So this is a bit of a rant, but the biggest problem ive been having in my film making journey is unreliable cast. I mean seriously ive tried everything from free food to paying them and still cant seem to get a reliable steady cast aside from like 5 people. its so frustrating! Has anyone else dealt with this issue or have a suggestion that may help? if not its cool like I said a rant. carry on.
Unreliable cast!!
- Thread starter AcespadexXx
- Start date
I feel your pain.
It depends on the people really. I've had people who I was sure that would be a sure thing not even bother turning up on the first day (and ask me months later for a reference) and others who I didn't think it was wide to rely on them be the model worker you wish you could clone.
Sometimes it's poor communication, poor systems, poor organization, a poor production, better opportunity comes along. For others it's just the bosses poor choice to bring that person on.
But yes, it get frustrating. Almost everyone thinks they're a pro and expect everyone elses ability to be at that level, even though they're not realistic of their own "pro-ness".
Sometimes it's poor communication, poor systems, poor organization, a poor production, better opportunity comes along. For others it's just the bosses poor choice to bring that person on.
But yes, it get frustrating. Almost everyone thinks they're a pro and expect everyone elses ability to be at that level, even though they're not realistic of their own "pro-ness".
I more than realize I am way off from being pro. I mean honestly I'm pretty green I'll admit it, I am trying to learn grow and evolve with new ideas and technique. The main problem ive found is the area I live, not much to pick from as far as actors and crew go. So being in that situation I have come to really understand the meaning of beggers cant be choosers. Still I have a specific day every week (yes 1 day I know not a lot of time but I work full time its all I can afford to spend on filming sadly) I contact everyone sunday right after filming and variously throughout the week. I always get the same response from everyone which is yes im for sure coming or cant wait. then sunday rolls around and I get excuses like I don't have enough fuel. So I arrange a ride or tell them I will pay for gas. Or things of that nature I offered last week to pay everyone who showed 100 bucks cash 5 people showed. and the shot list I had planned called for 10. so I had actors playing duel characters which it was just a spoof comedy video so it could add to the comedy but the point is it looks terrible and amatureish? that may not be a real word who cares. I think im gunna get in with a drama club down here and try my luck there. Its the only thing I can think of, and I don't know if they will really like the type of videos I do which is mainly action and thriller, but its worth a shot right?
Trim the fat. I have 4 people I can count on. I write meaty parts for them. If I need more characters I create roles I can film in one day. I also write scenes with unreliables working with a reliable, but only if I really NEED another person.
I would rather put make up or a mask on someone that will be there than keep messing with people that won't. Still, my group is growing.
Crew wise, do as much as possible with as little as possible. Buy or build rigs that allow you to replace certain jobs. Write scenes that are possible with a skeleton crew.
Plan. Plan. Plan. Get people in and out as quickly as possible. People have lives. They don't want to be there all day. They also DON'T CARE about your project nearly as much as you do. So schedule them for when you need them and LET THEM LEAVE.
I would rather put make up or a mask on someone that will be there than keep messing with people that won't. Still, my group is growing.
Crew wise, do as much as possible with as little as possible. Buy or build rigs that allow you to replace certain jobs. Write scenes that are possible with a skeleton crew.
Plan. Plan. Plan. Get people in and out as quickly as possible. People have lives. They don't want to be there all day. They also DON'T CARE about your project nearly as much as you do. So schedule them for when you need them and LET THEM LEAVE.
I had this problem, before, during and after production.
Part of the game, I suppose. One of the many reasons why I plan on paying people in the future.... after they've completed their duties.
Figure, I pay them 1/3 after production, the 2/3 after looping and pick ups and the last 3rd once they attend the premiere (of all goddamn things). Just not tell them ahead of time that it's being split up. I'll tell them the 1st third is what they're being paid, and then tell them I'll pay extra for ADR if need be (and can save money if I don't need them for pick-ups, etc) and then a "bonus" after the premiere.
Budgeting for it ahead of time and then making them perceive it as more money and perks will help out in the future.
- Jow
Part of the game, I suppose. One of the many reasons why I plan on paying people in the future.... after they've completed their duties.
Figure, I pay them 1/3 after production, the 2/3 after looping and pick ups and the last 3rd once they attend the premiere (of all goddamn things). Just not tell them ahead of time that it's being split up. I'll tell them the 1st third is what they're being paid, and then tell them I'll pay extra for ADR if need be (and can save money if I don't need them for pick-ups, etc) and then a "bonus" after the premiere.
Budgeting for it ahead of time and then making them perceive it as more money and perks will help out in the future.
- Jow
This happened with me too 
I gave up for a long time, as getting people uninterested in making films to help you is much like asking them to help you move, but without the urgency that a move would require. So, I started looking on Kijiji and various places and first joined a local acting workshop. Aside from having some fun, we now have someone who's an awesome producer and AD. Each group I've joined (and there's been many) tends to find one more person.
It's a slow, slow process though, like 2 years and counting. But the more you do, the easier it is to find people and the easier it is to attract them to your projects.
The less glamorous production roles are still the hardest to fill.
Networking, networking, networking.
CraigL
I have been advised by studio actors we are faced with having to deal with hobbists.actors who don't have real goals and don't want to pay their dues to get into the big leagues.
I see this is so when I find out no name actors ducking out of auditions from Indie films to try to get into a studio audition without a resume and little or no acting training. And, these actors end up getting no work.
Their egos get in the way of common sense.
I see this is so when I find out no name actors ducking out of auditions from Indie films to try to get into a studio audition without a resume and little or no acting training. And, these actors end up getting no work.
Their egos get in the way of common sense.
