I've decided I want to make the move to LA

[JRy]

First off -- MERRY CHRISTMAS, EVERYONE!

I've had the last few weeks dwell on all the great advice of the community regarding my thread about hoping to someday become a writer/director...

Thanks to everyone here, I have a much more realistic approach for my journey into the industry....But I also have a few issues.
To get straight to the point -- I have a very conflicting relationship with my surroundings -- I just don't fit in here at all, I live in the rural deep south and have very little in common with people here.
I've always wanted to move to a big city and I'm the point in my life that I'm ready to do it. I've been to San Francisco, New York, Chicago, Redmond, and a few other big cities, and loved every minute spent in each.

So, I'm back to my original thinking of moving out to LA, not to shop my screenplays around (which I'm probably not ready for) -- but to jump in and get my hands dirty -- to just get on set and do anything I can; paint sets, file papers, get coffee, take out the trash, put stuff together, and anything else they throw at me, basically all of the grunt work that no one really wants to do -- I want to show up on time, do the work, ask for more, stay late, and never complain.

As I've said before; I have zero film experience, plenty of stage acting experience, and lots of amateur writing experience. I feel if I can get in there and see the filmmaking processes first-hand, I'll have an even greater appreciation of the industry and be more prepared when it comes to my own work.

As for the sort of jobs I can get with zero experience, what can I expect? I'm more than willing to work for free if a good opportunity presents itself. Is it hard to get a job a Production Assistant or Producer Assistant with no experience? Are there any other positions I could also look into that would get me on set and not stuck in an office?

Do PA jobs usually require your own source of transportation? Would not having my own source of transportation hinder my chances of getting a job? I would assume so, I'm just wondering if I could sell my car and get around on public transport for awhile. Is public transportation in LA any good? Is it dangerous?

I've looked into housing, and I'd most likely end up staying with a roommate in San Fernando Valley (about 20 mins from LA) since apartments in that area are much more affordable. Based on the expenses I've calculated, I have enough saved up to last me 7 months.
If I had to start out working for free, is it realistic to assume that I could go from working for free to around $500/week within 7 months? I do have a safety net of falling back on freelance programming to make money when needed -- but I'd like to leave that life behind when I make the move.

Where could I look for entry-level job listings in the industry? Right now I've been using Craigslist and EntertainmentCareers.net. Are there any more?

Any advice is greatly appreciated. Thank you, everyone.

 

[WideShot]

As for the sort of jobs I can get with zero experience, what can I expect?

Exactly what you've mentioned.

I'm more than willing to work for free if a good opportunity presents itself. Is it hard to get a job a Production Assistant or Producer Assistant with no experience? Are there any other positions I could also look into that would get me on set and not stuck in an office?

Its much easier if you work on a few student and small indie films as a PA or grip first to build a basic CV than to walk into an office looking for a job.

Do PA jobs usually require your own source of transportation? Would not having my own source of transportation hinder my chances of getting a job? I would assume so, I'm just wondering if I could sell my car and get around on public transport for awhile. Is public transportation in LA any good? Is it dangerous?

LA is huge. And film shoots happen all over LA. So yes, your own transportation is VERY necessary. Public transportation doesn't go everywhere and is not even close to the quickest way to get anywhere (unlike New York). See New York is tall, LA is wide.

I've looked into housing, and I'd most likely end up staying with a roommate in San Fernando Valley (about 20 mins from LA) since apartments in that area are much more affordable. Based on the expenses I've calculated, I have enough saved up to last me 7 months.

I dont know what you've saved or how you're calculating it, but I think you'll be surprised how quickly money disappears and how much transportation costs in LA. A daily commute of over 100 miles is not uncommon.

If I had to start out working for free, is it realistic to assume that I could go from working for free to around $500/week within 7 months?

Not in the film industry unless you worked every weekend and had everything fall in line very quickly. Some people don't see $2k a month for years.

I do have a safety net of falling back on freelance programming to make money when needed -- but I'd like to leave that life behind when I make the move.

I would suggest the opposite. Get a job and then do films on weekends. You might also be surprised at the competition out there for programming jobs.

