This indie flick is gonna be HUGE! check it out...



Have you guys heard of the film 'Seeing Is Believing'.
Just take a look at the trailer on the site and you'll understand.

It's all here:

I just can't wait to see the whole thing!

I read about it in a local paper, and understandably they were praised for the quality of their production considering their budget and indie status.
Also go to the home page ( to find out more about this amazing team, and sign their guest book, they deserve good feedback as they're doing a top job.




All I can say is WOW!
I see what you mean. I love how the teaser creates such suspense and curiosity. The genre is right up my ally too. (though when It comes to indie films sometimes I watch simply because it is an indie I'm that obsessed!).

I have to see this film too, looks fab so far.
My 1st post btw!
Hmm, maybe it was just because it was built up to much, but I wasnt impressed. Nothing stellar hee. Not bad mind you, but not mind knumbing.

I did watch their BTS, and they have some descent equipment, but Im not sure how this will be HUGE. Looks like most descent digital features. My bar might be set a little high though. Watch the trailers at this site.
They started making this when they were 16. I have never seen CGI effects on our level done this well before. Now this, I believe, will be HUGE>

I would still like to check out Seeing is believeing, but their trailers need work. The trailers at the afore mentioned site proves just that.
R. Michael McWhorter


I disagree that the "Seeing Is Believing" trailers need work... they looked fine to me and it did say they were Teasers. It certainly teased us all to talk about it and teased me to want to see more! I dont think it will be huge though... but pretty decent.

As for that other film... from what I saw... it screamed Matrix. But it did look pretty good... i noticed they had a budget which according to that other film's faq section, they make it for nothing... so I think we should cut them some slack... Seeing Is Beliving looks pretty original to me.

Does anyone know what that thing was under the camera on the BTS of Seeing Is Believing?

As for that other film... from what I saw... it screamed Matrix.
Your absolutley right, it did scream "Matrix", and this is something I usually frown upon. Un original re-makes, or "fan films" seem silly, and wasteful, but after reading the synopsis for this film, i was blown away.

The idea is, there is a young girl who suffers from multiple persanality disorder. Sort of a Jekyle, and Hyde kind of thing. The only difference is, her Hyde, is a guy. Most of the movie takes place within her imagination, and all her violent outburst are spawned by violence she has viewed in the medis. Hence, the Matrix. I like this, for the same reason I originally enjoyed the Matrix. I love the idea of people flipping around, doing 20 kicks, ect, but I hate movies that simply say, "Yeah, this guy can do that. Why? I dont know, because he can. Just shut up and watch the movie."
The Matrix told you why. In the same respect, these kids are ripping off the Matrix, but explaining why. This girl is sick, with an over active imagination. Hence the severe bullet time exageration, and the fly.

BTW, if you have only watched the 30 second teaser, and not the 3 minute one, you are SERIOUSLY missing out!! Like I said, if you cant watch it at their site, you can catch it at by searching for girl(boy) Everything about it screams hollywood trailer, from the text, to the sound effects, and music mix, to editing. A truly top notch job.

I disagree that the "Seeing Is Believing" trailers need work... they looked fine to me and it did say they were Teasers. It certainly teased us all to talk about it and teased me to want to see more! I dont think it will be huge though... but pretty decent.
I just wasnt impressed. Not because I thought they needed to "keep up" with stuff like these other kids were doing, but because it ws hyped, then fell short. It didnt leave me "wanting more" it didnt "tease me"
"Kid grabs other kid, says something about killing someone (in scary voice) and says hell kill him if he dosent bring, blah, blah, blah." That just wasnt doing it. I was more impressed by the BTS just because they seemed ambitious, and dedicated. I wish them luck, andf would be more than happy to watch their flick. My point, was just that it can be dangerous to over hype your film. Saying stuff like, "Its going to be HUGE" Makes people examine you under a much stronger microscope. Remember, if people expect nothing, they are more likley to be pleased with the final product.
Does anyone know what that thing was under the camera on the BTS of Seeing Is Believing?
I want to say its made by Glidecam. If not them, then a similar company. It is basically just a weighted camera unit, with an LCD screen at the bottom. It makes for smooth "stedi cam" type shots. That model only works with lighter cameras ( a Canon XL1, for example, would be too hevy, although a GL1 might work) I think it cost a little though, mainly due to the screen, but if you have the right sized camera, and want to do some smooth shots, might be worth a look. Plus, look at the simple weighted glidecam system at the glidecam website. Its only about $200, and if you have a GL1, or another camera with a flip out LCD screen, you can get some great shots. I use it with an XL1, and though your arm gets tired quickly, it does get great stuff.
R. Michael mcWhorter


Hi Folks...

My name is James and I'm one of the producers on Seeing Is Believing and I founded "I.L.F Productions" one of the guys above emailed me about this discussion and I'd thought I'd add what I could.

To answer "ihaveakitchen's" question...
The device under the cam is a Steadicam JR (note the spelling). It's an official Steadicam made by the same guys that make the big rigs... it is indeed more expensive than Glidecam - personally I dont like the Glidecam... It will fly the Canon XM1 and XM2 (PAL versions of GL1/2) and yes, chances are it will not fly an XL1 although it will fly cams upto 6.5 pounds despite the specs saying 4 pounds.
I'd recommend a Steadicam over Glidecam any day and I'd say your better off searching for a DV Steadicam on eBay than getting the Glidecam if you want to use an XL1. Thats my view... just go with what you can afford. I've never tried Glidecam... but I wasn't impressed by the video and/or website.

Thanks for all your comments... we take everyone's opinion in and we understand that we can't impress everyone. Thanks for taking the time to view our trailers.

