Self distribution

Hey !

I completely new to this forum and also completely new to film making ! And as a newbie, even if I haven't done anything significant for the moment, just some shorts with friend to learn a bit, I am wondering about distribution...

What do you think of service like www.caachi.com or www.createspace.com for self distribution ? What are the main advantages/drawbacks ? Is it effective ? Does this really simplify the process of distribution ?

Thx in advance for your answer.
 
The 55% is very high. Amazon's jusification is that they are acting like the distributor and therefore taking the distributor's cut. What I did was list "BAZOOKAS: The Movie" on the Amazon Advantage program (that's the 55% one) for $19.99 but then also listed it under the merchants program for $17.99. Hopefully, when someone wants to buy the movie they will see it's also available from someone other than Amazon for a couple bucks less. Under the Merchant program I get almost full price in my bank acct.

So far FilmBaby hasn't yielded results. I'm not sure what kind of traffic they get there and I'm starting to think it's a waste of time.

I currently setting up downloads via Amazon/Create Space but it takes them 60 days! Not so great.

And of course, the movie is available on my site http://www.bazookasthemovie.com where I have made the most sales and get the most money.
 
The 55% is very high. Amazon's jusification is that they are acting like the distributor and therefore taking the distributor's cut. What I did was list "BAZOOKAS: The Movie" on the Amazon Advantage program (that's the 55% one) for $19.99 but then also listed it under the merchants program for $17.99. Hopefully, when someone wants to buy the movie they will see it's also available from someone other than Amazon for a couple bucks less. Under the Merchant program I get almost full price in my bank acct.

So far FilmBaby hasn't yielded results. I'm not sure what kind of traffic they get there and I'm starting to think it's a waste of time.

I currently setting up downloads via Amazon/Create Space but it takes them 60 days! Not so great.

And of course, the movie is available on my site http://www.bazookasthemovie.com where I have made the most sales and get the most money.

As far as downloadable films...what do you feel about that? What about the idea that you're making it that much easier to copy/transfer films to bit torrents and friends and such?

I know savvy people can do that anyway...but making it digital distro is like doing half the job for the pirates correct?
 
So far FilmBaby hasn't yielded results. I'm not sure what kind of traffic they get there and I'm starting to think it's a waste of time.
Let me confirm it for you. It IS a waste of time. NOBODY shops on FilmBaby for movies. The only way you'll get sales on their site is if YOU direct customers to the site from your home site (which would be pointless). Amazon and iTunes account for 77% of CD sales. I'm sure DVD sales are similar, with DVD Planet, Deep Discount DVD, Wal-Mart.com, and other BIG sites picking up the rest of the 23%. The only thing that FilmBaby can offer is to get your DVD into Super D's distribution system. However if you ever walked into a store like Blockbuster or Fry's you'd see that they really don't carry no-name indie DVD's, so it's basically a waste of money to sign up with FilmBaby for the purpose of getting into Super D's system.
As far as downloadable films...what do you feel about that? What about the idea that you're making it that much easier to copy/transfer films to bit torrents and friends and such?
You're supposed to post decoys. Decoys frustrate illegal downloaders. PirateBay is about the only site that won't remove content if you ask.
 
I mainly do it for two reasons: I can get added to IMDB easier, and in my business plan for feature film projects I can honestly say my films have been released on DVD.

Hi Thunderclap, am very interested to hear more about this. I have a blog that does case studies on filmmakers who are distibuting & monetising their projects differently to the traditional model so other indie content creators can copy successful indie film/art business plans, rather than starve ;)

If you (or anyone else reading this) could give me more info on your project, include timelines, ball park figures, links to pics / trailers / website, and explain how it ties into your greater plan, I'd love to promote it on my blog. yetanotherstrugglingwriter.blogspot.com

Thanks :)
 
$300 to get my movie on iTunes? I'll PASS at this point in time. I've sold like 2 downloads on FlickRocket - and that's with a link from my home site. More than 99% of my customers are ordering DVD's before they are downloading off my FlickRocket digital download link. People just haven't warmed up to downloading (as they have with music CD's). I think the future is On-Demand movies that you can order off your TV set. People don't like to download movies to watch on their computer or to burn to CD at this point in time -- at least in significant numbers.
 
$300 to get my movie on iTunes? I'll PASS at this point in time. I've sold like 2 downloads on FlickRocket - and that's with a link from my home site. More than 99% of my customers are ordering DVD's before they are downloading off my FlickRocket digital download link. People just haven't warmed up to downloading (as they have with music CD's). I think the future is On-Demand movies that you can order off your TV set. People don't like to download movies to watch on their computer or to burn to CD at this point in time -- at least in significant numbers.

Exactly. The changing point is going to be when internet streams seemlessly with your HDTV--this way people can either on-demand or download through their HDTVs. This will change the industry. At least I'm hoping.
 