Where could I look for entry-level job listings in the industry? Right now I've been using Craigslist and EntertainmentCareers.net. Are there any more?

Those places are a good start, don't pay for any service that promises you jobs.

 

[JRy]

Thanks for the reply, WideShot.

Its much easier if you work on a few student and small indie films as a PA or grip first to build a basic CV than to walk into an office looking for a job.

That's what I was thinking, a lot of the listings on Craigslist are for indie productions, I would go that route first.

LA is huge. And film shoots happen all over LA. So yes, your own transportation is VERY necessary. Public transportation doesn't go everywhere and is not even close to the quickest way to get anywhere (unlike New York). See New York is tall, LA is wide.

That's what I was thinking, I was pretty sure I'd need my own transportation, but I wanted to ask. I think I may end up selling my new car and getting a cheapo used car in moderate condition with good gas mileage.

I dont know what you've saved or how you're calculating it, but I think you'll be surprised how quickly money disappears and how much transportation costs in LA. A daily commute of over 100 miles is not uncommon.

I won't bore everyone with breaking down all the expenses, but I am factoring my living expenses at $1,500 a month ($500 of that being my share of rent with a roommate). I have a little over $10,000 in savings, and maybe another $18,000 if I can sell my car for close to the current appraised value in the next few months. I paid about $24,000 for it in full, and I've only had it for 8 months now.

Not in the film industry unless you worked every weekend and had everything fall in line very quickly. Some people don't see $2k a month for years.

I want to work every weekend. I understand the work ethic required -- You have to be the first one to arrive, the last one to leave and do everything you're asked to the best of your abilities with no complaining from the time the day starts until it ends. I am prepared to make sacrifices and have next-to-zero life outside the industry life until I really break in.

I want to be the guy that leaves such a good impression that my name gets around or I keep getting hired by the same people over and over because I have an outstanding reputation. I know I'm going to be up against others with the same goal, but I have no doubt I can hold my own.

Realistically, if I bust-my-ass, do I stand a chance of landing a paying position that will at least bring in $1,000 a month within my first year?
If not, I'm going to have to pull a lot more resources together and get more savings.

I would suggest the opposite. Get a job and then do films on weekends. You might also be surprised at the competition out there for programming jobs.

Wouldn't just working weekends hurt my chances? I would think a producer or director would be much more likely to hire and make arrangements for someone that is available 7 days a week at any hour.
I don't want to lose out on a great opportunity because I can't fit it into my work schedule.

As for the programming; the majority of my work comes in subcontracted from various studios, I either accept the jobs or I don't, there is always more coming in and I do it all form home. I wouldn't have to worry about job hunting if the need arose. Though like I said, I really want to leave that life behind. I am beyond burnt out on it.

 

[jammer]

moving out

i to thought there was not anyone that wanted to make an indie film. in my areas deep south .I posted on craig's list and have 8 responses.One sent a resume and it was very impressive. Another was acting in a indie nearby. First i would post in news papers online ect. to see what the level of interest is.Second do something creative today. I made a 4 min. film today with music credits ect.why? To keep me motivated.


First off -- MERRY CHRISTMAS, EVERYONE!

I've had the last few weeks dwell on all the great advice of the community regarding my thread about hoping to someday become a writer/director...

Thanks to everyone here, I have a much more realistic approach for my journey into the industry....But I also have a few issues.
To get straight to the point -- I have a very conflicting relationship with my surroundings -- I just don't fit in here at all, I live in the rural deep south and have very little in common with people here.
I've always wanted to move to a big city and I'm the point in my life that I'm ready to do it. I've been to San Francisco, New York, Chicago, Redmond, and a few other big cities, and loved every minute spent in each.

So, I'm back to my original thinking of moving out to LA, not to shop my screenplays around (which I'm probably not ready for) -- but to jump in and get my hands dirty -- to just get on set and do anything I can; paint sets, file papers, get coffee, take out the trash, put stuff together, and anything else they throw at me, basically all of the grunt work that no one really wants to do -- I want to show up on time, do the work, ask for more, stay late, and never complain.

