archived-videos God in a Box - Short film

film_autre

film_autre

Here's my first Directoral film.... I bring you the crap, God In A Box

Filmed on GH4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPu2EImVv7Q

Thanks to Gorillaonabike, LDS, Mussonman & stephenh123

I learned alot from my first proper short, I made more mistakes than I thought I would and learned that they were easy enough to avoid.

I move on to my next short film which I will hopefully film later this year.

Any comments good or bad welcome, I already rate this bad :)
 
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looked nice! i didn't get a chance to watch fully because i'm at work, but i will when i get home.

the letterbox was a little too thick for me, seemed to interfere with some of the compositions at times.
 
Okay here we go….

There are a TON of bird noises but i don't see any leaves on the trees. The actor seems cool and really intense but I'm distracted by all the birds in what looks like a fall or winter setting.

The light from her phone was fake .. nbd but it wasn't there when you cut back to the same shot before she falls!

The dudes first reaction to a stranger with a knife is to present his back to him.. I was like umm does this dude want to get stabbed. and then he got stabbed. So I guess he must have wanted to.

then the woman did the same thing lol. I think she must have wanted to get stabbed too.
I'm assuming you don't want me laughing at this part but it's going that way.

This seems like poor writing.. people do not turn their backs on a crazy dude with a knife!
they run. yet here in your world you've created apparently everyones first reaction is to present their back to crazy knife wielding dudes

sounds like i am in the middle of a bird sanctuary, there are so many bird noises. are there birds inside the box?

I guess we will never know. I liked the tone/atmosphere of it all, very cool.
Good job for a first short!
 
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sfoster said:
Okay here we go….

There are a TON of bird noises but i don't see any leaves on the trees. The actor seems cool and really intense but I'm distracted by all the birds in what looks like a fall or winter setting.

The light from her phone was fake .. nbd but it wasn't there when you cut back to the same shot before she falls!

The dudes first reaction to a stranger with a knife is to present his back to him.. I was like umm does this dude want to get stabbed. and then he got stabbed. So I guess he must have wanted to.

then the woman did the same thing lol. I think she must have wanted to get stabbed too.
I'm assuming you don't want me laughing at this part but it's going that way.

This seems like poor writing.. people do not turn their backs on a crazy dude with a knife!
they run. yet here in your world you've created apparently everyones first reaction is to present their back to crazy knife wielding dudes

sounds like i am in the middle of a bird sanctuary, there are so many bird noises. are there birds inside the box?

I guess we will never know. I liked the tone/atmosphere of it all, very cool.
Good job for a first short!
Click to expand...

Well we filmed in the woods where there were woodpeckers dogs kids etc etc it was a terrible choice as it made dialogue barely usable, Mussonman did an excellent job disguising all the shit noise and made it seem somewhat natural, so it was a production fault covered in make up :)

I think everyone reacts differently to a knife, I guess the way I saw it was that John saw from the corner of his eye that the killer was approaching and he didnt want anything to happen to his wife so kept himself calm, but then he ran to save the girl which highlights the poor script :)

I think your analysis was spot on and as i said my crap short :)

My next one is for me to improve on and will be based on a script that took me 6 months to write so its written much better and has more character and is longer.

onwards to the next one, with many more to come.
 
The most critical feedback you will ever get is from other film makers, so it's tough for a first short to be shown somewhere like this.

looking forward to the next one!
What if the box opened and birds came out and destroyed the world. and the crazy dude was trying to protect us the whole time.
 
sfoster said:
What if the box opened and birds came out and destroyed the world. and the crazy dude was trying to protect us the whole time.
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hahahaha i vote for this as the sequel

(AND the prequel, when the one box was forged out of the beaks of thousands of birds)
 
Do not be so hard on yourself!! This is great for a first film. You had a lot of very interesting shots and some very intense moments. At least you are self aware enough to know that you have things to improve on. Many people are blind to their own work and think it is the best thing ever created.

I probably wouldn't have noticed the birds, but I guess sfoster made a good point. Although the birds were a great way to create a smooth sound-scape that hid audio imperfections and transitions.

I like the letterbox, but if you choose to crop the image, just make sure you do not crop out the eyes (unless you are intentionally doing that!) It looked like several times the camera drifted too far down and we could not see the actors' whole faces.

And yes about the knife - as a Director/DP myself, I know that many times just because something works well in the script, that doesn't mean it actually works once you film it. That happens all the time. So just try to be honest with yourself when you are on set and answer the question "is this scene working?" If not - then take the time to think it through and re-work it until it makes sense. And ask your actors' opinions too. They will often have good ideas about how to make a scene feel more natural. (but remember you are the director and you have the final say!!)

Overall great work for a first time! Don't be so hard on yourself, and just take what you learned and use it in the next film! Can't wait to see more!

