Grants?????

[rbp2005]

Thanks for your responce cool dog.

I have a lawyer and I am fully aware of the legal aspects of filming an Adult Film (2257 age verification, etc etc) The average rate for any porn DVD is $39.99 - $61.99 depending on the quality etc you would be on the lower or upper side of the spectrum. Porn with a storyline (which is what I am looking into) can go from 2hrs minimum to 2 1/2 hrs (since there are 6 sex scenes at around 10-15 min a piece the actual story part ends up being about 1 1/2 hrs ) straight up just sex films can go from 1hr 45min to 6hrs even 16hrs.

I also understand the process of everything required for my film..including Marketing and Distribution which I have a pretty good handle on for a Regional release on both a marketing and a distribution level. I have a very large majority of things figured out.. I was just looking into other means of obtaining money before I go talk to an accountant and my Bank. I figured if people could get a grant for throwing pieces of metal together to form some shape that looks like absoluetly nothing can get grants to fund their crap why couldn't I... I now see that grants be it Govt or private are not for me....sure glad I pay those taxes every year

 

[CootDog]

Well I knew it was lucrative but didn't realize how much so.... VERY cool!

You've obviously done your research and that which a lot of people DON'T do. You're not just jumping into it, you've researched it, know the market and know the risks. You are on the right track with this... Even if the movie doens't take off right away, you still will have the equipment to use again and experience running it.

Good Luck... Please keep me abreast of the progress...

 

[bird]

I figured if people could get a grant for throwing pieces of metal together to form some shape that looks like absoluetly nothing can get grants to fund their crap why couldn't I..

Heh...I'm not even gonna.... my lips are sealed.

 

[WideShot]

I figured if people could get a grant for throwing pieces of metal together to form some shape that looks like absoluetly nothing can get grants to fund their crap why couldn't I..

Right, their abstract sculpturing art is totally inferior to your pornography.

Well I knew it was lucrative but didn't realize how much so.... VERY cool!

Of course its lucrative, I think porn is the #1 US product. But then you're making pornography and not cinema.

You've obviously done your research and that which a lot of people DON'T do. You're not just jumping into it, you've researched it, know the market and know the risks. You are on the right track with this... Even if the movie doens't take off right away, you still will have the equipment to use again and experience running it.

I completely disagree. Scamming on loan applications and not clearly understanding why pornography is not art and therefore it has no grant potential - clearly not understanding how the financing of his own industry works, these things spell bad news for first time directors of any genre. "Even if the movie doesn't take off" If he defaults on a loan payment because he is basing his entire payments off his ROI for the picture, guess what happens to him?


And an aside I am proud to pay my taxes and would have some severe issues with my government if I found out my tax dollars went to fund pornography.

 

[clive]

I guess I have a question.

Are you doing this because you want to make films and this just seems like an easy way to make money doing it?

Are you doing this because you want to make money?

Or, are you doing this because you really want to make porn?

I think the answer is important, because if your real interest is in being a serious film maker at some point in your life, then you want to consider whether you want a stack of porn credits on your CV.

If this is a just a money thing then you've got a lot to learn. Porn is one of the largest most profitable industries in the world. If you've done your homework into how the international distribution network works, and have established contacts, then your business plan alone should bring in more than enough investment to cover your production costs. This is because there are always people out there who don't care where their money comes from providing the ROI is good enough. The thing you need to be careful of is money laundering (in particular drug money) is often done through porn production. If you're only into the money, then the idea of creative control is a nonsense.

If the truth is that you just want to make porn, well, I haven't any advice for you. The adult industry isn't really part of the indie filmmaking industry. We just use the same tools. The difference is that it takes real skills to make a good indie film, especially if you're working with lo-no budgets. With porn, any monkey with a couple of camcorders and a copy of imovie can make and sell a product.

 

[CootDog]

You guys make a good point... Especially you Clive. You touched on something I was going to mention but thought that they already thought about it.

I'm talking about making porn then trying to switch over to cinema films. I personally know someone that was a porn "actress" (lol) that can't get a real cinema job because of the background. She's doing no pay indie films to get enough of a resume to remove the porn stuff all together. She can't mention it or it's out the door with a kick in the A$$.