Well if nothing else its good to see that im not the only one facing this problem. Thank yu all for your advice I have taken quite abit of ideas that im eager to give a shot.
Try that local drama club. Also reach out to any other theater alliances or organizations.
Many theater actors have a good sense of commitment. After all, they HAVE to show up or the show doesn't go on!
Also, don't be too hard on yourself, or the actors your working with. I have to say that in my limited experience, getting ten actors together for a shoot can be a challenge, even when you are paying them and planning a few weeks out, never mind week to week!
Here is a link to trailer for one of our short films. You can see a restaurant scene in the there which had four principals (paid) and 15 extras( unpaid) and a bunch of crew. That one day shoot required a lot of coordination in advance to get the actors scheduled.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VszNqZMZ3o
One more thing. Actors are especially motivated, like most everybody, by what is in it for them. Always have a clear outline of what you are doing and what your intention with the project is.
For instance: I am making this film with the intention of submitting it to film festivals.
Do project confidence and a clear goal. "I am making comedy spoof videos because I want to submit it to such and such web series competition."
Also, actors like artistic challenges to rise to: "I want to make a short film that takes place in one room and has no dialogue."
Best of luck. And, yeah, it's a drag when you have actors who aren't into what you're doing. But keep at it!
Many theater actors have a good sense of commitment. After all, they HAVE to show up or the show doesn't go on!
Also, don't be too hard on yourself, or the actors your working with. I have to say that in my limited experience, getting ten actors together for a shoot can be a challenge, even when you are paying them and planning a few weeks out, never mind week to week!
Here is a link to trailer for one of our short films. You can see a restaurant scene in the there which had four principals (paid) and 15 extras( unpaid) and a bunch of crew. That one day shoot required a lot of coordination in advance to get the actors scheduled.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VszNqZMZ3o
One more thing. Actors are especially motivated, like most everybody, by what is in it for them. Always have a clear outline of what you are doing and what your intention with the project is.
For instance: I am making this film with the intention of submitting it to film festivals.
Do project confidence and a clear goal. "I am making comedy spoof videos because I want to submit it to such and such web series competition."
Also, actors like artistic challenges to rise to: "I want to make a short film that takes place in one room and has no dialogue."
Best of luck. And, yeah, it's a drag when you have actors who aren't into what you're doing. But keep at it!
I also see this is true with models too. One of my FaceBook friends who is a professional model was chewing out neophyte wannabe models who were asking her where to go for high paying modelling jobs. She told them they have to pay their dues first. When she broke into the industry, she had to do her first few gigs for free to build a resume and portfolio.
You need to interview them to see what goes through their minds. Are they in it for the art and to make a career of it? Or, are they just looking for a quick buck?
You need to interview them to see what goes through their minds. Are they in it for the art and to make a career of it? Or, are they just looking for a quick buck?
They seriously think its that easy? You just go somewhere where people hand out high paying jobs? And common people on facebook know where these places are?
I want to live in that world.... I want to live in it so hard....
I just read the posts between the model and the wannabes in amazement without posting myself.
As Rayw keeps saying about the common myth, "Make a movie and they will come." That is a myth.
I also read all of these newbies posting on LinkedIn, "I have an idea that is sure to win an Academy Award." In what universe?
We have to hire people very carefully to avoid people like this.
I had an actress duck out on an audition for my last production because she was going to Florida to get in on an audition for a New Line Cinema production. She's not even a union actress and only had roles in Indie shorts. She thinks she can get in without an agent? She's got a lot to learn. But, her ego gets in the way.
This is not a problem just in the film industry. My wife is in retail and they cannot keep good help. People come in and say they want a job and when hired they are always calling out or making excuses why they can't get to work on time. It is a sad sign of the times. I saw the same thing when I was in college (I retired from the Army and was going on my GI Bill). Lazy, unmotivated people that wanted a degree but didn't want to work for it. Being ex-military (I was a Non-Commissioned Officer) I have zero tolerance for people that can't get to work on time or want a job with all the work knocked out of it. There are hard working, dedicated people out there but you will have to dig through a lot of coal to find the diamonds. Be prepared to compensate them for their trouble and reward them for going the extra mile when asked.
Yeah very true ego gets in the way. Not sure if that's my problem here. like I said I live in gods waiting room (Naples Florida) just a bunch of old people waiting to die. so it is some slim pickins, but I can see where you guys are coming from.
I think it's very much an entitlement thing. No one wants to work hard and earn their due.
In some instances it's messed up.
In others it's not.
I got fed up with the notion of getting a director coffee and doing bullshit errands and just made my own feature. Turned out pretty ok and I learned a hell of a lot more about being a director than my friends who are following "the path."
- Jow
In some instances it's messed up.
In others it's not.
I got fed up with the notion of getting a director coffee and doing bullshit errands and just made my own feature. Turned out pretty ok and I learned a hell of a lot more about being a director than my friends who are following "the path."
- Jow
man, in my market a $100 raised up the Craigslist List flag will get me MANY dedicated and interested folks!
This is some good advice. Also try not to blame the talent, instead, find solutions to slow the talent drain from your project (which might be a symptom of something on our end) such as quality script, easy participation, dedication and talent of the filmmakers, etc..
Also? You might be a Roger Corman-type filmmaker or worse (Hi-8 cowboys, anyone?). Every idiot with a camera is a filmmaker these days, imagine it from their perspective. Like a bunch of bad boyfriends making big promises.
Seriously- and you're jaded?
Don't play the blame game, you got better things to do- like making a film.
Always be casting, follow through on what you say you're going to do AND don't take it personally.