Lots of Audio Questions

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pepper jack

So I have quite a few questions on audio and I know there are a couple of you out there who just love answering these questions (Alcove and APE, I'm looking for you!) I've browsed around and been holding on these questions for a while but they are pretty specific and I haven't found answers for them yet.

Anyway seeing as how audio is the next thing I want to invest in over the next few months I just want some advice and suggestions. Currently I have this as my following for audio gear.

Audio Technica ATR 6550 - http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATR-6550-Condenser-Shotgun-Microphone/dp/B002GYPS3M

Zoom H4 - http://www.amazon.com/Zoom-ZOO-H4-H...e=UTF8&qid=1355302420&sr=1-4&keywords=zoom+h4

And I got some wired lav mic. Isn't too bad, I don't find myself using it much though. Anyway this is what my question is. All of my videos I have usually just plugged my shotgun mic right into the camera but I just got my hands on this zoom h4 recently and I want to start booming and having it record to this zoom. Currently I have no way to plug the shotgun mic into the zoom, now I know there are adapters that go from xlr -> 1/8 but does it really go the other way around? Seeing as xlr is a higher quality cable, correct? I've looked on amazon and I haven't really found a female 1/8 -> a male xlr which is what I would need to directly plug it in to the zoom. So what should I do for this situation? Oh well I was just looking around and found this, I would need another double female 1/8 adapter along with this though: http://www.amazon.com/Hosa-Stereo-3-5mm-Male-feet/dp/B000068OEP/ref=pd_sim_MI_37

Another thing is a boom pole, I haven't really done much research yet but I'm looking for something fairly simple just extendable and not ridiculously expensive. I really only can afford a couple hundred bucks right now. Also I am willing to buy a new shotgun mic if it's necessary to make the zoom h4 work. A boom pole I'm looking at right now actually. http://www.amazon.com/Rode-Micro-Telescopic-Microphone-Extension/dp/B004X4UZB8/ref=pd_sim_p_18

Also some headphones. Aren't completely necessary right now because a couple of my friends actually have some good (and by that I mean better than some ipod headphones or whatever) sound monitoring headphones that I can use. But I'm looking into something along these lines http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technic...=1355302792&sr=1-3&keywords=studio+headphones
Or this http://www.amazon.com/Sony-MDR-V6-Monitor-Series-Headphones/dp/B00001WRSJ/ref=pd_cp_MI_0

Last but not least my final question since I haven't filmed with a separate sound system yet and had to deal with syncing and what not in post, what is a standard workflow of audio and how do you sync it? Another thing that has to do with the workflow in post, is I've been trying to find some DAW programs that can edit OMF and work with video. I've been looking for open source or free ones if possible although I haven't had any luck finding ones that can work with video for free.

Well sorry I posted a whole huge essay but audio is something I really want to start focusing on over my next few projects. Thanks.
 
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pepper jack said:
Currently I have no way to plug the shotgun mic into the zoom.
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The link you posted for the mic showed that it comes with a 1/4" adapter to pop onto the tip of the 3.5mm plug of the mic.

You can plug that 1/4" adapter straight up the middle of the Zoom's XLR openings.

The Zoom XLR inputs are designed to take 1/4" cables, as well. :cool:
 
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OH GOD ARE YOU SERIOUS?! Wow.. I feel so stupid now hahahah. I'll have to test that out..

Okay that actually brings me to another question. I have this extender cable, its a 1/8 female on one end and male on the other adapter, I don't know if the cable itself is messed up or damaged but when I use it to plug the mic into the camera the sound wouldn't go through. Now this is when I was trying to make a small boom pole out of pvc and I ended up wrapping the cable around the pvc pole. I guess what I'm trying to ask is since I have this cable already and if it isn't actually broken, what is the best way to maneuver it into the recorder or camera.
 
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Have you tried simply plugging the end of the cable in? Or have I completely missed your question?

how do you sync it?
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Clapper board. If the camera has its own mic, you can sync it up with the other sound. If not, you can sync it up with the visual of the clapper board clapping.
 
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knightly said:
In the NLE Nudge the audio waveform spike of the clapperboard closing to the frame that the clapperboard closes which should marry up the audio and video.
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Oh okay see that's all I thought you did but the other day I was reading some thread and this guy was talking about how he has some program that automatically syncs it up.

Have you tried simply plugging the end of the cable in? Or have I completely missed your question?
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Yeah I think you misunderstood, it was all plugged in and everything but what I'm curious about is that maybe the 1/8 cable is too flimsy and not high enough quality or insulation so that when it is wrapped around a pole a bunch of times and moving around that the sound doesn't make it through, if that's possible. I need to just test out the cable again in a few different scenarios to see if it's even working.
 
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The longer the run of cable (non-XLR, which is what you have), the longer the antenna for picking up RF Interference... wrapping it too much will increase the length of the cable and increase the likelihood of picking up interference.

