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Grading for Vimeo

Z

ZolaScope

I've just uploaded the trailer for our first film to Vimeo & people are telling me it looks too dark.

I graded the film in FCPX using a calibrated Dell U2410 where it looks fine. It also looks fine burned to DVD and played on our TV (albeit a centuries-old Sony CRT).

But it does look too dark on my laptop display (Mac Retina). And yes, I understand that I can turn up the brightness, but it's already set to a level I'd normally use for photography (I'm a pro photographer, so I understand these things).

So, should I write this off as people just having crappily uncalibrated screens?

The video is at https://vimeo.com/zolascope/impasse-trailer, but don't rush straight there the moment I post this as I've just uploaded a new version and it's stuck in Vimeo's queue (as of 19 Oct 21:00 CEST there's 40 mins to wait before conversion starts).

Would appreciate any insights, though.
 
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Whoops! Works now :woohoo:

It isn't unwatchable, but it's dark.

Compare the screens of your two computers. Are either of them darker? Brighter? Maybe download FCPX on your laptop, and apply the same grade to one shot. Do they look the same?
 
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I'm using FCPX on the laptop, but using the Dell monitor as an external monitor. The Dell is calibrated for the laptop. I find glossy screens, like the laptop's, impossible to work with when adjusting colour & tones. Looking at the waveforms suggests I don't have a huge amount of wriggle room anyway. The images are supposed to be fairly dark, of course.

Like I said - it looked fine on the DVD/TV (and also, incidentally, output to my iPad). But it's definitely murkier on the laptop even when the brightness is turned to what I consider uncomfortably high.
 
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ZolaScope said:
I'm using FCPX on the laptop, but using the Dell monitor as an external monitor. The Dell is calibrated for the laptop. I find glossy screens, like the laptop's, impossible to work with when adjusting colour & tones. Looking at the waveforms suggests I don't have a huge amount of wriggle room anyway. The images are supposed to be fairly dark, of course.

Like I said - it looked fine on the DVD/TV (and also, incidentally, output to my iPad). But it's definitely murkier on the laptop even when the brightness is turned to what I consider uncomfortably high.
Click to expand...

To the max?
 
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Not max, but high enough that light areas start to become uncomfortable. And certainly way above where I would have the brightness set for photography purposes. (I will do rough edits on the laptop screen, but final adjustments are always made on the calibrated screen.)
 
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btw photography and video are two different things, seems like theres something your not quite doing right, but you fail to disclose further information therefore I don't see how anyone can help you.
 
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8salacious9: I'm well aware of where photography & video differ - and also where they are alike. I've already explained that the Dell monitor is calibrated. I could tell you what the brightness setting is (it's 30% if you must know) but that's rendered irrelevant given that the monitor is calibrated for this system, room lighting etc. What works at 20% for one person won't work for someone else using a different graphics card, room illumination etc.

Looks to me like I'm going to have to grade for a specific target - ie, so that it looks good on DVD/TV (which is the main target I'm aiming for) and then maybe create some settings via Compressor for when I want to target for laptops/Vimeo. Laptops do tend to have quite saturated and contrasty displays.
 
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A bit more googling and I discover there's a known 'gamma shift' issue when uploading some Quicktime movies to Vimeo & YouTube. Several people seem to have used the same workaround I was considering - ie, special Compressor settings. Strange that Apple hasn't allowed for this in its 'Share to Vimeo' function - but then, maybe not so strange.
 
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Cool, glad it looks like you got this sorted.

I'll also add that you have a calibrated monitor which I presume is pretty high-end and expensive. I have a calibrated monitor too but it's not high-end, just a Philips 27" LED (273P3QPYEB/27) - cost about $300 new. I use the ColorMunki calibration device.

Your footage looked too dark to me as well. I don't know if it's helpful grabbing a screenshot for you but here's one anyway:

image1_zps17cda177.jpg
 
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That's actually not too far off how it's supposed to look. The shots I've chosen for the trailer are all fairly dark, as it happens. It's just that on the first version I uploaded to Vimeo, they were excessively murky. I'm pretty sure now it's the dread gamma shift.
 
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The gamma shift usually decreases contrast: black go dark grey and whites go light grey.
In Quicktime Pro you can adjust the gamma to normal.

http://www.videocopilot.net/blog/2008/06/fix-quicktime-gamma-shift/

A lot of laptop screens are used darker than a calibrated screen. And if they are bright enough: a lot of them loose detail in the highlights.
I had the same problem when designing a leader for a promo video: my producer didn't see details in the shadow... because his left screen is darker than normal...
(I'm using a calibrated 10bit Eizo)
 
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ZolaScope said:
That's actually not too far off how it's supposed to look. The shots I've chosen for the trailer are all fairly dark, as it happens. It's just that on the first version I uploaded to Vimeo, they were excessively murky. I'm pretty sure now it's the dread gamma shift.
Click to expand...

Are you referencing your scopes? Rule number one is to always use your scopes. Make sure your blacks are above the 0 line.
 
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