Extremely new guy with questions

[blitz1027]

Hello all. I am very new to movie making and hope to be able to make some quality stuff and had a few questions. My cousin and I have put together a screenplay for what we hope to be an action movie that will have a run time in the 25 to 30 minute range. For the record we have what some might call a shoe string budget. Personally I call it being broke. So please don't hate on me too much.

First off the camera we are using is a Cannon Vixia HF M40. It can accept additional lenses but haven't bought any yet because we don't really know what we need if any. I know the additional lens will reduce the amount of light but we will be filming this in the middle of the day. I have been hearing conflicting stories on what lens we need. Some people say a wide angle lens while others say a telephoto lens.
What do you guys recommend? Also I see a ton of lenses on Ebay for little or nothing but I don't want to buy something and it be absolute garbage. Can anyone give me they're thoughts on the Vivitar lenses?

Second off is sound. We have a zoom h4n and have heard good things about it but wanted to get your thoughts on it. We still need to get a wind windscreen for it and not sure what else.

I think that's all for the moment but I'm sure I'm forgetting something.

 

[ChimpPhobiaFilms]

Hello new dude

 

[directorik]

You’re forgetting a lot - but that’s okay, you’ll get there.

For now don’t think about buying a lens or a windscreen. I’m sure
you’ve made a couple of really short films with your camera and
h4n, right? What do YOU feel is lacking? In general most of the
movies I see lack good lighting - or any lighting at all. Shooting in
the middle of the day is fine but you still need to learn to light. A
little fill here and there, a backlight, a little “kick” to an actors
face, some light (and shadow) on a wall and you will see a huge
difference.

Nice you’re thinking of audio - that’s almost always the biggest
issue in the early films of any filmmaker. Get that mic in close
using a boom of some kind and you’ll notice an immediate
improvement.

Make a few more “test” films - under five minutes - trying out
different settings, lights, mic placement; you’ll get a feel of what
your production needs are much better than listening to what
other people say. As you already know some people say shoot with
a wide angle lens and some say get a telephoto lens. People shoot
differently and have different needs.

My advice it to learn to use what you have rather than spending
money you don’t have on new stuff.

 

[Zensteve]

the camera we are using is a Cannon Vixia HF M40. It can accept additional lenses

Are you sure about that?

I know you can get maybe a wide-angle adapter (that screws on like a lens filter), but you're not going to be swapping lenses about like a DSLR camera.

We have a zoom h4n and have heard good things about it but wanted to get your thoughts on it

It's pretty decent, for your budget (which you said was zero). You can probably dummy up a boom pole and get a cheap directional mic for not much money. For a no-budget film, you'd be doing alright.

In short, you could totally make a great film with that camera & gear, given the budget. As always, the film will only be as good as the planning & preparation that goes into it.

.

 

[ChimpPhobiaFilms]

It's pretty decent, for your budget (which you said was zero). You can probably dummy up a boom pole and get a cheap directional mic for not much money. For a no-budget film, you'd be doing alright.
.

I've used a monopod as a boom pole. It worked surprisingly well.

I also used a broken piece from a lighting stand. Again, not too bad. Can't say it looked great, but not bad

My advice it to learn to use what you have rather than spending
money you don’t have on new stuff.

+1

-------------------

You could always get a 35mm adapter, but that can get pricy (unless you go DIY).

OP: Lighting? Editing software? Just curious.

 

[blitz1027]

Thanks for all the advice. We've only made one other thing that we put out. It was kind of an homage to Michael Jackson that my cousin came up with. Mind you we had no idea what we were doing at the time and still really don't but we are trying to learn. Here is a link to what we did before. At the time we didn't have the zoom h4n and no real workable screenplay. We just kind of went with the flow and it turned into an all encompassing monster.

If you watch it read the description first as it describes the story. My cousin is playing MJ my brother on camera and backup dancer and me for the lights and Mr. Big/backup dancer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhgX9_Yrhh4

Just don't kill me over as it was out first attempt at anything like this.

 

[directorik]

Looks to me like you need to make four or five more movies
before you attempt your half-hour action one. You will learn
with each one. Then when you have more actual experience
(not messageboard advice) you can make some quality stuff.
Quality comes from talent and experience more than it does
from the equipment. You have the talent - now earn the experience.

 

[KnightsFan]

To contrast with directorik, just go ahead and make your 30 minute movie and use every shot as a learning experience. It comes out to the same thing, except you don't have to invent 4-5 different stories. That's my recommendation, anyway.

And don't spend much money until you have experience, especially if you're broke. One, there's no point having a good camera if you use it like a bad one, and, two, using poor equipment shows which aspects you want improved.

 

[directorik]

I’m curious; why is investing in four or five different stories
not a good idea?

Not arguing your point. Just curious about your recommendation.

