What are some techno thrillers shot for under $50K
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No! You talk about making a microbudget film along the lines of probably the highest budget TV series ever made! Why did it have such a massive budget and how are you going to achieve with a few grand what the makers of 24 had to pay $35m to achieve? The difficulty with thrillers is that by definition they require thrills and creating thrills is neither easy nor cheap and attempting to do it cheap in my experience always fails. While something like Primer is a decent little movie for a no budget film, IMHO it's a techo drama rather than a techno thriller. If it's supposed to be a thriller then IMO it failed.
It can't be both irrelevant and influential. It can only be influential to those people who believe it has relevance!!
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I'm not saying it's going to be as high budget as 24. I realize it's much lower budget. Just a similar feel and plot that is inspired by it. I don't know if I'd call it an action movie, but more of a suspense thriller. Right now I am just concentrating on rewriting the script for my budget to story and action will come next. There are 4 action sequences. 2 of them are low key and not that long. They rely more on suspense than destruction, kind of like these two examples:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0aqIwl2wgM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DrMdQhz53Q
I am taking police SWAT training right now, from a guy who teaches, and I have gotten into the course, cause movie making is a reason that they would teach it. He says he will teach it to actors in the future as well if I like.
The other two action set pieces are bigger. One of them is a car chase which I might rewrite as on on foot chase, if I cannot get a CGI person who will want to to do a lot of the car chase effects.
The other bigger action sequence is a gunfight between maybe 15 people at least, that is kind of like the Heat shootout:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b60-sEXUPBY
Now the Heat shootout is outdoors and would cost a fortune, which is why I plan to do it in a large indoor location where we would have permission from the owner. And some computer effects simulating gunshots, like with Action Essentials or something like that.
Do you think these is do-able as long as I got a special effects person who wants to do it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0aqIwl2wgM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DrMdQhz53Q
I am taking police SWAT training right now, from a guy who teaches, and I have gotten into the course, cause movie making is a reason that they would teach it. He says he will teach it to actors in the future as well if I like.
The other two action set pieces are bigger. One of them is a car chase which I might rewrite as on on foot chase, if I cannot get a CGI person who will want to to do a lot of the car chase effects.
The other bigger action sequence is a gunfight between maybe 15 people at least, that is kind of like the Heat shootout:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b60-sEXUPBY
Now the Heat shootout is outdoors and would cost a fortune, which is why I plan to do it in a large indoor location where we would have permission from the owner. And some computer effects simulating gunshots, like with Action Essentials or something like that.
Do you think these is do-able as long as I got a special effects person who wants to do it?
Obviously, trying to get a $35m budget with no film making track record is going to be about as close to impossible as you can get. The problem you've got is when you say you want a "similar feel". Making a film (or TV series) is ALL about the "feel". Creating the tension, suspense, action and pacing of 24 is what gives it it's "feel", which is why I asked how you intend to create all this for a few grand when it cost the makers of 24 $35m?
With enough time, study and hard work almost anything is "do-able" with almost any budget, it all depends on what you mean by "do-able". If you mean do-able to a level which is convincing to paying audiences/distributors then the answer is most probably "no", if you've only got a tiny budget. Action/suspense thrillers have large teams of highly professional special effects people who are usually supplemented by other ancillary teams, such as a stunt team, audio post teams, etc. So again, how do you plan to achieve all this with just one special effects person, your amateur cast/crew and yourself?
G
I wouldn't be hiring an amateur crew, I would only go through with it if I could get a crew who could do it. And I know a stunt coordinator who read the script and said he was interested. But like I said, I feel I could do it, if I keep it low key.
Their are a lot of horror microbudget movies, that practically have the same thing. People shooting and stabbing each other, so I figure if those movies can do it for $50,000 or less, why cannot I, with a suspense thriller script?
But this would be in the future though, when I can find a good crew for it that is interested.
