What type of lens would I need for this?

H

harmonica44

I want a deep focus lens for my Canon T2i. But it seems all lenses for it are shallow. I would want to get the a lens that can be snapped onto it with an adapter, I am guessing, but the camera stores were not of much help for adapters. I looked it up on the net, but not finding anything that can go on the T2i with an adapter for it specifically. Is there any?
 
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F/22 is pretty extreme. Try running faster, f/16, , somewhere in between. You'll still have pretty deep focus but need way less light.

Focusing is hard on some shots, but almost never impossible. The best bet is still to practice the shot and focus on actors as they move and from actor to actor for each line.
 
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harmonica44 said:
I kind of don't like 'rack focusing' though. It's okay, but I was watching Citizen Kane which uses a lot of deep focus and thought, that's the style I want! Everything looks so sharp.
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You can light your scene to f/5.6 or f/8.0 and keep a deeper focus look. That doesn't mean you won't have to pull focus as things happen in the scene, just that the DOF won't be really shallow. Deep focus is not the ability to shoot a scene without a focus puller, it's just having a deeper DOF. Also keep in mind that something like Citizen Kane, for example, had massive amounts of light. Old movies tended to have large amounts of light, because they had slow lenses and slow film stock. When 50 speed film stock is the fastest you can get (equivalent to ISO, so imagine your ISO only went up to 50) and lenses don't open as wide as they do today, you're going to need to be putting 4k, 8k, 10k lights and possible even more depending on the scene. Big lights are expensive to buy and rent, but that doesn't mean you can't have deep focus. Just light for around f/8.0
 
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Okay thanks. When it comes to shots such as following actors while running though, I cannot find a DP or focus puller that can see if something is out of focus, or not, while in the process of running. It's just too difficult to see in that case. So I could use some deep focus in shots like that, that will not require focus pulling.
 
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If your DP has a focus puller, then why are they pulling focus themselves? If you have a focus puller, then they should be getting marks during rehearsals and adjusting the focus as the scene takes place. If they're not adjusting the focus, then they're not a focus puller. You do have rehearsals right? Also, it's much easier to keep a smaller scene in focus at f/8 or even f/5.6 than it is the same scene at f/2.8 or f/1.4.
 
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No I don't have a focus puller now, I was just meaning hypothetically for future projects. How exactly do I mark though? I mean the actors will run differently in each take so it's unpredictable to mark, it seems.
 
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harmonica44 said:
No I don't have a focus puller now, I was just meaning hypothetically for future projects. How exactly do I mark though? I mean the actors will run differently in each take so it's unpredictable to mark, it seems.
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Then the actors should hit the same marks in each take. While you occasionally have to "cheat" an actor's position to make the shot work, if you don't make any effort to preserve continuity on the set, how are you going to be able to edit a coherent sequence in post?

A very good focus puller using cine lenses will often be able to keep things sharp without marks. An inexperienced focus puller using stills lenses will find it tricky even if actors and the camera hit their marks exactly take after take. Choose your battles wisely.
 
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Well I'd have to find someone who knows what they are doing. It seems none of the people who went to film school here, took that marking thing, in class, at least none of them mentioned when I asked them if they could pull focus in a running sequence. I was therefore hoping to work around that with deep focus. But I would also still like to use it as a stylistic choice as well.
 
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1" Cloth or Paper Tape is used. You get marks, measure their distances, then mark up your follow focus.
Good focus pullers often find they have to trust their own judgement of distance without making marks. This generally happens when both the camera and the actor are moving at the same time. If the camera's still then it shouldn't really be an issue, even if it's quick - hell, I've pulled my own focus on a DSLR for fast-paced stuff and had useable results.
 
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Yeah okay I would just have to find a DP that has experience with that. Even if I do, I still wanted deep focus just cause it looks sharp. So there aren't any lights that are affordable that are as bright as Citizen's Kane's lights, that can plug into regular outlets?
 
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You'd need an AC that's familiar with it, not a DP. You need a DP to design the lighting of the shot and to frame it up and operate the camera, and you need an AC to pull focus, slate, facilitate lens and filter swaps etc.

Focus around f/5.6 is good because it does give you a deeper DOF, plus it makes the image a lot sharper as cheaper lenses tend to go soft wide open.

Unless you have three-phase power wired in your house (;)) then no.
 
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Okay thanks. But what about the split focus diopter idea? Any drawbacks there?


TheArtist said:
I've got ONE WORD for you and I'm suprised noone mentionned it before.

HYPERFOCAL.

You can achieve deep focus with any lens and with any aperture as long as you focus on the hyperfocal.
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Forgive my knowledge but how exactly do I guess where the hyperfocal is, in a shot?
 
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The drawback would be that it would look like you have a split focus diopter on the lens. Split focus diopters are not the same as deep focus. The depth of field would still be shallow, just that two different parts of the scene would be in focus.

You don't guess the hyperfocal, you calculate it or find it out using an application
 
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Okay thanks. I know a split focus diopter isn't real deep focus but I thought it could still help give the illusion, especially in some shots I want of a person far in the background in focus, as well as person in the foreground at the same time. I will do my research and ask some DPs and ACs around if they know about hyperfocal and all that. I don't have to have complete deep focus to be satisfied I guess, but I don't want any visible rack focusing, when going from background to foreground.
 
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A split-focus diopter is just going to complicate your life, and not really save you from need more horsepower in your lights - they reduce light transmission through the lens just like any other diopter.

Focus pulling is one of the most misunderstood jobs on a film set, and simultaneously one of the simplest and most difficult.

If you don't want to rack focus, and you are moving your camera anyway, your best bet is to get the deepest stop you can get, as far away as you can get, and on as wide a lens as you can get. Then REHEARSE THE MOVE multiple times, ensuring that your operator and actor can stay at the same distance from each other with enough precision to stay within acceptable focus for your distance/stop/focal length.

Note this trick DOES NOT replace actually pulling focus, and in fact should be used in conjunction with pulling, but if you can get enough stop you might have a fighting chance.

Also, don't expect your actors to hit their marks every time. Dollars to donuts that they won't. That's why good ACs already have focus estimates for several arcs in front of the camera, usually before blocking and marking has occurred. Also, extra bitchy actors will GO OUT OF THEIR WAY to be off their focus mark, just to fuck with the ACs and there's jack and shit you can do about it because they are the Talent. Learn to adjust on the fly or learn a new job is the order of the day in that case.*




* - this happened to me on a project last year. Actress insisted on doing her own thing and doing it differently each take. Director let her run with it, so I had to as well. To be fair, most actors do this for the craft and not out of malice, but this particular actress was definitely including the latter.
 
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