As I've said before; I have zero film experience, plenty of stage acting experience, and lots of amateur writing experience. I feel if I can get in there and see the filmmaking processes first-hand, I'll have an even greater appreciation of the industry and be more prepared when it comes to my own work.

As for the sort of jobs I can get with zero experience, what can I expect? I'm more than willing to work for free if a good opportunity presents itself. Is it hard to get a job a Production Assistant or Producer Assistant with no experience? Are there any other positions I could also look into that would get me on set and not stuck in an office?

Do PA jobs usually require your own source of transportation? Would not having my own source of transportation hinder my chances of getting a job? I would assume so, I'm just wondering if I could sell my car and get around on public transport for awhile. Is public transportation in LA any good? Is it dangerous?

I've looked into housing, and I'd most likely end up staying with a roommate in San Fernando Valley (about 20 mins from LA) since apartments in that area are much more affordable. Based on the expenses I've calculated, I have enough saved up to last me 7 months.
If I had to start out working for free, is it realistic to assume that I could go from working for free to around $500/week within 7 months? I do have a safety net of falling back on freelance programming to make money when needed -- but I'd like to leave that life behind when I make the move.

Where could I look for entry-level job listings in the industry? Right now I've been using Craigslist and EntertainmentCareers.net. Are there any more?

Any advice is greatly appreciated. Thank you, everyone.[/QUOTE]

 

[spinner]

i to thought there was not anyone that wanted to make an indie film. in my areas deep south .I posted on craig's list and have 8 responses.One sent a resume and it was very impressive. Another was acting in a indie nearby. First i would post in news papers online ect. to see what the level of interest is.Second do something creative today. I made a 4 min. film today with music credits ect.why? To keep me motivated.

You made a film? Good for you!

If you are determined to head out to LA, I wish you luck Maybe you will get discovered!

also, I found this site, maybe it will help: Media Match

http://www.media-match.com/welcome.php

-- spinner

 

[DeceptionA]

I still think you need to get something under your belt before you leave, personally.

Have you read any books? You familiar with the gear(you won't touch a camera in a long time)? If someone asked for a double net on a baby c-stand, do you know what to grab out of the grip truck? You know what a c47 is? A sheet of CTO?

Get familiar with ALL the jargon you can. I'd personally make flash cards, put a picture on one side, and as much nice description and an instance of when you'd use it on the other.


What good is it showing up 15 minutes early when the DP finally shows up, asks for some CTB on the 2k light, and you stand there going "huh?"?

Above all, good luck!

 

[JRy]

@jammer: Are you saying you made a film yourself, or that you put out notices that you were looking for work in films? Either ways congrats on the success!

@spinner: Thank you for the link and the kind words!

@DeceptionA: Nope, I am clueless at the moment, but I am going to be picking up as many books as possible between now and the time I make my move.
I'm probably going to wait until after June, seeing as how the writers strike is messing up things enough, I don't want to get out to LA and get caught up in the Directors/Actors strike in June (or is it July?). Who knows how long that will last, I'll just wait for it to be over with. That gives me plenty of time to learn.

You wouldn't happen to have any recommendation on reading material in relation to equipment would you?

 

[Beeblebrox]

I agree with Wideshot that you should think about programming as a day job, particularly if it's flexible. There is something to be said for the Cortez approach, but I personally like to eat without sweating it too much.

Yes, you absolutely need your own car. In fact, most PA postings I've seen specify that you have your own car in good working condition. A lot of times, PA work entails picking up VIPs from the airport and shuttling them around town. Can't do that if you're using public transportation.

All in all, you seem about as prepared as anyone I've met. Decent savings. A game plan. You know what you don't know. I wouldn't worry too much about the jargon at this point. Every bit of knowledge helps, but your first day on the set, it's not likely that the DP will be yelling at YOU, if you know what I mean.

