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How to do outdoor lightning at night?

I plan to shot a few scenes outdoor at night at a lake. And I need some help regarding how to properly light the scene since this will the first short film I'll shot.

I want to achieve a ghostly/eerie ambient look. There will probably be snow lying around so I might use that bounce the light onto the actors. Also I was thinking of just pointing a focus light on the actors and leaving the surroundings out of the light. Or maybe use another, very dim light for the the surrounding areas. Is this a good idea?

Also I don't have any lightning equipment yet and I'm also trying to figure out how to do this since there probably wont be an power source access. What do you use in those instances? Power generators? Car battery? Or is there lightning equipment that runs on an independent energy source?

What about using torches to light the scene or face with the torche being out of the frame? Anyone has experience with that?

I'll shot on a Canon DSLR 500D with a 2.8f lens. So I wont need an all too powerful light source.
 
In my opinion, letting the background just fall to black
makes it look more amateur and less professional. Lighting
the background it what sets a well lit night shoot apart.
In reality you need a much stronger light (not a dim one)
in the background.

Of course with no power source this is all a moot point.

The problem with using a torch is that light is quite specific
and everyone recognizes it as a torch. What's good about
using that method is you can experiment with it tonight.
Late tonight, step outside with your torch and camera and
give it a shot. If you like the look, you can use that method.
 
Valid idea :) thank you.

The problem with no wall/etc. in the background is that it will be shot at a lake and some shots will face the shore, fading the water into blackness. Then again I don't know the exact location yet. There might be some bushes or trees.

What solutions are commonly used as a power source for scenes in the night?
 
Cars can power smaller lights for the background using a power inverter (usually not more than 1 250-300 watt light).

Generators are relatively cheap to rent from a general rental type of store (generators, cement mixers, etc...) They often also have those giant generator driven lights that construction crews use that you could nearly turn it into daylight with ;)

There are torches that are high output ones 1million - 2 million candle power type things that can run off an inverter as well, they throw a VERY focussed beam of light a long ways, and very brightly. lighting into a large white bedsheet with one of these will make a giant softbox, but the batteries on them don't last very long - so you would have to run it off a car, generator or car battery for longer shots. - these are relatively cheap (I got my 2million CP light for ~US$25 which is somewhere around 20 euros or so)
 
The problem with no wall/etc. in the background is that it will be shot at a lake and some shots will face the shore, fading the water into blackness. Then again I don't know the exact location yet. There might be some bushes or trees.

What solutions are commonly used as a power source for scenes in the night?

I would suggest either using a fog machine, or a fire, to create smoke over the water that you can then light. The traditional approach is to use a combination of 3200K (tungsten) and 5500K (HMI) light sources for night shooting because most high speed films and video imaging systems are balanced for 3200K (The Red Camera being the notable exception). With this approach HMIs are used to create blue moonlight and tungsten lights are used to create white or slightly warm lamp-light. In this approach CTO gels are used to either make the HMIs less blue or the tungsten lights warmer.

HMIs are expensive to own or rent, but using tungsten light sources to create cool moonlight for a night scene doesn’t make a lot of sense. Balancing tungsten to 5000K is not very efficient because full CTB cuts the output of the light by 70% in converting it to 5000K. A 1000W 3200K light becomes a 300W 5000K light when you put Full CTB on it. A 400 W HMI will give you considerably more lumens/watt than a color corrected Tungsten 1k, and use up a lot less power available from your generator. To light the lake shore as a background you will need a fairly good size HMI – at least a 2.5kw HMI Par.

- Guy Holt, Gaffer, Boston
 
Generators are relatively cheap to rent from a general rental type of store (generators, cement mixers, etc...) They often also have those giant generator driven lights that construction crews use that you could nearly turn it into daylight with

Home depot will rent you a small ginnie for $50 a day. Noise will be an issue, but can work around it.

When it comes to running HMIs on small portable generators, it matters not only what type of generator you use but also what type of HMI ballast you use. The harmonic noise that magnetic and non-PFC electronic ballasts kick back into the power stream has an adverse effect on the power waveform of the construction generators, where it does not on grid power. Normally, when you plug an HMI light into a wall outlet you need not be concerned about current harmonic distortion producing voltage distortions. The impedance of the electrical path from the power plant is so low, the distortion of the original voltage waveform so small (1-3%), and the plant capacity so large, that inherently noisy loads placed upon it will not affect the voltage at the load bus.