 

[Alcove Audio]

We have a zoom h4n and have heard good things about it but wanted to get your thoughts on it.

You've heard that it is okay from people who have never used anything better. It is an acceptable piece of gear if you are on a micro-budget, but I would hardly call it good.

You will need a mic. My micro-budget recommendation are:

For outdoors the Audio-Technica AT875 ($160 w/no accessories).

For indoors the Avantone Pro CK-1 ($150 w/no accessories).


You can make a boom-pole out of a painters pole or lightbulb changing pole.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmWWjlfMh9w

 

[ChimpPhobiaFilms]

I prefer directorik's idea (making some shorts before a big project).

I'd rather make a good few minute short than an OK 30 minute project. By working on shorter projects, you get to focus more on the small (but still important) details. You can pay more attention and improve your gear, directing, and organizational skills.

 

[cheeseandachallenge]

I'll add my support to the making-a-few-shorter-things-first camp.

My first "serious" film was a 14 minute film I shot at school. At the time, I was kind of lacking in terms of my story creating ability (I seem to have figured out how to create stories I like recently). But anyway, it wasn't awful, as such. But I was never passionate about the story. It took us many many months to make (being at school, it was about a month of shooting in weekends, then 4+ in post at lunch times). The longer I went on, the harder it was to keep going, because I began to hate it more and more. When you see all the things you've done wrong, but have to keep going, it's really demoralising. You often don't realise these things until you get a significant way through post, but still have a lot of fine tuning to do - and by then it's unfair on everyone involved to just scrap it.

If you do five 1-5 minute shorts, you'll realise much quicker what you did wrong, but it won't be such an overwhelming task to finish the project (that's the other thing, it is quite a huge effort to make a film all the way through and can be incredibly draining). I think investing a few weeks to a month (you can do it in a week, but lets just say you're planning this more meticulously) into a few minutes of something not that good is less demoralising that 2+ months.

 

[blitz1027]

Thanks for the tips. I know our first effort was severely lacking and we want our next effort to be good as we would like to enter it into one of the local film festivals. The only problem I have is that my cousin will be moving away the beginning of next year so we will have to film it in the next couple months.

One thought I had and would like to ask what you thought is what if we made a short or two to help introduce the characters? That way we can get a feel for it while preparing for longer one.

 

[ChimpPhobiaFilms]

Thanks for the tips. I know our first effort was severely lacking and we want our next effort to be good as we would like to enter it into one of the local film festivals. The only problem I have is that my cousin will be moving away the beginning of next year so we will have to film it in the next couple months.

One thought I had and would like to ask what you thought is what if we made a short or two to help introduce the characters? That way we can get a feel for it while preparing for longer one.

Sure. You could always take a part of your screenplay, and shoot that. Or you could make a prequel-sequel-short version of it.

 

[blitz1027]

Sure. You could always take a part of your screenplay, and shoot that. Or you could make a prequel-sequel-short version of it.

The way our screenplay is written it would be near impossible to break it up into a short. My original idea was to do something in the vein of one of the old action movies where everything is pretty straight forward and no big plot twists, so I will probably go back to that.

 

[IndiePaul]

OP, it depends on the end-quality you want for your action movie. I presume you want it to be pretty good hence I'd also recommend what the majority here are recommending - get more experience before tackling the action movie/short.

Since your cousin is moving away soon that puts a big time pressure on you. Just get filming. If you don't have time to write a test short or two then just take some non-action scenes from your action screenplay and test film those. Test different shots, lighting, audio set-ups etc.

You can upload some of the test vids and ask for further advice.

 

[blitz1027]

OP, it depends on the end-quality you want for your action movie. I presume you want it to be pretty good hence I'd also recommend what the majority here are recommending - get more experience before tackling the action movie/short.

Since your cousin is moving away soon that puts a big time pressure on you. Just get filming. If you don't have time to write a test short or two then just take some non-action scenes from your action screenplay and test film those. Test different shots, lighting, audio set-ups etc.

You can upload some of the test vids and ask for further advice.

Thanks for the advice. We have about decided that we would like to make at least one 3 to 5 minute short to introduce the characters for the movie and help establish them. The movie we are making starts at the end of a mission they are on so we thought maybe doing a short or 2 to lead up to the movie.

What do you think? Any suggestions on how to set the characters up? One thought I had was to do a short of them meeting for the first time and completing their first mission together and then do one that starts the mission that ends at the beginning of the movie.

Not sure if what I said makes any sense I'm just trying to figure out what I can do.

Also for the record the 2 main characters are PMC-ish. They're not mercenaries but they work for the highest bidder or handle jobs that the police can't do.

 

[Richrebel]

Hello there

I personally would recommend that you make your first ever film shorter, a 3-5 minute simple short will help you to get the hang of it before you try and do anything more complex. Especially as action scenes take longer than dialogue.