't wait till it runs out - swap it while the Director is working with talent, or while grip-ology is getting build.
Don't be tempted to keep going because you have 320GB to play with. At a bare minimum, make sure you download at lunch - but even that is a: risky, and b: makes your download times pretty long.
Also, just finished a 2 day shoot where our only download station was a producer's macbook. No software on which to view the *.R3D files, all we could do was check the proxy files. Ugh, please, for the sake of all that is sane in film making, don't repeat this one!
Here:
http://www.red.com/support/index
Make sure your DIT (or at least the person acting as your DIT) has access to the hardware and software s/he needs to do the job.