However, it is an all together different situation when plugging HMIs into a conventional portable generator like the one you would get from HD or a construction rental company. Given the large sub-transient impedance of conventional portable generators, even a small degree of harmonic noise being fed back into the power stream will result in a large amount of distortion in its’ voltage. Add to that, the likely hood that the percentage of the generator’s capacity taken up by non-linear loads will to be very high given its small size relative to typical lighting loads, and given the increasing prevalence of non-linear light sources in production. Finally, add that the original supply voltage waveform of a conventional generator is appreciably distorted to begin with, and you have a situation where the return of any harmonic currents by an HMI ballast will result in significant waveform distortion of the voltage at the power bus.
For this reason, when your lighting package consists predominantly of non-linear light sources, like HMI and Fluorescent lights, it is important to have power factor correction (PFC) circuitry in the ballasts and operate them on inverter generators. The combination of improved power factor and the nearly pure power waveform of inverter generators makes it possible to power larger lights, or more smaller lights, than has been possible before on a small portable gas generator.
In the past, the primary factors limiting the use of HMIs on portable generators has been their inefficient use of power and the harmonic noise they throw back into the power stream. The power waveform below left is typical of what results from the operation of a 2.5kw non Power Factor Corrected HMI load (electronic ballasts) on a conventional portable generator. The adverse effects of the severe harmonic noise exhibited here, can take the form of overheating and failing equipment, efficiency losses, circuit breaker trips, excessive current on the neutral return, and instability of the generator’s voltage and frequency. For these reasons it has never been possible to reliably operate more than a couple of 1200W HMIs on a conventional 6500W portable gas generator. Harmonic noise of this magnitude can also damage HD digital cinema production equipment, create ground loops, and possibly create radio frequency (RF) interference. The increasing use of personal computers, hard drives, and microprocessor-controlled recording equipment in production has created an unprecedented demand for clean, reliable power on set.

waveform_AVR-Inv_Pkg.jpg

My company, ScreenLight & Grip (SL&G) has also developed a Gen-set that takes advantage of recent technological advances in HMI ballast design and power generation to create clean stable set power that is capable of operating larger lights (HMIs up to 6kw or Quartz lights up to 6kw), or more smaller lights, off of portable gas generators than has ever been possible before. For example, the power waveform above on the right, is the same 2500W load but with power factor correction operating on our modified Honda EU6500is Inverter Generator. As you can see, the difference between the resulting waveforms is startling. Even though the load is the same, the fact that it is power factor corrected and the power is being generated by an inverter generator, results in virtually no power waveform distortion. For this reason, sensitive electronic production equipment will operate reliably and without damage. And, the generator is capable of operating larger, or more smaller, lights than has ever been possible before on a portable gas generator.

HD_PP_DemoWS.jpg

Wide Shot of Night exterior scene lit with a pkg. consisting of PFC 2.5 & 1.2 HMI Pars, PFC 800w Joker HMI, Kino Flo Flat Head 80, 2 ParaBeam 400s, and a ParaBeam 200 powered by a modified Honda EU6500is.

Where before you could not operate more than a couple 1200W HMIs with non-PFC ballasts on a conventional generator because of the consequent harmonic distortion, now you can load an inverter generator to capacity. And if the generator is one of our modified Honda EU6500is inverter generators, you will be able to run a continuous load of up to 7500W as long as your HMI and Kino ballasts are Power Factor Corrected. But, where I have covered this in another post in this forum I won’t go into more details here. For more details read my posts at http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=19895&page=2

For more information on the use of portable gas generators in motion picture lighting, I suggest you read an article I wrote for my company’s newsletter. The article is available at www.screenlightandgrip.com/html/emailnewsletter_generators.html .


- Guy Holt, Gaffer, Boston
 
If your budget is real low, "triangulate" the headlights from a vehicle into your scene, then use reflectors as needed. If you don't have reflectors, buy one of those shiny solar blankets and wrap it around a big piece of cardboard. Prop them up wherever you need them.

The smoke machine was a good mention, but again, it takes electric that you may not get. Build a fire and make sure the smoke will blow where you need it to. Get it going real good, then have someone lay some wet strips of fabric across it to get the smoke rolling. They can also fan it to spread it.

Use gels against the headlights to for some type of eerie look...maybe an amber color or something light in color.

Hell boy! Get creative!
 
:) All right, thanks for the many inputs and ideas.

I'll do some location scouting at night with some test shots. Then I'll see what I can rent around here.

I'll probably end up using a portable generator, a smoke machine, two lights and a few reflectors. I think that might work well.