As far as having a team goes, a lot of indie films just hire one post audio person to do everything, and it seems to turn out fine. One of the movies I helped to make, has pretty good sound effects audio, and it is all being done by one person. But when I saw 24 inspired I do not mean as high budget as 24. Think of a microbudget version of 24. Kind of like El Mariachi meets 24.
Their are a lot of horror microbudget movies, that practically have the same thing. People shooting and stabbing each other, so I figure if those movies can do it for $50,000 or less, why cannot I, with a suspense thriller script?
But this would be in the future though, when I can find a good crew for it that is interested.
As far as having a team goes, a lot of indie films just hire one post audio person to do everything, and it seems to turn out fine. One of the movies I helped to make, has pretty good sound effects audio, and it is all being done by one person. But when I saw 24 inspired I do not mean as high budget as 24. Think of a microbudget version of 24. Kind of like El Mariachi meets 24.
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1. You should get experience making (good) short films. Don't jump into the deep end without practicing in the shallow end. You'll drown. Unless you're some type of wunderkind.
2. Audio is more important than you think. But what about El Mariachi?! El Mariachi got the sound perfected by Columbia Pictures.
3. El Mariachi is HISTORY. Everything you saw done in the film cannot be done as cheap and easily now as it was done then. He went to the cops, and asked to use their jail and 20+ machine guns for a credit in the film. You are a fool if you think you can still do that. Rodriguez was in the right place in the right time.
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Also RR didn't do it alone. He had a producer/ lead actor who had strong connections in the down they were shooting in. What I read from Rebel without a crew, a lot of the heavy lifting was don by the guy. For example he helped to scout and secure most of the locations and helped in getting actors involved. So my advise would be to get a good producer.1. You should get experience making (good) short films. Don't jump into the deep end without practicing in the shallow end. You'll drown. Unless you're some type of wunderkind.
2. Audio is more important than you think. But what about El Mariachi?! El Mariachi got the sound perfected by Columbia Pictures.
3. El Mariachi is HISTORY. Everything you saw done in the film cannot be done as cheap and easily now as it was done then. He went to the cops, and asked to use their jail and 20+ machine guns for a credit in the film. You are a fool if you think you can still do that. Rodriguez was in the right place in the right time.
But you're a student right?
$50k is a hell of a lot of money.
I don't know and don't want to know your net worth and finances but just be sensible.
Spending $50k on a low budget indie sounds great and cool but the reality is that most micro budget movies have no commercial success...
So should that $50k be kept back for a house/flat deposit or a post grad? The decisions of the adult world...
Ok.
Here's the thing. Reading your brief outline above, you could, in theory, make that movie for $5million or less. Too much less and you are running into some serious hurdles. Insurance, E/O, medic on set, weaponsmith, and other absolutely essential safety costs that you absolutely positively cannot skimp on what so ever will add up fast. I do not have enough budget experience to give you an example number; however, having worked on features in the SAG "ULB" range I have a little experience with what can be done with small amounts of money.
IMO, Anything less than $500K and a project like this would suffer greatly and the end product would likely not be worth the investment.
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I'm not saying it's impossible to do for less. Hell, it's possible you could make that film for $20K, but you would not be making the film you are imagining it to become.
Keep this in your pocket. Work on your skills and your contacts. Who knows, maybe you'll meet someone who likes the script and just wants to buy it off you and produce it. Selling a script is just as baller as making one.
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Also, really get El Mariachi out of your head. There's a pod-cast interview with Shane Carruth that was posted here on the board. He talks about how trying to model the production of Primer after El Mariachi kinda (in his retrospect opinion) screwed him over. El Mariachi was made in an entirely different distribution and production landscape, decades ago, in a country where at the time when the local currency was worth pennies in comparison to the USD. In addition to that, when people say "$7K" for the production, that is not an inflation adjusted number.
http://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm
Figure the inflation adjust number to be ~11K.
