cinematography Cinematography / VFX question for a particular shoot

A

Asad J

Hey you guys!

I have a question about this one scene that I'm set to shoot in a couple of months as part of a film I'm setting out to do. The scene is a dance sequence with one dancer.

What I'm trying to achieve:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5WzYNPga1-Vb2MxdUdyVzd4ZG8/view?usp=sharing

Ofcourse that's an enormous production value there.

The idea is that on a limitless budget, I'd have a big screen in the back that had a video running with the dancer in front of it, dancing a modern dance piece. (Don't need the spotlights or smoke in the reference pic).

What I have:
The space I have is a dance studio at my college, which I can use for free. I'm attaching a simple map drawing of what the layout of the studio is like.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5WzYNPga1-VX1BfSkxHaFBuRjA/view?usp=sharing

The shots I have in mind are everything between closeups and wide shots, from various angles, so ideally, anything could be in the shot except for the wall with the seats.

I don't think I'm even close to the budget that could fill the entire back wall with screens. So as I see it, there are two options I have.

1. Spread the black curtains all around the room, project the video using the (rather beat up) projector over the curtains.
PROS AND CONS: This'd get us close more or less, except that since the projector only has a limited field of projection, I can't shoot too wide, which'll be extremely constrictive. Also, the image from the projector is sort of washed out, and not particularly vibrant. It's remarkably weak when it comes brightness and contrast.

2. The room has a grid over it for tech stuff. I could possibly cover the back wall with green screen, hanging the fabric from the grid with hooks and put sand bags at the base to keep it flat. Then I could shoot the entire thing on the green screen, and key in the video I want to play behind it.

PROS AND CONS: For one, the light from the video won't interact with the dancer at all, so I fear it'll look like a green screen job, with no luminous interaction between the object and the light in her background. She'd look awfully detached. Secondly, covering a wall that's 50 feet (possibly even more) is kind of a steep affair, since that's a lot of green screen fabric, and we're a micro-budget production.

What I'm hoping to get suggestions on:
Does anyone have a better solution as to how to shoot this in this space? I'm certainly not married to this space in particular, and I can take the shoot elsewhere, but I don't know what any other space could offer short of a jumbotron screen for one of the walls that'd help my case.
If anyone has any suggestions about a different place to shoot this in, or if you can imagine a better way to film this or use any VFX, or even help me figure out how I might be able to improve on the two ideas to be able to get this done to look a little more legit, I'd be extremely grateful for the input. It's an extremely crucial point in the film.
Also, it's set in a metaphorical space, so I don't need it to look like a stage or a particular platform. There's a ton of room for artistic tweaks to it, so if you think of a better way to accomplish what I'm trying to shoot, I'll owe you a kidney! =) Thanks so much guys!!!:)
 
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I guess my guesses were as good as any. =)
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Guess any guess is better than no guess.

Does anyone have a better solution
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First, it's really hard to understand what you're trying to achieve. You're providing so little information. In my opinion, your technical abilities are the single largest limitation. I say that, due to the other threads where I get the opinion that you're trying to do everything yourself. That's fine in itself, it'll simply waste our time if you're incapable of doing the task.

To my solution: Shoot scenes that are within your budget. Find alternative ways to shoot scenes. Find creative solutions. This is key to no budget film making. Focus on filmmaking basics. Focus on what makes scenes interesting and exciting.

When shooting special effects, you either need to be able to do it or be able to recruit/afford people required to do the task and talk with them. That's their job. If you use people who aren't capable or up to the task, the end result will likely be less than stellar.
 
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Why can't you try both methods?

Yes, there are pros and cons for any method you try. You know
you can't get that look on your budget to you try to get as close
as you can.

What about borrowing as many TV/monitors as you can manage
and placing them around the room?
 
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Question: I once shot in a dance space and discovered why no-one does this. The reason is the sprung floor.

Every time someone took a step, a 'wave' would go out and the DoP with camera started to bounce up and down.

Is the floor sprung? Because if it is, this will make life a little more challenging. It's not impossible, rather it just needs to be compensated for.
 