Here are some trailers to a couple films I shot -

I directed, DP'd, and edited this one:
trailer: https://vimeo.com/93476048
full film: https://vimeo.com/104404086

I DP'd this one (and edited the trailer but not the film)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yruWbHkvxok
 
mitchmcclure said:
Do not be so hard on yourself!! This is great for a first film. You had a lot of very interesting shots and some very intense moments. At least you are self aware enough to know that you have things to improve on. Many people are blind to their own work and think it is the best thing ever created.

I probably wouldn't have noticed the birds, but I guess sfoster made a good point. Although the birds were a great way to create a smooth sound-scape that hid audio imperfections and transitions.

I like the letterbox, but if you choose to crop the image, just make sure you do not crop out the eyes (unless you are intentionally doing that!) It looked like several times the camera drifted too far down and we could not see the actors' whole faces.

And yes about the knife - as a Director/DP myself, I know that many times just because something works well in the script, that doesn't mean it actually works once you film it. That happens all the time. So just try to be honest with yourself when you are on set and answer the question "is this scene working?" If not - then take the time to think it through and re-work it until it makes sense. And ask your actors' opinions too. They will often have good ideas about how to make a scene feel more natural. (but remember you are the director and you have the final say!!)

Overall great work for a first time! Don't be so hard on yourself, and just take what you learned and use it in the next film! Can't wait to see more!

Here are some trailers to a couple films I shot -

I directed, DP'd, and edited this one:
trailer: https://vimeo.com/93476048
full film: https://vimeo.com/104404086

I DP'd this one (and edited the trailer but not the film)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yruWbHkvxok
Click to expand...


thanks for the input, in regards to the cropping, the dp shot the scene to frame.. which is why its so close and thats why im shooting my next one myself as this was part of the problem of the film, the framing was poor throughout and I couldnt focus on directing because of the mistakes he kept making in the end I just went with what I had as time was running out and I couldnt afford another shoot.

My next short is in pre-production and I will most certainly make sure these mistakes dont happen again.

saw the trailer, good choice in actor, loved the vibe to it, will watch the full film later, have to say it looks really good and the sound is quite good too!

Also Im always harsh on myself, only when I achieve a level of standard that im happy with will I praise my work.
 
Not completely crap (as you state), for a first attempt. There were numerous problems though, some of which have been mentioned, for example the framing, story logic, etc. The birds are a problem, not just because we don't see any and it contradicts the time of year indicated by the visuals but also because they contradict the tone/feel of the piece. Nice, pleasant summer bird sounds contradicts the dark/horror atmosphere of the film. There were various other sound design issues, for example; the little girl's voice does not sound like it's coming from inside the box, the music/sound design element (0:53-0:55) obscures the dialogue somewhat and doesn't sync with the edit, the Foley steps are missing just after this edit and John's dialogue is muffled, for much of the rest of the piece Lisa's voice, vocalisations/breathing etc., is panned to the centre and louder/more present than John and Xander even though she's not in the frame. All these (and other) sound design errors, many of them relating to a lack of believable aural perspective, contradict/detract from the visuals and disengage an audience.

mitchmcclure said:
I probably wouldn't have noticed the birds ...
Click to expand...

While an audience probably wouldn't be able to consciously identify these sound design contradictions/errors, either individually or collectively, they would definitely feel something was wrong and be pulled out of the story, which of course is the exact opposite of what sound design should be achieving!

OP: As a filmmaker/Director you absolutely do need to be able to "notice the birds" and the other items I mentioned because the essence of being a good filmmaker/director is telling engaging stories and therefore, you obviously can't afford anything which will disengage your audience. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter how good your screenwriting, camera work, editing or other filmmaking abilities, if you're disengaging your audience with the sound/sound design.

BTW, I don't mean to come across too harshly, I've seen countless far worse first attempts and understanding how to use sound in combination with the moving image to make engaging stories is not something which takes 5 minutes to learn. So don't be in any way discouraged by my observations/comments!

G
 
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As explanation for the birds, when we arrived, the location hadn't been scouted for sound. This mean there were dogs barking, planes flying overhead, a busker singing his heart out, children screaming, a football game, passers by chatting and just when we thought it couldn't get any louder, Mr Woodpecker started hammering away at a tree and the sum total was slightly noisier than Grand Central Station.

On top of that, my little Fostex's battery died literally the morning I arrived so had to pull out my backup DR100.

So beat him up all you like as next time, he will scout for sound.
 