If this is what you want your career to be, being a porn producer, then good luck because more than likely you'll have to stay there... If you've ever thought about making real movies, then keep thinking and kick the porn idea to the curb.

Why not make a documentary about people that try to leave the porn industry and get real jobs? That way you get to make somehting real, get to learn more about the porn industry and how hard it is to do anyhting besides it. Then after you get done editing it all, make your decision to "jump in" or not.

 

[rbp2005]

But then you're making pornography and not cinema.

I completely disagree. Scamming on loan applications and not clearly understanding why pornography is not art and therefore it has no grant potential - clearly not understanding how the financing of his own industry works, these things spell bad news for first time directors of any genre. "Even if the movie doesn't take off" If he defaults on a loan payment because he is basing his entire payments off his ROI for the picture, guess what happens to him?

Ahhh I see how it is...so even if the script were to be on par with one of your films..which obviously is concidered art..and my girls pull off a good performance worthy of one of your films...it is still not art because it has sex scenes..... thats quite closed minded..especially for such a prestigious artist as yourself

Who exactly are you to say that porn is not art....sure its not as mainstream as the latest star-trek fan pic but it has a purpose that you obviously don't value..which is fine..but again who are you..and why should I care that you or anyone else doesn't concider it art.

I asked a simple question about grants and loans..and now it comes down to saying that was attempting to Scam on my loan app... I asked a question and posed a scenario that was it. And I do have a very good idea about each aspect of my industry (surprised you could muster up the respect to refer to it as an industry) I am not a lawyer nor am I an accountant..I had a question about funding from other sources other than private companies. Because much like Hollywood, not a lot of places will just hand money to up-start directors for a first film. And who said anything about defaulting on my payments..whether the film was successful or not has zero to do with my payments except for how long it will take for me to be done with them.. my stand on the entire loan thing, and the reason I even asked the question is this:

I have the Credit, and the collateral and the payment history to back up a substantial loan...why would I have to put up with questions about where the money is going?! Your getting it back so stfu. I also do not feel that I should be discriminated against by a bank to say nope....it contains naughty dirty things so no money for you...go up and ask for money for Texas Chainsaw 3 and you have money thrown at you..you can get grants and money and product placement....its disgusting


Almost as disgusting as how close minded some of the people on this board are who are supposed artist..which apparently I am not according to.........

I have chosen Adult Film because it is the last bastion of truely free expression..no regulations except for an over-zealous judge or 2 imposing laws that get thrown out by the supreme court. No MPAA standing over a directors back saying.. cut this down..or nope 2 many boobs it might get an NC-17... GASP golly gee we sure don't want to rock the boat.

Could the hostility be because of the fact that my film..or films like it have far more potential to make money than the latest indie film from Jim Bob and his band of merry men. Who is the one with the "Real Job"

To answer an earlier post... I chose Porn because that is what I want to do..and the money is amazing....I also enjoy the "actress" accompanied by the lol...I wonder if the big boys in Hollywood think the same of you guys.

If the truth is that you just want to make porn, well, I haven't any advice for you. The adult industry isn't really part of the indie filmmaking industry. We just use the same tools. The difference is that it takes real skills to make a good indie film, especially if you're working with lo-no budgets. With porn, any monkey with a couple of camcorders and a copy of imovie can make and sell a product.

Ahhh...so porn doesn't take any skills. Gonzo porn perhaps not that is the amateur circuit by far however storyline based films take as much..if not more...skill to make than an indie production of any calibur..because not only do you have to write the compelling script and get a good performance on the dialouge..you also have to film the sex scenes.... but I guess those don't take skill.

 

[Spatula]

What IS art, anyways?

 

[clive]

As it happens I do know of one serious artist who works in porn, her name is Anna Span and she got her degree in fine art at St Martin in the Field, London, before going into the adult industry as a producer/director. I also know some really interesting people who've worked in the adult industry, actresses who've moved into producing and directing.

However, I think this thread has kind of proven my point. If you decide to do porn films, a lot of people are not going to take your work seriously. You will get negative reactions from other indie filmmakers, because porn is seen as different. If you are serious about going into that industry then you are going to have to get used to that.