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Thanks @gorilla: I was afraid of the sprung floor, having some background in dance myself. I went in there are tried to do a sample shoot just to see how it ended up. It wasn't as bad. I think if we pick the spots right on stage, the spring and wave won't be as disruptive, but thank you for bringing that up. It's a great little detail to be aware of.

@Directorik: I like the idea of the TV monitors. Maybe if I watered down the idea and reimagined it with those little screens, I could come up with something that feels interesting. Thank you, as always, for the great advice! =)


@Sweetie: Thank you. I figured being creative with it, going back to what makes the scenes tick and simplifying the concept of the shoot was the way to go. Like you said, it normally is with low-budget filmmaking.

However...

Sweetie said:
In my opinion, your technical abilities are the single largest limitation. I say that, due to the other threads where I get the opinion that you're trying to do everything yourself. That's fine in itself, it'll simply waste our time if you're incapable of doing the task.
.
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I can't imagine how you thought it was a good instinct to infer that I was technically incapable or running a one man show based on my past posts.

Firstly, they're spread over 2 years, and that's a lot of time to learn and acquire new things. It's hardly a reflection of where I am and what I know at this point in time. The circumstances change.

Secondly, even if I was technically super limited, or doing it all myself (neither is true), I don't think it'd be fair to be told that I'm not quite at the mark where I deserve someone's time and advice, or to go so far as saying that "I am incapable of doing the task". Because if you feel that way, wouldn't it have been a lot easier to just roll your eyes, and be succint with "simplify the concept, and know your limits. it's about being creative" rather than telling me about my technical inadequacies? I love filmmaking, as do you, or anyone else here. The point behind a forum like this is to help people with what they don't know. There shouldn't be the fear of not measuring up to someone else's knowledge base or experience when one asks a question. Assuming to know my process and how I work, and then assuming how technically informed I am right now, after only having known me for the fragments of my curiosity and things I don't know, on a forum online, is a little much.

I don't mean any offence, but to take the time to tell someone they're not worth your time is both counter-intuitive and less-than-helpful. It just puts one down, and keeps them from exploring and being curious. I am curious, and I have questions. Some of them might be rudimentary, some simple, some even uninformed, but I'm not the only one. People here ask simple stuff all the time, down to what difference a sensor size makes, without the fear that their questions aren't worthy of a response. A question is asked BECAUSE there is a difference in technical capability or knowledge base. Someone knows something you don't, so you ask. That's the whole point of the website.

I dont mean any offence. I respect you and your expertise, and I'm fully grateful for all your advice in all posts prior too. I appreciate your patience with me in the past, the present and the future, and as I go on trying to learn more and grow as a filmmaker, I hope you'll find it in you to ignore any of my wonderings hereon out that feel like they aren't the best use of your time. All the best.
 
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even if I was technically super limited
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I don't mean any offence, but to take the time to tell someone they're not worth your time is both counter-intuitive and less-than-helpful.
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Look, I really don't care if you agree or not, whether you consider it helpful or not. I don't set out to offend.

I see you asking questions. Don't get me wrong, asking questions is good and I encourage you to ask more. If I didn't, I wouldn't write responses. Where I see you falling down is the roles you're assuming, combined with the questions you're asking. It's showing that your knowledge/ability within those roles are limited. Once again, it's not that you don't know. It's that you've (to me at least) come across as a "I know it" on those roles where if you did actually know it, you'd already have the answers. This is why I'm saying you're wasting time.

Who knows, maybe I misread the whole situation.
 
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Thanks Sweetie. I didn't mean offense likewise. It's a live-and-learn thing. I'm still a film student, and in film school, so assuming a lot of roles is how the show rolls for now. I'm quite avidly looking forward to that ending and just wearing the director's hat, but for another year, this is all I have. Anyway, I earnestly do appreciate your feedback here and before, and I hope my emotional diatribe doesn't cause any bad blood. You clearly know what you're talking about, and I respect the hell out of that. =)

Trueindie: I think that'll be the way I do this particular one. I was just fishing to see if there was a better way that I wasn't thinking about, but I'll definitely go green screen with this. Thanks!
 
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