Just an update on what's happening with "BAZOOKAS: The Movie"

We are now on Amazon's Video on Demand (through CreateSpace) and so far so good. For the first 2 weeks we were actually in the top 10 of several comedy categories. We dropped off a bit this week but still in the 20's as of today and I'm hoping it bounces back up the chart.

The download to own is $9.99 and the rental is $2.99. I'm hoping a high ranking meant high numbers but I have no idea. That's my complaint so far dealing with CreateSpace -- nothing is Real Time. i have to wait a month after sales to see any numbers. Other than that they have been good to work with. It's really easy to get someone on the phone and they follow up with emails from the rep you talked to.

Here is the link of BAZOOKAS on Amazon's VOD if you're interested. This week I'll try to get my trailer up instead of the first 2 minutes of the movie.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470939291&pf_rd_i=507846


Thanks,
Mike Leonard
 
"BAZOOKAS: The Movie"
Sex always sells! A good box cover sells too! Just looking at your cover I'm thinking it could be a National Lampoon release. Do you also sell DVD's through Amazon's Advantage program? What is the ratio of your sales (on-demand as a % VS hard copy DVD sales)?
 
We are currently looking for other filmmakers who wish to market their films if you or anyone else is interested. Everyone is right, you NEED marketing to sell any film. The majority of people, even if they see it on an amazon search aren't going to look at your film because either 1) they have never heard of it and it has no famous actors in it or 2) the artwork doesn't attract them.

Marketing isn't simple and I believe all of us independent filmmakers need to band together and help each other out. You need to put your film out there to people, but to do that you have to have money. As the old saying goes, you need money to make money. To completely market your film for free it's nearly impossible, sure some people might see it but not enough to make a difference. By all means you could call the police and tell them your son is in a balloon that's floating away, that might give you some free marketing, just make sure your son is holding a copy of your film and the film is what made him survive. You need a professional marketing campaign, if you are serious about distributing your film, you have to take it seriously and sit down and write out a marketing plan and look for money to market it. Filmmakers usually don't make good distributors because there is such a vast difference from artistic ability to business ability. To self distribute you have to have a keen sense of business knowledge. If you don't you need to find another distribution resource.

Like I said at the beginning, we offer some marketing opportunities to independent filmmakers looking to self distribute. If your interested send me a message with your email. If we all work together we will help each other and everyone will succeed.
 
What if my son puts ME in a balloon?
M1chae1 you are on the right page. The only way an indie filmmaker can promote their indie film is to look for ways to get FREE press, airplay, etc.

I can tell you that in the world of CD marketing, a dollar spent on advertising will get you about 2 cents in profits. Print ads are a waste. I know this from experience as well as from reading a CD distribution book by Tim Sweeney. DVD movie marketing is no different unless you're promoting a big blockbuster that looks like a 20 million dollar movie and will be in theaters.

The difficulty in trying to get free publicity is that radio stations can't and don't "air" DVD movies - they play movies, comedy CD's, etc. What does that leave you with aside from Internet promotion? Dream up something like putting a kid in a balloon.

Sorry I know of people who have thrown away lots money promoting indie product. Waste of money. It's very high stakes when you start throwing money at advertising.
 
It's no secret. You have to bust your a$$ and make it happen. Reach out and grab people.

# 1 - It all boils down to this... CONTENT.

You have to make a film that is worthy of watching. I've seen so many of these art house flicks that are boring as hell. When you try and tell the filmmaker that it's boring they get defensive. If you want to make a film that sells then it has to be good. It has to be marketable. It has to APPEAL to an audience.

If you are complaining that nobody is interested in watching your 70 minute movie about a guy who smokes and watched people and admires the sky.... then stop making those kinds of movies.

SO... RULE NUMBER 1. CONTENT. CONTENT. CONTENT. Make it good. Make it have appeal. Make it hook the audience...

# 2 - Another key to self distribution is engaging the audience... If I asked everybody to post their real names and the names of their films on this thread, I bet my life that the average person out there has NEVER heard of you or your film before. So, if Joe Schmo out there has never heard of you or your film, why would they care to watch it???

You have to engage them. As someone else mentioned in another thread. Social Media is a great tool for this. START UP A BLOG. Post daily about your experience on set. Post about the problems you've experienced making the movie. Engage the audience in the process. Not just the finished product. It's the only way you're going to get people to give a sh!t about you or your film.

SO... RULE NUMBER 2. ENGAGE. Don't just make a film and throw it at someone and expect them to want to watch it. Give them a reason to watch it. If a person watches the hard times and the blood and sweat put into making that project. They are going to want to see what all the fuss is about and they are going to want to watch what the heck you've been filming. ENGAGE, ENGAGE. ENGAGE!!!