 

[VPTurner]

Whatever you do, DO NOT make the same mistakes I did. If film is your passion, don't let up on it. Keep pursuing it. Personally, I made the trip from northern to southern California when I was 21, spent six months working odd jobs (swing and nights in security mostly to give me plenty of writing time) put a feature length script under my arm that I thought was fantastic (delusional, wishful thinking at the time), and ended up getting nowhere fast. I, too, had to live outside the city (Buena Park) because that was all I could afford, and the costs of just getting to the Writer's Guild to register the script hurt my budget (now it's done online, so no worries there - and in retrospect I should've mailed it). It doesn't matter how brilliant you are as a writer; if you don't have more than one script (five minimum) don't bother knocking on doors. I had good writing style, but it's taken me another 18 years to find my voice. 2008 is finally going to be the year where I actually get something accomplished. Now if I can only find the time again to sit and write... (Well, what am I doing now?) Survival, a marriage, a mortgage and a middle-class lifestyle keep me squarely at the day job. The last 3 months consisted of 10-12 hour days, 6-7 days a week. This is the first break I've had, and I'm spending it on here, still on the outside looking in, wishing things were different. I finished a short script, at least. And there is another positive having so many diverse experiences over the years: I have accumulated some great writing material.

To summarize, I'm 39 now and on the outside looking in because I fell into survival mode and never got out. I've been married 3 times, raised someone else's five children for awhile, and changed jobs 10 times across two states since leaving southern California because I chose to work in the volatile computer industry as my bread and butter. Don't get so caught up in working 7 days a week, 16 hours a day helping someone else fulfill their dreams that you forget about yours. And that also goes with your personal life. Keep a balance. Don't get so focused on helping someone else through life where you don't have time for yourself and following your dreams. This is why I've had two failed marriages - they didn't like when I focused on me because they felt the world needed to revolve around them. Get a partner to help captain the ship, not an anchor.

Making flash cards is a great idea. I did that with The Filmmaker's Handbook (I still have it - dog eared, worn and well read, but now I also have the shiny new edition). I was adequately equipped with jargon before I stepped foot anywhere near a studio lot or set. And be an extra, even an unpaid extra, because that will help get you close to the action where you can observe, learn and network between takes. Being on the set of Kickboxer II at U.C. Irvine for a day taught me more than any DVD special feature section or "making of" book could ever teach. You get to smell the hot lights, dodge the dolly as it flies past when the grips aren't paying close enough attention to the crowd, throw things at the stars, watch setup, tear down, angle changes, direction, second direction, makeup, rehearsal, blocking, multiple camera positioning, master scene setup, medium shots, close ups, steadicam and crane operation, etc., etc. Most of the arena fight scenes for the movie including the finale were shot that day. Amazing experience.

And don't bother writing a Dirty Harry meets The Terminator buddy cop film that is sexist and cliché. I already wrote it. And it didn't sell. I can't imagine why. It was beautifully written and professionally formatted. What's not to love?

 

[DeceptionA]

I wouldn't worry too much about the jargon at this point. Every bit of knowledge helps, but your first day on the set, it's not likely that the DP will be yelling at YOU, if you know what I mean.

Ugh. I don't understand this logic. If your trying to get a job, and right now your sitting in the farmlands of BFE, why wouldn't you take that time while you can to learn what you can, so the DP doesn't have to explain to you what a simple C47 is on your first day? Don't you WANT to start off with a good impression? "Hey, maybe this kid might just know his way around the set" is slightly better thought then "Sigh. A C47 is a clothespin..."

I mean, this is a job. An industry. If you want to do this for a living, you can't treat it as a hobby. You can't just want to play with the camera and ignore how F-stops affect depth of field.

 

[directorik]

I agree with DeceptionA. Taking the time to learn the jargon at this
point is very important, in my opinion. Even on a non-piad gig on a
no budget set working as a PA when the DP barks, "I want 3 apples
over by the crank - New York! And get a double while you're at it." It
helps to know he's not sending you to the craft service table for fruit
and whiskey.

And you got the time at this point to learn.

 

[Beeblebrox]

Ugh. I don't understand this logic. If your trying to get a job, and right now your sitting in the farmlands of BFE, why wouldn't you take that time while you can to learn what you can, so the DP doesn't have to explain to you what a simple C47 is on your first day?

Like I said, if he wants to study it and know it ahead of time then good for him. Why is the DP asking the coffee guy or the runner for a C47 in the first place? And if he does, then he probably prefaces it with, "that's a clothes pin" or asks for a clothes pin in the first place, assuming correctly that the PA probably doesn't know. It's not really a big deal unless you're a gaffer or a grip and you still don't know what a C47 is. The whole point of being a PA is that you're still learning this stuff and everyone is aware of this.

