My short film got delayed, how do I keep my actors?

H

harmonica44

I was suppose to shoot in a few days but an emergency came up with the DP and he has to leave for about a month or so. We had all the dates to shoot and everything. Now there are two things. I can keep those dates, in which case the free working actors will likely stick to them and help me finish it. Or I can tell the actors that we will have to wait till he gets better. His cinematography was really good and actually looked cinematic. Most of mine looks home video-ish for the most part still. Plus he was going to give my film a certain look, where as I don't know how to give a movie a certain look, as oppose to the look the camera just so happens to give it.

I want to make it the best I can and hopefully be film festival worthy, if it turns out good enough. But if I ask the actors to hold off till he gets back (if he comes back), then I risk losing them, and they are really good actors! So which is the safest thing to do to guarantee it gets done. This is my third attempt to make a short, and have people having to leave on me. The sound guy already left on this third attempt, leaving me to figure it out for myself, just weeks before shooting, but now the DP is gone too, for now, at least. So should I shoot it myself to prove I can get it done, or risk losing out on a third attempt, and thus possibly giving more of a bad impression to potential people in the business?
 
Sort by date Sort by votes
harmonica44 said:
I was suppose to shoot in a few days but an emergency came up with the DP and he has to leave for about a month or so. We had all the dates to shoot and everything. Now there are two things. I can keep those dates, in which case the free working actors will likely stick to them and help me finish it. Or I can tell the actors that we will have to wait till he gets better. His cinematography was really good and actually looked cinematic. Most of mine looks home video-ish for the most part still. Plus he was going to give my film a certain look, where as I don't know how to give a movie a certain look, as oppose to the look the camera just so happens to give it.

I want to make it the best I can and hopefully be film festival worthy, if it turns out good enough. But if I ask the actors to hold off till he gets back (if he comes back), then I risk losing them, and they are really good actors! So which is the safest thing to do to guarantee it gets done. This is my third attempt to make a short, and have people having to leave on me. The sound guy already left on this third attempt, leaving me to figure it out for myself, just weeks before shooting, but now the DP is gone too, for now, at least. So should I shoot it myself to prove I can get it done, or risk losing out on a third attempt, and thus possibly giving more of a bad impression to potential people in the business?
Click to expand...

I would do whatever you have to do to get it done on the current schedule. Call a friend and see if they can fill in as a camera op for you (or a boom op if you're more comfortable handling the camera yourself). A friend who's good at still photography would probably make at least a passable camera op for your first short (much of the principles are the same as far as composition).

Have you read the DSLR Cinematography guide yet? If not, go download it and read it. It will help.

Also, face up to the fact that your first short has a pretty good chance of sucking. Be okay with that. My first was so horrible I was embarrassed to let my husband watch it. But I figured out why it sucked and I'm hoping my next one will be a lot better. Don't be afraid to fail, just make sure that you learn from your mistakes so your next effort will be a lot better.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Thanks I will try to get most of it read. I've been so busy getting everything ready for the short and practicing shooting and sound as well, that I haven't read anything on that stuff. Well I have a friend who seems not bad with still photography who offered to help. Kinda sucky though, cause this guy is good. Well what makes a better impression to actors and to people who know me in the business? The fact that I can get a short done on time, or the fact that I can get it done with a more experienced DP and sound person?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0 Downvote
harmonica44 said:
Well I have a friend who seems not bad with still photography who offered to help. Kinda sucky though, cause this guy is good. Well what makes a better impression to actors and to people who know me in the business? The fact that I can get a short done on time, or the fact that I can get it done with a more pro DP and sound person?
Click to expand...

I would say that you can get it done on time. Otherwise, you just seem like yet another wannabe filmmaker who talks about making a film but never actually gets it done.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
DO NOT RESCHEDULE YOUR SHOOT!

Every film will have similar obstacle. Somebody wont show up, you ll break your gear, or you ll run out of money. Get over it, pick up the camera, and shoot it yourself.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Alright. Well I'm having a meeting with my actors in a few days to go over the film, the scenes, and their characters etc. I can level with them and maybe ask them what they want to do? If they would rather wait or shoot on the original schedule. I can still keep the original schedule and not level with them. I know it will suck but they are really seeming to look up to me, and I don't want to make an even more sucky film, cause making a movie without proper resources, on a desperate attempt to get it done in time, will show, in the final result. I just don't want it to suck even more than it already has to.

But if keeping the schedule is the better way to go, then I will. I will try to download that book, and read articles on getting certain looks for a film, and try to pass it onto a friend who can shoot it.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
harmonica44 said:
Alright. Well I'm having a meeting with my actors in a few days to go over the film, the scenes, and their characters etc. I can level with them and maybe ask them what they want to do? If they would rather wait or shoot on the original schedule. I can still keep the original schedule and not level with them. I know it will suck but they are really seeming to look up to me, and I don't want to make an even more sucky film, cause making a movie without proper resources, on a desperate attempt to get it done in time, will show, in the final result. I just don't want it to suck even more than it already has to.