# 3 - Reach out to everyone. Do the homework and find the people who enjoy watching films. Make a twitter account. Start blabbing away about movies and how you are making a movie and you'll be amazed at the people who will start following you. Here's a TIP. There's a search function on twitter. Click in that little search box and type in film, movies, independent film, etc. etc. Every single person out of the millions on twitter who are talking about what you just searched will show up on the list. Find the people who are talking about film and reach out to them. Don't spam them and say, Hey, watch and buy my sh!t. Instead talk to them first. Find out what the heck they like in films. Engage in conversation. Talk about how you are a filmmaker, etc. etc. There curiosity will get the best of them and boom. You just made a dvd sell...

It all boils down to this. You don't need these middle men. Amazon, Itunes, blah blah blah to be the tools you use to sell your film.

Make a website, www.whatever.com for 40 bucks a year and sell your movie on there with the above tips.
I have a ton of free tips to use that will get people interested. It's just a matter of doing the work and getting it done.

I'm going to be starting my short film coming up in the next month. I'm filming a short film about a marooned astronaut. How do I plan on gaining people's interest!? I'm turning my entire living room into a space shuttle. You're not going to be able to tell if I filmed this in my living room or in outer space. That's how. When people aim for big, I'm aiming for bigger. That's how you're going to get shit done...

People talk about getting funding for their short films, etc. I made a psychological war drama on 600 dollars... The production value is through the roof considering the tools we had to use. See for yourself...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e5fn3MKrGQ

If anyone one wants to dive into more conversation, please. Hit me up, e-mail me, call me. I;m all for it. I live for this sh!t!!! :)

Best,
The Opus Fuller

--------------------------------
http://www.twitter.com/theopusfuller
http://www.theopusfuller.com
 
Mr. Fuller,

Your short was fantastic. Very well photographed, and an interesting story...one some of us may be able to relate to through our parents (my father was a vet).

I thought the camera work was very skilled, and unlike many indie films out there, I found the use of DOF and rack-focus in your piece appropriate and well executed. What camera did you use?

I specifically liked the war-time footage...very gritty...very cool.

Nice short. Was this shot in Germany, or the states?

And back on topic...what you have to say about distribution (or successfull distribution) is on the money. Well said.

Cheers.
 
M1chae1,

Thank you so much for checking out Germanity. But yeah, I agree... No matter what your beliefs are or who you are... Everyone bleeds the same color. We're all people.

We used a simple DVX 100 camera. M2 lense adapter with some Nikon lenses. That's it. I proved to myself you don't need a fancy Red camera, a 16/35mm camera or whatever other expensive camera that's out there to shoot a film. You can rent a 40 or 60 dollar DVX and go to town.

No, it was shot in Pennsylvania. The war scenes were shot in Brownsville, PA. I just happened to find a great spot... The bedroom/church/birthday cake scenes were shot in Punxy, PA. Home of the legendary Phil the groundhog. The rest was shot in Pittsburgh. Like the abstract classroom scene, etc.

I agree. It really is on the money. Because 90% of getting your film seen, self distributing and selling it is HUSTLE HUSTLE HUSTLE. You have to get out there and grab it. I made this short in 2007 and just sat on the damn thing for Three years. I submitted it to a couple festivals where it got great praise and that was that. I didn't have money to keep sending it out and I let it collect dust. Now I'm back on the saddle and am making it happen. I just got interviewed by an awesome start-up site called SOCIAL NOIR. http://socialnoir.com if anyone is interested in checking it out when it's up...


2010 is the year I'm making it happen. For real!

M1chae1 - Are you from NY?
 
Opus - I'm in Rhode Island right now.

One key thing filmmakers need to do (if self distributing) is to send a shit ton of screeners out to DVD-review sites. Hopefully your film is good and scores positive reviews...from these reviews, you should receive traffic and sales. The more positive reviews, the more sales.

If you have distribution from a 3rd-party, and they are worth a damn, they will send out these screener copies, and you won't have to worry about it...you'll just have to kick back and watch the reviews role in.

Ok OK...you shouldn't just kick back. You yourself should still be going on myriad film/dvd sites and getting the info out to numerous communities. And I know it takes time, but instead of just showing up and having your first post be a promotion...I suggest you take the time to form relationships in these communities...so when you *do* post a promotion, people are more likely to take notice and care about it...even support you (by purchase or word of mouth).

Also, I highly suggest you four-wall a few local theaters...and make sure you advertise. Flier the hell out of the surrounding towns...post on local community forums if there are any. If your film is decent, word will spread. Talk to local newspapers, get a write up or review. If you can't seem to make a profit off of limited theatrical...stop showing it. If you *are* making a profit...pocket that money for your next feature.