TizzyEntertainment said:
My point, was just that it can be dangerous to over hype your film. Saying stuff like, "Its going to be HUGE" Makes people examine you under a much stronger microscope.
I'd like to make it clear that no one who is apart of the film has ever said "It's going to be HUGE". This is the view of someone who has an interest in us and that is there opinion and doesn't reflect that of me or my company.

Thanks -- James.
I understand that James, as I have felt others have "over hyped" my work before, as well. In reflection, my post seem a little harsh. This was not my intention. I commend you for tackling such an ambitious undertaking as, making a film. Is it planned to be a feature? Running time? Either way, so many talk, and never do. You guys are doing, and that is whats important.

The reason I had a problem with that post, was more the idea many "New to film making" folks have. If it looks ok, its gonna be HUGE. That just isnt the case. Many crappy films have been huge, and many that were amazing never went anywhere. Id say the most determining factor was the the old, "Its not what you know, its who you know". If you have connections, you can sell a bad film, but often, good film makers know no one, and as a result, never "make it". Just keep at it, youll do fine.

If you dont mind my asking, how much did the Stedicam JR set you back? I have used the Glidecam, and it workse well enough, but can be a hastle. Just curious.

Good luck.
R. Michael McWhorter


IndieTalk Founder
Staff Member
Please respect the IndieTalk community.

Catatonic, and Indimindi are both posting from the same IP address.

I can understand you wanting to "hype" your own project, but please don't create second users and create "fake" hype.

This can be misleading to the forum.

Thanks, and enjoy the forum.

Good Luck!
The hype about seeisbelieving

It's all about self promoting yourself guys and I admire that.
When I read the topic I wanted to see the hype as well and I'll say this
they got a response and that's what counts be it positive or not.
Now as being a professional in the business I will agree that it does need
some polishing up and for what they are using it's not bad I've seen worst
on the shelves of video stores that I said to myself the distribution company must be desperate and need all the pennies they can get.
But for them being young it's a start.
I have nothing bad to say about it at all.
Just make your trailer more exciting do faster cuts and fades add a flash
transition to make it more suspensefull.
Just do what you feel.
Well put Director. Hey fellas, if nothing else, notice this thread has gotten moe responses than anyother here at Indietalk. Thats an accomplishment in itself. I had listed the trailer for the other flick, more as an example of what can be done at this level. The style, and method of that trailer, wouldnt apply to the story you are telling, but it does have a certain level of professionalisim. (I speak of the 3 minute teaser. The 30 second one is simply eye candy, nothing more) I wish you guys luck, and if you cut another trailer, I will certainly be one of the first in line to see it.
R. Michael McWhorter


Uh, FYI the fact that we're using the same connection could be a reason!
He's my brother.

An apology would be nice. :?
It's not about apologizing


It's not about apologizing in this business.
Take this scenario you go and see a flick or rent one at a local video store
and it's not very good the director is not going to send you an
apology it was your choice to watch his/her film it's the same thing here.
You made a comment on a trailer that your brother happened to make and it got critigued by others that are filmmakers this is how it works.
Don't take it personal learn from it.
It's all about getting input that can be helpful later.
Listen everyone thinks there production is the best I myself included but,
without feedback from the people that are going to view your work
you'll remain personally bias and not open to suggestions.
So I don't think anyone here is personally trying to insult your brother's
work. They commented on what they saw and I posted earlier that I had nothing bad to say about it just that it needs to be edited tighter and add
effects that can show the stronger dimentions of the scenes.
And I assume you guys are from London?
I choreographed the "Dru Hill" video shot in London 3 years ago and 2 years before that the group East-17 from the east end of London.
I've also done "DMX's Ruff Ryders" video with "EVE"so trust me you're getting good free advice.

Phillywood Entertainment



When I said an apology was in order, it was targeted at the accusations that I was pretending to be two people in a sleazy attempt to plug the film.

Of coarse all opinions and views are welcome. I have no problem there!

I would like to also stress that I am not affiliated with the ILF indie films company, and neither is my brother. I believe some people here still think so.

The misconception was such a simple mistake to make anyway (with the circumstacial evidence about the IP addresses!), and so I don't really expect an apology! besides, those who commented about it were'nt negative at all.

I also admit that the comment about the film being 'huge' was an exaggeration. I doubt it will dominate the world!, but I just looked extreemly interesting to me (plus my brother), and putting into account their budget etc, and still looking exciting and good quality (at least to me!) I got a bit too excited in my vocabulary.

I think the first official cyber-brawl of has come to an end! :wink:
LOL. Good to see this isnt going to become one of THOSE message boards. I have spoken with the film makers via e-mail, and they seem like very cool, very dedicated folks. I wish them all the best, and look forward to seeing their film.
R. Michael McWhorter


anyways, i think it looks interesting. something i'd see. :)
That quote is about the trailer for Girl(boy)14 ( ) Watch both of their trailers. It blows away anything, and everything at (Although i really like "Art Of The Saber" Not so much for effects, as for film making, and fight coreography.) Alot of the stuff on force was done with alamdv. These kids had to take some effects programs, and create plug ins, in order to accomplish what they did (Example: There is a bullet time effect in the bathroom. They had to take pictures of every angle of said bathroom, and create a digital room from their pics, and measurements. Yo wouldnt be ale to tell that the background isnt really the bathroom upon viewing.) I will check out those two shorts though.
R. Michael McWhorter
I did check them both out, and I'd say that Duality was just as good if not better...some of Duality's matte lines could have been better, but the trailers for girl(Boy) could've really used some motion blur to blend the CG into the background a little more realistically. I'm not saying that the trailers were'nt good, they were great, I'm just saying they're not really groundbreaking...