I'm sure that it is possible to make a porn film with good acting and superb production values, but the truth is that the people who are buying it aren't paying $40 for the cinematography, or the acting, or the script... are they? That's what I meant when I said a monkey with two camcorders can make porn. In terms of you how measure the sucess of the product, either in sales or TV distribution, production values are not an issue. You can make just as much money, if not more, by throwing your artistic and production values out of the window and by giving the punters what they really want, which is to watch people fuck.

And the idea that by showing people fucking, which is the most mundane human activity imaginable, somehow represents greater artistic freedom is nonsense. You aren't going into an industry with greater artisitic freedom, you're going into an industry with the most restricted choice of potential content in the world. It can by it's very nature only be about one thing, sex, not only that it is only about sex at a physical level, so it will never have the artistic integrity of say "Last Tango in Paris" or "Blue Velvet"

The truth is that you probably will make more money than I ever will as an indie film maker, but that doesn't make you an artist. When I make a film my work only sells if I suceed as an artist, my plot, quality of acting and production values aren't an added bonus, they are the product. I have to be a very, very good writer and director to get an audience, you don't.

Just be happy that you're getting lots of money and are doing what you want to do, don't expect to get respect as an artist as well.

 

[spinner]

...okay, rbp2005...I don't pretend to know all there is to know about grant funding, but this is my opinion...

...If what you are looking for is funding for pornography, I don't think you are going to find any takers. If at any point pornography was art, it has moved so far away from this idea that you would be hard pressed to find anyone who is going to buy that line of rationale. I know, from watching dateline or 60minutes or 20/20 and a couple of documentaries on the pornography industry (had to watch and critique a documentary on pornography for a class once, no kiddin'), I know that there is alot of money to be made, but there is money in the sale of marijuana and I just don't see anybody lining up to give you a stand at Wal-Mart....

If what you are going to do is psycho-sexual, say like 91/2 Weeks, or Fatal Attraction, or that film with Sharon Stone, you can probably get funded as a narrative, but these films have story lines, not just "Hey, anybody order a pizza?" If the sex is all you have to offer, good luck...

...also, be very careful of applying for funding and then thinking you are going to switch sides and do something else. Sure, the money is a grant and you don't have to pay it back per se, but an organization like the NEA or any other large funder will have absolutely no problem pulling their funding and making you pay back whatever you have spent on the production to that point if they don't agree. Mapplethorpe did that for us, thus making it harder to get funding, but at the same time there is a level of quality that they can adhere to which isn't such a bad thing.

...I would think that if you want to find funding for pornography, you need to probably find out who it is that produces this kind of film...(geez, what am I saying??? ARE YOU OVER 21??!!???) Once you do, you will probably be met with the same kind of questions that you would be for any other funder. Why should they take a chance on you? And like any other filmmaker, you are going to have to..., to uh...prove that you are worth taking a chance on...(this is one of the weirdest posts I have ever made....)

(....personally, I think porn is kind of silly unless you are watching it with your significant other or girlfriend or what have you....that's an awful lot of build up to your turning the tv off ....)

...btw, Hi, guys, I'm back from my shoot....

--spinner

 

[Spatula]

I will def look into private investors but are there any "no questions asked until you miss a payment" kinda deals at any banks.

You'd probably be better off borrowing money from the Mafia if you don't want any questions asked...

 

[CootDog]

Time put this to bed

...okay, rbp2005... ARE YOU OVER 21??!!???....

--spinner

Spinner, I think you hit it on the head there. After reading the responses and questions from this guy I have come to the conclusion that they just turned 18 and were finally able to go into the adult stores and buy/rent porno's. Then they see how easy it is and how much money they can sell them for, that they decided to do it, make a porno. But since they didn't have any money, they want to go to a bank and get a "no questions asked, until I miss a payment" type loan.

It's re-dick-less!

This thread should be put to rest so this teenager can go to something like pornotalk.com instead of indietalk.com. because an indie porno is still a porno and should seek funding, learn about the business, and learn about shooting asses from the porno site, not here.

Have fun. I wish you the best.

 

[Dr.Maya Baalaamurugaan]

how much is that you need and whats the ROI?