 

[spinner]

You wouldn't happen to have any recommendation on reading material in relation to equipment would you?

I don't know where you are located, but one way to learn some equipment is to find out if the city you live in has a public access tv station. Most cities have something like that nearby. Public access will allow anyone who wants to learn, access to real equipment. You will be able to almost overnight put your hands on a camera.

...get the books as well, but public access is practical hands on experience and that is what you need. If there aren't any public access stations in your city, there will certainly be on or in the big city near you. See if it would be worth it to get to the large metropolitan city in your state and do public access there.

Also consider taking a class at one of the community colleges. Hands on experience is hands on experience.

-- spinner

 

[DeceptionA]

Like I said, if he wants to study it and know it ahead of time then good for him. Why is the DP asking the coffee guy or the runner for a C47 in the first place? And if he does, then he probably prefaces it with, "that's a clothes pin" or asks for a clothes pin in the first place, assuming correctly that the PA probably doesn't know. It's not really a big deal unless you're a gaffer or a grip and you still don't know what a C47 is. The whole point of being a PA is that you're still learning this stuff and everyone is aware of this.

I understand where your coming from. But, as I said, you can't say "I want to move to Hollywood and make a living off of making movies" and still think of it as a hobby.

A lot of people catch their breaks by being a PA and being asked to do something besides getting coffee because someone is sick, or someone else is busy. Learning terminology right now is probably the most constructive thing to do. It makes you look like you got a clue of what's going on, and makes you look helpful. That and being 15 minutes early makes a great impression.

Trust me.

 

[Beeblebrox]

I understand where your coming from. But, as I said, you can't say "I want to move to Hollywood and make a living off of making movies" and still think of it as a hobby.

Who's saying anything about thinking of it as a hobby? You can either learn this stuff from books or learn it on the set. For a PA, both are perfectly acceptable. Learning what a C47 is takes about 2 seconds. As long as we don't have to repeatedly explain what an apple box or a C47 is, then it's all good.

Trust me.

Thanks but I think most of us here work on sets and have some measure of experience on the subject. I work as a director and visual effects artist, so I have worked with PAs before. And I fully expect that PAs are there to learn (and do what I tell them to do). I generally favor people who have the right attitude more so than those that already know the lingo, because any idiot can learn the lingo but the right attitude is a more valuable and rare commodity.

 

[spinner]

It's not really a big deal unless you're a gaffer or a grip and you still don't know what a C47....

....dang it! I always forget what that is....

-- spinner

 

[Beeblebrox]

....dang it! I always forget what that is....

-- spinner

A clothes pin. And I will say for the record that I refuse to call it a C47 on set. I also refuse to call an extension chord a "stinger." But that's a whole other rant.

 

[spinner]

A clothes pin. And I will say for the record that I refuse to call it a C47 on set. I also refuse to call an extension chord a "stinger." But that's a whole other rant.

-- spinner

 

[DeceptionA]

Thanks but I think most of us here work on sets and have some measure of experience on the subject. I work as a director and visual effects artist, so I have worked with PAs before. And I fully expect that PAs are there to learn (and do what I tell them to do). I generally favor people who have the right attitude more so than those that already know the lingo, because any idiot can learn the lingo but the right attitude is a more valuable and rare commodity.

I didn't mean it as in "I'm the only one who knows what he's talking about". When I started I was in the exact same position as this guy. I'm sure some of you guys were/are in the same position. I didn't have a single friend interested in making shorts for fun. I didn't know a single person in the industry, not even through a friend of a friend of a friend. I took a TV Broadcasting class in HS, it was a joke for the most part, and I got kicked from the class because I didn't show up enough. That was the extent of my experience until I was 20-21, when I went to film school.

I guess I correlate taking your own time to learn the basics and having the right attitude as partly the same thing. That's all.

Whichever way you do it, just go at it with everything you got!

 

[Beeblebrox]

Whichever way you do it, just go at it with everything you got!

We definitely agree about that!