But if keeping the schedule is the better way to go, then I will. I will try to download that book, and read articles on getting certain looks for a film, and try to pass it onto a friend who can shoot it.
Click to expand...

are you the one who is organizing this shoot?
I dont think you should tell your crew about these problems. Id just say "There were few changes, but I believe they re for the better" even if you dont think so yourself. I would NEVER tell my crew that my movie is going to "suck", and ask what they want to do. I know that my crew is there because they WANT to shoot it.
you re the leader of your crew. Sorry to tell you this, and i dont want to sound like an asshole, but if you dont have leader qualities - step aside, and help around the set, because you ll be just wasting everybodys time.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Yes I am the director and producer. Well I won't telll them. I just want to get into the business, but since I can't get a crew to stick after a few attempts, and have to do everything myself, I donn't want to build a bad reputation on that, and have these good actors not want to work with me again, if it turns out too sucky. That's what I am ultimately worried about. I won't tell them, but what good is acting confident if the result is incompetence on my part?
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
If it's a reputation you're worried about the only thing you have to worry about is that you're not seen as a flake. Luckily it sounds like you've been talked down from rescheduling. Yes your project may not look the same as what you had originally planned but it will get shot, you will learn from it (likely more) and that will help you grow and make your next one better. Above all else, do not reschedule.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
harmonica44 said:
Yes I am the director and producer. Well I won't telll them. I just want to get into the business, but since I can't get a crew to stick after a few attempts, and have to do everything myself, I donn't want to build a bad reputation on that, and have these good actors not want to work with me again, if it turns out too sucky. That's what I am ultimately worried about. I won't tell them, but what good is acting confident if the result is incompetence on my part?
Click to expand...

You know what's going to make actors want to work with you again? A good experience and a reasonably decent film. If you make it a good experience, and by that I mean that you need to treat your actors with respect, don't flip out over things, and handle problems that come up with diplomacy and care, then people will want to work with you.

They'll remember it as a positive experience, and even if the end result isn't perfect, and isn't the most fantastic short, they won't think badly of you (and if they do, they're assholes you probably wouldn't want to work with in the future).

I'm assuming that you've told your crew and actors that you're a first-time producer/director, so they're probably not expecting much to begin with.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Let's face it harmonica (or can I call you Ryan?) the alternative to staying on schedule isn't shooting it at another time, it's not shooting it at all.

Ever since you started talking about finally shooting your 'first short film' I think we've all been expecting some excuse, like this one, to pop up. It may well be a perfectly valid excuse but it's the sortr of set back that all filmmakers face all the time.

So, yes, you can reschedule and push things back and bury your head in the sand- but this film will never get made. It might not be a masterpiece but a decent short film is a better calling card than piss all, which is the realistic alternative.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Get out there and shoot! Don't worry about the no-shows. Don't act confident, be confident. You'll never please everyone, and politeness and having fun on set will encourage people to come back more than however it turns out. If they're working for free they're newish too.

Have fun with it man.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Well just so long as they wanna come back even though the film will suck. The DP might be able to make it for the last two scenes though. Should I let him take over from there or will it look weird for if a short film the last two scenes are shot completely different from the first two? It probably won't be good enough to submit to anyone anyway though I guess.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
harmonica44 said:
Well just so long as they wanna come back even though the film will suck. The DP might be able to make it for the last two scenes though. Should I let him take over from there or will it look weird for if a short film the last two scenes are shot completely different from the first two? It probably won't be good enough to submit to anyone anyway though I guess.
Click to expand...

It's fine that you feel that you have to ask so many questions before you make your film. But I'll give you one piece of advice, in the event that you're not really paying anybody. If you're paying them, then this advice does not apply, because people will generally do what you want them to do when you pay them.

You're probably not going to pay any attention to this advice, but I'm gonna give it to you anyway.

On your film set, there can be only one boss. ONE boss. That's it. If you go up to somebody and say, "hey, what's the best way to do such and such?" you're going to lose your cast and your crew. They're going to immediately form an opinion that you don't know what you're doing. And then you'll come back here and say that you were abandoned. You don't want that to happen.

Here's the best advice I'll give you and I read it in a book. Filmmakers generally tend to be artistic types and are not alpha male characters who naturally command any given situation which involves other human beings. But you HAVE to do that for your movie. Now how do you do that if that is not your natural deportment? You have to learn to do it, by doing little things.

For instance, if somebody comes up to you and says, "hey Ryan, should we point the camera into the sun or away from the sun?" and if your response is "what do you think?" or "let me think about that," you will lose your people. You have to make a decision immediately. It may be the wrong decision, but you have to make it. Let's say you say "into the sun." Then you go and you think about it and if you think "away from the sun" is a better decision, then you come back and "change" your decision. It's your movie. You can change your decision anytime. But you can't keep asking people for advice. And you can't be thinking about things all the time. You have to KNOW what you're going to do at what time. You have to be aware of what shots haven't been shot but that you need.