On the shooting night there will definitely be a lot of snow lying around. Any experiences with that and/or using it to bounce light?
 
:) I'll see what I can rent around here.
I'll probably end up using a portable generator, a smoke machine, two lights and a few reflectors. I think that might work well.

As you are calling around for equipment bear in mind that you have several options when it comes to operating a 2.5kw HMI off of a 6500W generator depending on the type of ballast and generator you use. While it will be more expensive, a 2.5kw HMI with Power Factor Corrected (PFC) electronic ballast will consume the least power and leave you room on the generator for more than just two lights. If you can’t afford the latest PFC HMI, then you will be better served by a magnetic ballast on an inverter generator then a standard electronic ballast on a construction generator (more on this latter.)

Where electronic HMI ballasts are typically auto-sensing multi-volt ballasts (with an operating range of 90–125 & 180-250 Volts), you can plug it directly into the 240V 4 pin twist-lock receptacle on the generator and it will operate at 240 Volts (where 2.5 kw ballasts are typically wired with a 120V 60Amp Bates Plug (Stage Pin) you will need a 120V 60A Female Bates to 240V 4pin twist-lock adapter to plug a 4kw ballast directly into the generator. ) Or, if the electronic ballast is power factor corrected (draws 23 Amps) you can plug it into the 30A/120V twist-lock receptacle on the generator’s power panel. If the electronic ballast is not power factor corrected (draws 35 Amps) you will not be able to run it off of the 30A/120V twist-lock receptacle without tripping it’s fuse.

Even though a 2.5 magnetic ballast draws approximately 26 amps you will not be able to run it reliably on the 30A/120V twist-lock receptacle on the generator’s power panel. That is because even though the twist-lock receptacle is rated for 30 Amps conventional 6500W generators are only capable of sustaining a peak load of 27.5 Amps per leg for a short period of time. Their continuous load capacity (more than 30 minutes) is 23 Amps per leg. And if there is any line loss from a long cable run the draw of a 2.5 magnetic ballast will climb to upward of 30 Amps. To make matters worse magnetic ballasts have a high front end striking load. That is, a magnetic ballast draws more current during the striking phase and then they “settle down” and require less power to maintain the HMI Arc. By contrast, an electronic ballast “ramps up”. That is, its’ current draw gradually builds until it “tops off.” For this reason, you must always leave “head room” on the generator for the high front end striking load of magnetic ballasts. And to complicate matters even more, the lagging power factor caused by the inductive reactance of the magnetic ballast kicking harmonic currents back into the power stream causes spikes in the supply voltage that can cause erratic tripping of the breakers on the generator or ballast. (for a more detailed explanation of why that is I, again, suggest you read SL&G’s newsletter article.) In my experience the load of a 2.5kw magnetic ballast is too near the operating threshold of a 6500W generator for it to operate reliably.

The only sure way to power a 120V 2.5kw (or even a 4kw) HMI magnetic ballast on a portable gas generator is from its 240V circuit through a 240v-to-120v step down transformer like the one we manufacture for our modified Honda EU6500is. Our 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro will step down the 240V output of the generator to a single 60A 120V circuit that is capable of accommodating the high front end striking load, and even the voltage spikes, of either a 2.5kw or 4kw magnetic ballast at 120V.

HD_PP_DemoWS.jpg

Wide Shot of Night exterior scene lit with a pkg. consisting of PFC 2.5 & 1.2 HMI Pars, PFC 800w Joker HMI, Kino Flo Flat Head 80, 2 ParaBeam 400s, and a ParaBeam 200 powered by a modified Honda EU6500is.

You can maximize the power you can pull from a generator if, rather then plugging the 2.5kw electronic ballast directly into the 240 receptacle and operate it at 240V, you plug it in through a step down transformer like our 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro and operate it at 120 Volts. This way the one light does not monopolize the whole circuit. In the case of our modified EU6500is you would still have 37 Amps left over to power additional lights through the transformer as well if your 2.5kw ballast has Power Factor Correction. And, as I mentioned previously, if you use only HMI and Kino Flo ballasts with Power Factor Correction you can load the generator more fully.

