ANIME FIGHT SCENES

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NIGHTFLYER

I just checked out the Anime series AIRMASTER and was hooked that is the style I want my fight scenes to look in my upcoming film. Stylized, but less of the panty shots) why do anime fight scenes look so stylized and artistic, than compared to mainstream cinema. I think one live action film that came close to the Anime look was CROUCHIING TIGER/HIDDEN DRAGON. And of course the John Woo films.


Okay something a little off topic. THE SHINING. God that film just freaks me out. Over the Halloween weeeknd a bunch of friends and I were having a FRIGHT NIGHT FESTIVAL, THE SHINING, John Carpenters THE THING, with others. But a lot of them have NEVER seen THE SHINING and some of the girls ran out of the room during that hallway scene with the two girls. They were even stunned to learn that Stanley Kurbick directed it. The guy from 2001. A LONG way from space. Ok my question which I am still stumped at as well as everyone else. The ending. What was the deal about that. (SPOILER ALERT) Him appearing in the picture taken in 1921. The remake stays more close to the actual novel but the ending is different.

Wish I could find the soundtrack to the film. A cold winters night, listening to that......
 
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NIGHTFLYER said:
I just checked out the Anime series AIRMASTER and was hooked that is the style I want my fight scenes to look in my upcoming film. Stylized, but less of the panty shots) why do anime fight scenes look so stylized and artistic, than compared to mainstream cinema. I think one live action film that came close to the Anime look was CROUCHIING TIGER/HIDDEN DRAGON. And of course the John Woo films.
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Because at one point they were trying to emulate life, then someone said "we don't have to" and it became something else. Now, motion picture attempts to emulate Anime.

And fails.

You can't do it in live action without it looking silly... unless you'vebeen watching a ton of Anime from the get-go and understand WHY it works. For example:

Advent Children -- Tifa vs Loz:

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/3018092/advent_children_complete_tifa_vs_loz/

Live Action version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCZqpPNB-Qs&feature=related


You basically can't get humans or live action cameras to emulate Anime-esque action, you have to know how to move the camera, when to cut, and what makes the fight a fight.

I've been working on this for six or seven years now and still doing tests. In the end, it takes a lot of money to make it look good. And by good, I mean not horribly cheesey and stupid.

Scott Pilgrim gets the closest in US Cinema, but doesn't hold a candle to Wilson Yip and Donnie Yen when they work together:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVbZKHxixr8


at the end of it all... it is about how your actors can sell the action, and even more so... if you know how to move the camera.
 
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Kholi said:
You can't do it in live action without it looking silly...
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Yes x 100.

Cartoons get away with a lot because since everything is less detailed and disproportionate to the real world, the laws of physics can go out the window. Seeing a guy jump 80 feet or have a conversation while soaring through the air makes sense in an animated world, not as much when doing it with live action.

For a big budget example, look at the animated "Avatar: The Last Airbender" and the Hollywood live action release, "The Last Airbender", and we're talking action only. Not casting, script or whatever flaws. They toned down Aang a LOT for the movie. They had to. In the cartoon he'll jump from rock to rock up a cliffside in 4 seconds. It doesn't make sense in our head seeing a real little boy do that. He wouldn't have time to catch himself, bend his knees and make the next jump (even if he could jump 20 ft).

That's just one example, there's a lot, and that's one reason why most (not all) anime/videogame/animation stories converted to real life have been lackluster.

Even the modern superman stuff felt silly.
 
There's a way to get there, but you won't be doing it without a lot of money one way or another.

You either shoot green screen for most if not ALL of the fight and cover the action with a combination of Motion Control, Handheld, Cranes and Dollies (take a week to shoot one entire action sequence, and then a month and a team to composite the sequence, cut, etc)

Or, you just spend a ton of money and shoot it out on a set/location that's designed to let you move the camera and the people as you see fit.

You're also probably gonna need to learn how digital doubles work.
 
If you look at some more eastern, especially chinese martial art movies such as the one you pointed out, you'll notice that they are all quite artistic. This has got to do with the culture.

In ancient china for example, martial art is precisely what it says, an art form. It's far more than just a form of combat, it's life. Being an art form, it naturally looks good. Western fights are much more.... brute forcing, shall i say.

A comparison is much easier to see:
a typical asian fight scene from IP man: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqyKAPTIj4o
EDIT: Just noticed that Kholi already pointed out about Donnie Yen. But yeah, if you like the style, look towards Asian cinema. There's plenty where it comes from. Also. As well as camera movement, some wire stunt is crucial to this kind of look.

a typical wester fight scene from007: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvYB5Z7PWTk

though exceptions apply, for example, matrix is one where the fights were more artistic looking. But arguably that's because the stunt choreographer was the same as the stunt choreographer for crouching tiger, hidden dragon. A hong kong stunt choreographer i might add.

Of course, neither can possibly be ever as dramatic as anime. Because if you've seen much anime, you'll notice how over exaggerated things can be.

My idea is, if you want your fight to look almost dance like, get an asian choreographer, or at least someone trained in traditional eastern martial art.
 
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Just weighing in with a thought, maybe because in movies that want anime-esq action scenes, it rubs harshly against live action-esq NON-action scenes. If someone were to make an entire film trying to grab an anime-like style, then the action scenes wouldn't look out of place so much. EVERYTHING would play fast and loose with physics! Not just talking about wire-work kind of stuff, but the basic ways people walk down a street, etc.

Personally, part of why I like cartoons (from around the world) is because they have the freedom to do things you can't really do with live actors. Using Kholi's example, that's why Advent Children was a lot more satisfying than the Spirits Within.

That said, if someone wants to adapt more of the Baccanno! light novels, I'd be first in line! Slayers might not work, but Lodoss could make a great live-action fantasy epic! (though also, not cheap)
 
NIGHTFLYER said:
Ok my question which I am still stumped at as well as everyone else. The ending. What was the deal about that. (SPOILER ALERT) Him appearing in the picture taken in 1921.
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Who knows? The screenplay didn't follow the book. Stephen King himself said he hated the adaptation. All we know is that Jack Torrance was the caretaker and always has been. The bartender told him so. What that implies is that Jack keeps dying, gets reborn then finds his way back out to the hotel like he's caught in some evil endless loop that has him forever trying to murder his family.

I myself really like the photo at the end. Think of all that time they spent there, wondering up and down the hall past that photo. What if one of them had actually spotted Jack in it. Would it have changed anything?
 
That calls to mind Speed Racer going from an animated series to a live action movie. I understood the translation from an animation to live action, which made the action look silly. The only way around it is make the whole production look surreal.
 
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