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For reference. A friend of mine is starting filming on his feature and has about a $50K budget. He's doing a "coming of age" kind of story with very limited locations (2/3 or more of the film is in one house), extras pulled from friends and extended family, and had to rewrite the entire thing to be during the day instead of evening (centers around a large extended-family gathering) because the location he could afford would only allow him to shoot 7a-7p. IIRC they are looking at ~25 total days of shooting. That's about what one can accomplish with that amount of money and have any expectation of a distribute-able end result.*
* - YMMV, exceptions to the rule, story is king, mumble-core, yadda, yadda, etc, etc, disclaimer infinitum. We're trying to help H44 in a realistic way here, so please, let's avoid the inevitable debate about outlier hits. We already have that thread.
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OK, the cost of audio post on El Mariachi was roughly $250,000 (20 years ago) and the audio post on 24 at a very rough guess was $1.5m. Even if you spent your entire $50k budget on audio post, how do you plan on getting somewhere between El Mariachi and 24?
Again, you are saying people can "do it" for $50k and I'm agreeing with you and going even further in saying that in fact you can "do it" for $1k. But, what do you mean by "do it"?
If by "do it" you mean to commercial standards, there's the rub! Getting a crew who think they can "do it" and who say they can "do it" is very different to a crew who can actually "do it". To get a crew who can really "do it" is what the makers of 24 did and is why it cost them $35m!
I would go along with the figures David quoted above. Although IMHO even $500k would be a very tough ask and would depend on a fantastic script, a great deal of good will and a considerable amount of luck. Unless you are willing to throw your $50k away or happy to spend it on just a learning experience or unless you have some unbelievably innovative and revolutionary film making plan, then you need to think very, very carefully about what you are realistically going to achieve with your $50k!!!
G
My first feature budget was 1200e, second one that I am currently working is under 1000e with equipment included.
I could spend 10 000 euro by taking a loan but why should I? The process is the same, actors like to be in the project and I do not need to pay them and everything is going great.
There is no point to spend a lot of money to feature, your own money if you do not know what your are doing. Plenty of examples around where spending money does not change the end results. One person in Finland spent about 35 000 euro to his fantasy project, real swords etc. It crashed completely because the crew were amateurs and then he had his dream project in his hands that no-one wanted to see. Completely pointless way to spend money.
I could spend 10 000 euro by taking a loan but why should I? The process is the same, actors like to be in the project and I do not need to pay them and everything is going great.
There is no point to spend a lot of money to feature, your own money if you do not know what your are doing. Plenty of examples around where spending money does not change the end results. One person in Finland spent about 35 000 euro to his fantasy project, real swords etc. It crashed completely because the crew were amateurs and then he had his dream project in his hands that no-one wanted to see. Completely pointless way to spend money.
Okay thanks. I will save it for later and hold off. I just felt like I should do it sometime since I have actors who are interested. One has passed the script around to other actors and they are now interested too. One actor who I thought would be good for the lead is getting too old, but I guess it's nothing that make up cannot fix if I do it way later in the future.
As far as needing police and a weaponsmith on set, a lot of filmakers are using prop guns, and adding in the special effects in post. But hiring a person to do that might cost even more than having a weaponsmith on set. The real guns with blanks would cost more as well.
I could keep shopping the script around to see if more people would be interested. It's just I wonder if it's safe to keep showing it around, since you don't want anyone to steal the ideas. And you can only keep these actors interested for so long, till they decide to move on, since I am not ready yet, and have to find different people. But I will hold off, until something more assuring comes along for that project.
As far as needing police and a weaponsmith on set, a lot of filmakers are using prop guns, and adding in the special effects in post. But hiring a person to do that might cost even more than having a weaponsmith on set. The real guns with blanks would cost more as well.
I could keep shopping the script around to see if more people would be interested. It's just I wonder if it's safe to keep showing it around, since you don't want anyone to steal the ideas. And you can only keep these actors interested for so long, till they decide to move on, since I am not ready yet, and have to find different people. But I will hold off, until something more assuring comes along for that project.
Before making a feature, I'd make a short. Maybe you could use that short as a promo for a Kickstarter or IndieGoGo campaign.