AudioPostExpert said:
Not completely crap (as you state), for a first attempt. There were numerous problems though, some of which have been mentioned, for example the framing, story logic, etc. The birds are a problem, not just because we don't see any and it contradicts the time of year indicated by the visuals but also because they contradict the tone/feel of the piece. Nice, pleasant summer bird sounds contradicts the dark/horror atmosphere of the film. There were various other sound design issues, for example; the little girl's voice does not sound like it's coming from inside the box, the music/sound design element (0:53-0:55) obscures the dialogue somewhat and doesn't sync with the edit, the Foley steps are missing just after this edit and John's dialogue is muffled, for much of the rest of the piece Lisa's voice, vocalisations/breathing etc., is panned to the centre and louder/more present than John and Xander even though she's not in the frame. All these (and other) sound design errors, many of them relating to a lack of believable aural perspective, contradict/detract from the visuals and disengage an audience.



While an audience probably wouldn't be able to consciously identify these sound design contradictions/errors, either individually or collectively, they would definitely feel something was wrong and be pulled out of the story, which of course is the exact opposite of what sound design should be achieving!

OP: As a filmmaker/Director you absolutely do need to be able to "notice the birds" and the other items I mentioned because the essence of being a good filmmaker/director is telling engaging stories and therefore, you obviously can't afford anything which will disengage your audience. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter how good your screenwriting, camera work, editing or other filmmaking abilities, if you're disengaging your audience with the sound/sound design.

BTW, I don't mean to come across too harshly, I've seen countless far worse first attempts and understanding how to use sound in combination with the moving image to make engaging stories is not something which takes 5 minutes to learn. So don't be in any way discouraged by my observations/comments!

G
Click to expand...


You needn't worry about being too harsh, I take every criticism as constructive even those who hate my work have some element of truth in there, I work on flaws and right now I have pinpointed it to story, DP, sound and choice of location sound.

the sound is what most got me and Credit to Mussonman for the work he did in such a short space of time and for the money he did it for, overall I'm pleased that it has come out and it was a major test of skills which proved I have still alot to learn but I feel it has helped me grow as a filmmaker.

thanks again for your comments and watching the film, I will return hopefully with a much better production value!!
 
gorillaonabike said:
So beat him up all you like as next time, he will scout for sound.
Click to expand...

As production sound is recorded in mono, each scene's ambiance always has to be constructed. Obviously, that's a lot easier to do if the production dialogue is fairly clean to start with. I wasn't specifically referring to the cleanliness of the production sound though, I was referring (amongst other things) to the particular bird song sfx chosen to construct the ambiance. The ambiance could have been constructed with sounds other than birds or if birdsong sfx were somehow unavoidable, maybe crows instead of cheerful spring/summer birds.

It's extremely common to have to use sound design elements to cover imperfections and/or other technical issues, what makes sound design an art rather than just a technical skill is that even in these circumstances, the aesthetic of the story/film is always a paramount consideration!

film_autre said:
You needn't worry about being too harsh, I take every criticism as constructive ...
Click to expand...

Good, constructive criticism is what I intended.

G
 
film_autre said:
thanks for the input, in regards to the cropping, the dp shot the scene to frame.. which is why its so close and thats why im shooting my next one myself as this was part of the problem of the film, the framing was poor throughout and I couldnt focus on directing because of the mistakes he kept making
Click to expand...

Did you have any storyboards?
I always have drawings for my DP so he can see how much head room to leave, etc..

It helps a lot when I try to communicate my vision.
 
sfoster said:
Did you have any storyboards?
I always have drawings for my DP so he can see how much head room to leave, etc..

It helps a lot when I try to communicate my vision.
Click to expand...

storyboards? I could have filmed it myself and shown him exactly what to get and he still would have framed too tight.

we spent 3 hours on storyboarding/shotlists and I specifically told him "we are shooting 4k, so I want you to frame much much wider than you would so I have room to play with"

on the day he took too long to set up even the first shot and not only that he must have thought we were doing macro videography, if that answers your question...
 
film_autre said:
storyboards? I could have filmed it myself and shown him exactly what to get and he still would have framed too tight.

we spent 3 hours on storyboarding/shotlists and I specifically told him "we are shooting 4k, so I want you to frame much much wider than you would so I have room to play with"

on the day he took too long to set up even the first shot and not only that he must have thought we were doing macro videography, if that answers your question...
Click to expand...

:lol:

yeah that answers my question.
Were you paying him? Yikes.
 
film_autre said:
If I had paid him, I would have hired a hitman to get my money back.. :)
Click to expand...

This weekend was the first time I held my own camera while directing.
It's nice not having to explain myself and I can frame shots exactly how I please but honestly it took away a lot of my focus toward directing. It was too much of a distraction for me with a serious project.

For fun little things to practice or play around yeah I may do it again.
 
sfoster said:
This weekend was the first time I held my own camera while directing.
It's nice not having to explain myself and I can frame shots exactly how I please but honestly it took away a lot of my focus toward directing. It was too much of a distraction for me with a serious project.

For fun little things to practice or play around yeah I may do it again.
Click to expand...

im gonna test it out and see how i feel about it, I will have an AD (hopefully) so that should help me a bit..
 
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