Just make sure you keep busy. Banking on one short or feature to 'get you noticed' isn't realistic. The best thing *I've* found from studying all of the local companies in our area, is the most known companies are the companies that shoot quick, release a DVD, and move on to the next movie. It's not about getting rich. It's about recouping the monies you spend on your previous feature, and making enough to start your next feature. The less you spend, the more likely you'll be able to keep this process going, and the more likely you'll make a name for yourself.

Make sure you're getting the best bang for your buck...you don't need 20K...or 100K to make a successful film. Our last film was made for 7K, and it's being distributed nationally, and was in the positive even before the DVD release (ironically which is today). We profited from the dozen theatrical releases we put together, and made enough money to shoot our next feature (which is in post already).

You have to know when to move on and get your next project moving...but you also have to know that every project deserves a strong push, and a chance for public consumption. But don't dwell on it...sell it and move on. Making feature after feature is the best way to make a name for yourself, and in return, a great way to make money for your next feature.

Trust me...shooting a 100K feature on the RED is far less likely to make money than shooting a 10K production. Just make sure that 10K production is very well put together. A great example is Opus' recent post...his short was cheap, but looked better than some 20K shorts I've seen...go figure. :) Sweat equity folks...surround yourself with talented people who believe in the project...costs can be easily cut in half this way. Because the DVD market sucks right now, it's incredibly difficult (and rare) to make profit on anything over [let's say] 20K. Unless you're extremely lucky (i.e. Paranormal Activity), you're probably not going to recoup your money on 'independent' level projects that cost 20K-100K...and even higher than that...1 million dollar pictures have to be awesome, with a tight audience before they recoup their monies.

Keep it cheap, keep it fast...but don't skimp on quality.

[EDIT: if for some reason you have a rich uncle, or solid financial backing in general, and you *are* able to create million dollar films whenever you desire...well...ignore what I'm saying, because you should have people doing all this shit for you.]

Thanks for listening.
 
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One key thing filmmakers need to do (if self distributing) is to send a shit ton of screeners out to DVD-review sites. Hopefully your film is good and scores positive reviews...from these reviews, you should receive traffic and sales. The more positive reviews, the more sales.

Can you recommend a few good film review sites?

Most of the ones I have found are never updated and others have a backlog until the end of time.
 
Can you recommend a few good film review sites?

Most of the ones I have found are never updated and others have a backlog until the end of time.

Well...the ones I know are mostly for horror films, but I'm sure there are a lot out there that review in general. Horror is lucky enough to have a ton of bustling communities and websites.

* Arrow in the Head (Joblo)
* Cinema Suicide
* Fangoria
* Rue Morgue
* Killingboxx
* DVD Pub
* DVD Talk
* Independent Corner (podcast on BlogTalkRadio)
* Film Arcade
* Dread Central

These are sites that have reviewed our DVDs. Not all of them are horror...but some are genre sites only.

If you want links to these, go to my personal PRESS page for examples: http://www.michaelreedactor.com/Press.html
 
HedgePictures - I can chime in if you'd like...

There are tons.

dvdtalk.com
aintitcoolnews.com
joblo.com

just to name a few.

You just need to search and put the time in. Don't just go to review sites. Go to message board forums. Usually message board about Movies/DVDs tend to have a section in the forum strickly for reviews. Get to know those people. Reach out. Discuss...

If you add value, people will listen. People will engage in conversation. For instance, I stumbled upon this community by accident and thought it was great, I signed up and made a post and M1chae1 posted back to me. He obviously found some value in what I had to say and we dove right into conversation.

Value, Hustle and Staying in it for the long run is the steps that are going to make your Indy Film career a success.
 
Very interesting discussion here.

I am self-distributing, and not using anything except my own site with e-commerce and another site a guy built to sell and rent films.

Netflix doesn't pay royalties? Scratch that then.

Amazon keeps the majority of the money, scratch. Of course, I could use Create Space, but wait, you have to mail them copies of your film (and only want a few at a time), then they have to turn right back around and mail it to the customer and take a cut. (at least that's what I read) So I ask, why do that when the customer can just buy straight from you and you keep the profit?

Yes you have to work hard to get the word out, etc. But you had to work hard to make the dang thing, why not keep working hard and promote it? After all, shouldn't you make the money? It's your work.

And sell to a distributor? Well, I can't really do that either...unless they have a reasonable offer and pay it up front.

Say what you will folks, but I'll go ahead and admit, I'm stubborn as hell. If I work my ass off to make something, damn if I'll turn around and give it away.

So yeah, I had 1000 copies made and sent to my doorstep. I'll work hard to get the word out and sell them.

Bootlegging? Oh yeah, I've already had a few rounds with some sites. And who knows how many hack copies are out there already. Part of the business I guess.

Oh, and someone pointed out, "how many people do you see going to "xxxxx" site to buy movies?"

I rest my case.
 
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