Just an idea
Yep for sure. I didn't want to jump right into a feature. I thought about maybe in the next year or two. Or soon enough that the actor I want will not be too old for it by then.
This is good stuff though, it helps me learn to how much something will cost. What about that shootout example in Heat? How much would that cost if it was a private location, indoors, and not public? And all the guns were completely harmless props with the intention of adding the effects in later of course?
This is good stuff though, it helps me learn to how much something will cost. What about that shootout example in Heat? How much would that cost if it was a private location, indoors, and not public? And all the guns were completely harmless props with the intention of adding the effects in later of course?
Depends upon how much stuff you wanna break.
Action is expensive because people get hurt if you don't protect them and stuff gets broken = you gotta buy stuff to break or build and break, or replace broken stuff.
Now, if you want a true thriller you should consider what was done for 'Argo'.
Not a shot fired.
All drama + some locations.
It's a good current film model to consider.
Action is expensive because people get hurt if you don't protect them and stuff gets broken = you gotta buy stuff to break or build and break, or replace broken stuff.
Now, if you want a true thriller you should consider what was done for 'Argo'.
Not a shot fired.
All drama + some locations.
It's a good current film model to consider.
For sure. I never really considered the script to be an action movie. 24 is not really an action show. A few people get shot or beaten to death, here or there, but it's all short and quick really. James Bond is what I consider action, if I have been misleading to anyone.
I don't want to break much. just bullets hitting walls and the computer effects for those so far. I have a couple of car crashes, but those can be faked, by not actually showing them and hiding it through editing. A couple of windows get broken though, which is where most likely sugar glass will come in. Or computer effects. But as I am re-writing the script I will try to keep the breaking to a minimum.
Here's an example of an action scene, without much breaking at all:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIi6yXDcMhk
How's this, will audiences not mind that their is a lot of breaking as long as you can make it suspenseful?
I don't want to break much. just bullets hitting walls and the computer effects for those so far. I have a couple of car crashes, but those can be faked, by not actually showing them and hiding it through editing. A couple of windows get broken though, which is where most likely sugar glass will come in. Or computer effects. But as I am re-writing the script I will try to keep the breaking to a minimum.
Here's an example of an action scene, without much breaking at all:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIi6yXDcMhk
How's this, will audiences not mind that their is a lot of breaking as long as you can make it suspenseful?
Still costs lots of money, and requires everyone on set to be very cautious .
I once read that a guy was in a play involving a suicide scene. The audience was amazed by the incredibly gory and super realistic effects in that part
.Okay thanks. I thought it would be less money. My friends who are doing their own feature, did a knife fight and chase scene, and the only thing they had to pay for was props, wardrobe, and the actors. That only added up to about $600. So I thought since it costs them that, that mine would not be too high.
That clip sucks.
Sure you can shoot stuff like that but it's going to get you no where - it has zero commercial potential or value.
Others have given you great advice here in relation to the costs of shooting quality work.
And how good is your script? Am I right in thinking it's your first screenplay?
I thought my first screenplay was great. My partner and friends really liked it.
Five plus years later and with five scripts now under my belt, and placements in the Nicholl (semis) and finals of other screenplay contests, I know now the truth ... My first script was pretty damn bad. And I spent months on it. Out of 10, I'd probably now score it a 5.
My screenwritings probably close to an 8.5 (with re-writes) now but to be worthy of a 60+ million budget it really has to be a 10 star.
Enter your script into some contests. Get some coverage/feedback on it from objective pro readers who don't know you. You need honest feedback to grow. Your partner or friends don't cut it. Neither do actor friends etc. You really need feedback from pro readers or pro screenwriters.
In relation to screenwriting contests, I can highly recommend the Nicholl. It's run by the folks behind the Academy Awards. Place highly in it and your script will get Hollywood reads.
http://www.oscars.org/awards/nicholl/
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Okay thanks. It's my third script.
What counts as commercial value then? How low key can it be but still have commercial value?
What counts as commercial value then? How low key can it be but still have commercial value?