HD_PP_DemoCU.jpg

Two Shot Night exterior reverse cross keyed with Parabeam 400s

In the past we had to de-rate portable gas generators because of the inherent short comings of conventional generators with AVR and Frequency governing systems – especially when dealing with non-linear loads. The harmonic distortion created by non-PFC ballasts reacted poorly with the distorted power waveform of conventional AVR generators, and limited the number of HMIs you could reliably power on a portable generator to 65% of their capacity. But now, that the power of inverter generators has virtually no inherent harmonic distortion (less than 2.5%), and power factor correction (PFC) is available in small HMI ballasts, this conventional wisdom regarding portable gas generators no longer holds true. An inverter generator can be loaded to capacity with PFC HMI and Kino Flo ballasts (which in the case of our modified Honda EU6500is is 7500 Watts) and safely power sophisticated electronic equipment on the same supply.

HD_PP_Demo_SetUp_Night.jpg

PFC 2.5 & 1.2 HMI Pars, PFC 800w Joker HMI, Kino Flo Flat Head 80, 2 ParaBeam 400s, and a ParaBeam 200 powered by a modified Honda EU6500is through a 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro

The enhanced capacity of our modified Honda EU6500is inverter generator would be wasted if not for our 60A transformer/distro. Without the transformer/distro you could never fully utilize the full power of the generator because the load of a light would have to go on one circuit/leg of the generator or the other. For example, when plugging lights into the factory installed power outlet panel of a Honda EU6500is, you reach a point where you can't power an additional 800W Joker because there is not 8 amps (w/ a P2L PFC ballast) available on either one of the factory installed 20A outlets/leg of the generator. With our Full Power Transformer/Distro you can still add that 800 Joker because the Transformer/Distro not only accesses more power (7500 Watts) through a higher rated circuit (60 Amps), but it also splits the load evenly over the two legs (4A/leg) of the generator on that circuit. The end result is that the generator is capable of handling a larger load more easily because it is a perfectly balanced load.

HD_PP_Demo_Transformer-Distro.jpg

PFC 2.5 & 1.2 HMI Pars, PFC 800w Joker HMI, Kino Flo Flat Head 80, 2 ParaBeam 400s, and a ParaBeam 200 powered by a modified Honda EU6500is through a 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro

Another benefit to using a Transformer/Distro is that it splits the load of what ever you plug into it automatically. Which means you no longer have to carefully balance the load over the generator's two 20A/120 circuits/legs as you plug in lights because the Transfomer/Distro does it for you. With our modified Honda EU6500is you simply plug in lights until the load wattage displayed on the generator’s iMonitor reaches 7500 Watts. An overload alarm on the iMonitor display will tell you if you inadvertently overload the Transformer/Distro. Now that you are able to fully utilize the generator's available power, you are able to power larger lights, or more smaller lights, than you could without a transformer/distro. For example, as I mentioned in other forums, I used one of our modified Honda EU6500is Generators on a Red shoot to power a lighting package that consisted of PFC 1200, & 800 HMI Pars, a couple of Kino Flo ParaBeam 400s, a couple of ParaBeam 200s, and a Flat Head 80, in addition to a PFC 2.5kw HMI Par. Given the light sensitivity of the Red Camera, this was all the light we needed to light a similar large night exterior.

Guy Holt, Boston Gaffer
 
You can't light an entire pond at night without expensive and expansive equipment or It'll look terrible. I've tried - you can light foreground elements, but that’s it... maybe - no backlight if you're over water.

If you don't have access to tons of equipment, and you have to shoot this scene - day for night or dawn/dusk shooting - they are your only options.

For power - either find a new location or look into generators. Gas generators are loud as hell, electric ones usually cost more and are lower wattage. Secure lights before you do anything though. They can run up a budget fast - where ever you rent from should have suggestions for a local generator
 
For power - either find a new location or look into generators. Gas generators are loud as hell.

In my experience it is possible to use small portable gas generators and get clean audio tracks. It all comes down to what generator you use and how you use it. I would recommend a Honda EU6500is inverter generator with a 240V-to-120V step down transformer. The Honda EU6500is inverter generator to begin with is much quieter than the older movie blimped Honda EX5500. Part of what makes the new Honda EU6500is so quiet is it's "Eco-Throttle." The Eco-Throttle's microprocessor automatically adjusts the generator's engine speed to produce only the power needed for the applied load. It can do this because the inverter technology of the Honda EU6500is enables it to run at different RPMs and maintain a constant frequency and voltage. Where conventional generators like the Honda EX5500 and ES6500 have to run full speed at a constant 3600 RPM to produce stable 60 hertz (cycle) electricity, a Honda EU6500is only needs to run as fast as required to meet the load demand. Since their engines do not have to run at full speed, and given the fact that an inverter generator generates 20% more power per revolution of the engine, makes the Honda EU series of inverter generators substantially quieter than conventional models.