Moving to a balanced XLR system from mic > cable > recorder has eliminated these problems for us. In the mean time, outdoors should be fine, indoors, turn off anything with an electric motor (fridge, ceiling fans, etc.) and any fluorescent lighting. These are basically "spark gap transmitters" that will make your life unhappy when you have to re-record all your audio you've recorded.
 
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pepper jack said:
Audio Technica ATR 6550
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I'm not a fan, but only because it's Hi-Z (high impedance)

pepper jack said:
Zoom H4
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Again, I'm not a fan; flimsy and noisy

pepper jack said:
Currently I have no way to plug the shotgun mic into the zoom
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The current version of the ATR-6550 has an 1/8" plug at the end and a 1/4" adapter is included in the kit. As has already been mentioned you can plug directly into the 1/4" inputs in the Zoom (BTW, is it the H4 or H4n?).

pepper jack said:
Another thing is a boom pole...
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The standard Rode boom-pole is 10' and goes for $150. The 6' Mini boom-pole is $130. The $50 Micro is also 6'+. Spend the $150; you'll be very happy you did a year from now.

pepper jack said:
Also some headphones
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The Sony MDR-7506 ($100) are a standard (the V-6 are pretty much the same) and the Sennheiser HD 25 ($150) are becoming very popular. You want something very "flat" so you hear reality and not colored sound. They should also be closed back.

pepper jack said:
... I've been trying to find some DAW programs that can edit OMF and work with video.
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You don't "edit" OMF; OMF is a format used to transfer audio between different platforms (like between NLEs and DAWs). Most DAWs will import OMF files.

Most DAWs will also work with video files; each has it's quirks regarding which codec runs the smoothest. My personal Pro Tools system really likes .DV streams on a separate drive; no jumpiness, lags, hick-ups, etc.

Amazon is okay, but I would start buying from a "specialized" vendor like B&H. It may cost a few extra dollars now, but it can pay off big time in the future. A regular vendor is also much easier to deal with when you have returns, they have a complete list of all your purchases, and some (like B&H) even have decent support.
 
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pepper jack said:
Another thing that has to do with the workflow in post, is I've been trying to find some DAW programs that can edit OMF and work with video. I've been looking for open source or free ones if possible although I haven't had any luck finding ones that can work with video for free.
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Reaper will do the job. It's not free but it seems you can perpetually "recycle" the free trial.

http://www.reaper.fm/

Someone worked on a plug-in to allow you to import OMFs into Reaper, but he gave up as it was too much work. The beta version of the plug-in appears to work, but there are known bugs that will sadly never be fixed:

Forum thread:

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=24943

Download:

http://stash.reaper.fm/v/2426/reaper_omf.dll

I use it for my little projects. It's okay for my (low) level of expertise. Learning Pro Tools straight off the bat might be better in the long run.
 
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As far as production sound equipment goes, Alcove knows more about that than me, so take his advice. There are a couple of points I'll pick up on though.
pepper jack said:
...the other day I was reading some thread and this guy was talking about how he has some program that automatically syncs it up.
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I think you've misunderstood what the guy was talking about. His problem is different in that his audio starts in sync and then drifts out of sync over time. His problem will not affect you unless you are planing on filming continuous takes of longer than about 10 minutes. PluralEyes works by time stretching or time compressing his recorder audio to match his camera recorded audio (and the picture), this often causes artefacts and you should avoid using PluralEyes (or similar software) unless you have to. In your case, just line up the audio with the clapperboard as described by Knightly.
pepper jack said:
... it was all plugged in and everything but what I'm curious about is that maybe the 1/8 cable is too flimsy and not high enough quality or insulation so that when it is wrapped around a pole a bunch of times and moving around that the sound doesn't make it through, if that's possible. I need to just test out the cable again in a few different scenarios to see if it's even working.
Click to expand...

Again, Knightly's advice is good, if possible switch over to using balanced mic/recorder, unbalanced will always pick up more interference. I've just posted a message (http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?p=300096) which explains why.

For a DAW, ProTools is the best bet as it will put you in step with the professionals and make life far easier if ever you reach the stage of handing your projects over to audio post professionals. If you're looking for a virtually zero cost DAW, the only one I would recommend is Reaper, although as SiCurious mentions, Reaper is a little flakey with OMFs.

G
 
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AudioPostExpert said:
PluralEyes works by time stretching or time compressing his recorder audio to match his camera recorded audio (and the picture), this often causes artefacts and you should avoid using PluralEyes (or similar software) unless you have to.
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Actual PluralEyes doesn't do this when using it to sync audio in an editing system like FCP - all it does is align the tracks, so it's functionally no different than synching it manually, just quite a bit faster. Their standalone program DualEyes does time stretch if necessary, and its possible the latest version of PluralEyes can do it when used in standalone mode - I haven't tested that mode myself yet.
 
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