Now everybody here has their own experience and will not agree with the above advice. But I stick to this rule on my set with a vengeance. I know what I'm doing on my set, and I'm a little bit of a dick (in real life, I'm quite a nice guy, laid back and very personable), because I don't allow discussions or conversations on my decisions. If somebody comes and says to me "hey Aveek, how about we shoot this scene first?" or "hey Aveek, how about we shoot from this other angle instead?" I nod my head and consider it and then I say yes or no. Most of the time it's no. and once I make the decision, all further conversation is a waste of time, and is therefore not allowed.


Make the movie. If your DP can't make it, because of an illness, then go spend time with your DP or somebody else and figure out how you should light and shoot it. It's not an impossible task. It can only be a very "interesting" task, one you should be only excited to learn and execute on your own.

Best of luck!!
Aveek
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0 Downvote
trueindie said:
It's fine that you feel that you have to ask so many questions before you make your film. But I'll give you one piece of advice, in the event that you're not really paying anybody. If you're paying them, then this advice does not apply, because people will generally do what you want them to do when you pay them.

You're probably not going to pay any attention to this advice, but I'm gonna give it to you anyway.

On your film set, there can be only one boss. ONE boss. That's it. If you go up to somebody and say, "hey, what's the best way to do such and such?" you're going to lose your cast and your crew. They're going to immediately form an opinion that you don't know what you're doing. And then you'll come back here and say that you were abandoned. You don't want that to happen.

Here's the best advice I'll give you and I read it in a book. Filmmakers generally tend to be artistic types and are not alpha male characters who naturally command any given situation which involves other human beings. But you HAVE to do that for your movie. Now how do you do that if that is not your natural deportment? You have to learn to do it, by doing little things.

For instance, if somebody comes up to you and says, "hey Ryan, should we point the camera into the sun or away from the sun?" and if your response is "what do you think?" or "let me think about that," you will lose your people. You have to make a decision immediately. It may be the wrong decision, but you have to make it. Let's say you say "into the sun." Then you go and you think about it and if you think "away from the sun" is a better decision, then you come back and "change" your decision. It's your movie. You can change your decision anytime. But you can't keep asking people for advice. And you can't be thinking about things all the time. You have to KNOW what you're going to do at what time. You have to be aware of what shots haven't been shot but that you need.

Now everybody here has their own experience and will not agree with the above advice. But I stick to this rule on my set with a vengeance. I know what I'm doing on my set, and I'm a little bit of a dick (in real life, I'm quite a nice guy, laid back and very personable), because I don't allow discussions or conversations on my decisions. If somebody comes and says to me "hey Aveek, how about we shoot this scene first?" or "hey Aveek, how about we shoot from this other angle instead?" I nod my head and consider it and then I say yes or no. Most of the time it's no. and once I make the decision, all further conversation is a waste of time, and is therefore not allowed.


Make the movie. If your DP can't make it, because of an illness, then go spend time with your DP or somebody else and figure out how you should light and shoot it. It's not an impossible task. It can only be a very "interesting" task, one you should be only excited to learn and execute on your own.

Best of luck!!
Aveek
Click to expand...

I agree. It's your film, you are the boss, everyone should do what you say.

The only time you should be asking ANYTHING is:
to sound guy "Is everything set up?"
to DP "Are you ready to start shooting?"
to actor "Have you memorized your line"
to everyone "Why are you late?"

Stick to your schedule, and get out there shooting!
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Sure I will. I will act like I know what I'm doing and give all the commands. I wish I had ordered some of those books recommended to me before. I was practicing shooting, setting up scenes and shots, and doing sound, almost every night for the past few months, that for some reason I literally kept forgetting to order. Just OCD preoccupation I guess, makes you not think of things. I couldn't order that online my book, cause my harddrive couldn't accept it for some reason. I will try to fix it but I could use a book now. I made calls to the bookstores today but they don't have any of those books in and will have to be ordered. I shoot in a few days and don't have time to wait for the orders to come in though.

Hmmm. Are their any good film making books that are so common that they will be found in stock most likely? I will go look tomorrow, but any good ones I should keep an eye out for? I will have to learn to get use to ordering stuff now. If you want something for movie making you have to order it and wait for it to come in, so next short I will order so much stuff in advance and wait just in case.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Last edited:
Upvote 0 Downvote
Yeah I know about that one! I wanted it so bad but the book store didn't have it. Wish I ordered it way back, but for some reason keep not thinking of and did a lot of practicing instead, not quite knowing what I was doing while practicing. Stupid of me maybe. I'll order it tomorrow. Still see what the bookstore has for right now though.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
harmonica44 said:
Yeah I know about that one! I wanted it so bad but the book store didn't have it. Wish I ordered it way back, but for some reason keep not thinking of and did a lot of practicing instead, not quite knowing what I was doing while practicing. Stupid of me maybe. I'll order it tomorrow. Still see what the bookstore has for right now though.
Click to expand...

Why can't you order it right now from Amazon?
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top