The net result is that the EU6500is operates between 34 to 44 dBA at 50 ft. - half as loud (ten decibels) as the comparable EM7000is and ES6500 generators and comparable to a Crawford 1400A movie blimped generator. But, where you wouldn't try to park a Crawford right on set and record sound, you shouldn’t try to record sound with a Honda EU6500is right on set. To record sound without picking up generator noise all you need is a distro system that will allow you to move the EU6500is off set (like you would a Crawford), minimize line loss over a long cable run, and provide plug-in pockets conveniently close to set. That is where the transformer comes in.

My company, ScreenLight & Grip (SL&G), has developed a Gen-set that is designed to provide clean quiet set power from a modified Honda EU6500is. What we do is tap the Honda EU6500is inverter generator as it is designed for 230/240V markets like the UK, EU, Australia, & India (to name just a few.) By doing so, we gain access to the full 7650 Watt power capacity designed into the generator for these 230/240V markets, but not available in generators manufactured for 120V Markets like the US. We then use a proprietary step-down transformer/distro we have developed to convert the full 240V power into a single 60A/120V circuit (7500Watts) capable of powering large lights. And, where PWM inverter generators, like the Honda EU6500is, generate a nearly pure power waveform, our modified Honda EU6500is is capable of reliably powering more lights than has been possible before.

Finally, to record sync sound without picking up any generator noise, all you need to do is add 100' - 150' of heavy duty 250V twist-lock extension cable between the generator and our Full Power Transformer/Distro. This is usually enough cable to place the generator around the corner of a building, or to run it out of a van or truck - which is usually all the additional blimping you need with these generators. The heavy-duty 250V twist-lock cable eliminates multiple long cable runs to the generator; as well as, eliminates the voltage drop you would have using standard electrical cords.

HD_PP_Demo_Transformer-Distro.jpg

A Distro System consisting of a 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro, 2-60A GPC (Bates) Splitters, 2-60A Woodhead Box distributes power from a modified Honda EU6500is. Even though the generator is 100' away to reduce noise, plug-in points remain conveniently close to set.

To assure full line level (120V) on set, our 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro is designed to compensate for the slight line loss you will have over an extended cable run. That is, it is designed to slightly boost the voltage on the load side (secondary) so that if you were to feed the supply side (primary) of the transformer 240 volts from the generator, 127 volts would come out on the secondary side where you plug in the lights. This slight boost enables you to place the generator further from set where you won't hear it, yet assure that the supply voltage on set does not drop too low. Our 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro is equipped with a 60A Bates and three 20 A Edison circuits so that you have plug-in pockets conveniently on set.

HD_PP_Demo_Distro.jpg

60A GPC (Bates) Splitters and Woodhead Box.

Our new 60A Full Power Transformer/Distro offers a number of other benefits as well. Without our Transformer/Distro you can never fully utilize the full power of the generator because the load of a light has to go on one circuit/leg of the generator or the other. For example, when plugging lights into the factory installed power outlet panel of a Honda EU6500is, you quickly reach a point where you can't power an additional 1200W HMI because there is not 11.5 amps (w/ a PFC ballast) available on either one of the factory installed 20A outlets/leg of the generator. With our Full Power Transformer/Distro you can still add that 1200W HMI because the Transformer/Distro not only accesses more power (7500 Watts) through a higher rated circuit (60 Amps), but it also splits the load evenly over the two legs (5.75A/leg) of the generator. The end result is that the generator is capable of handling a larger load more easily because it is a perfectly balanced load.

HD_PP_Demo_P2L.jpg

60A Woodhead Box running Power-to-Light PFC 800W ballast (left) and PFC 1200W ballast (right.)

Another benefit to using our Transformer/Distro is that it greatly simplifies set electrics by splitting the load of what ever you plug into it automatically. This means you no longer have to carefully balance the load over the generator's two 20A/120 circuits/legs as you plug in lights because the Transfomer/Distro does it for you. With our modified Honda EU6500is you simply plug in lights until the load wattage displayed on the generator's iMonitor reaches 7500 Watts. Now that you are able to fully utilize the generator's available power, you are able to power larger lights, or more smaller lights, than you could without a transformer/distro. For more details on the use of transformers for set power, I suggest you read the article I wrote for our company newsletter (mentioned above) on the use of portable generators in motion picture production. Use this link - www.screenlightandgrip.com/html/emailnewsletter_generators.html for more information about using inverter generators with transformers for motion picture lighting.

Guy Holt, Gaffer, Boston
 
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