Semi-Pro Camera 1.5k-2k budget

DanGoloborodko

DanGoloborodko

Looking to get my second camera had an old camcorder before. Not looking to get a camcorder at all really. Maybe a DSLR? Let me know what a good buy would be. I have 2k to spend on the camera and sound so if you can give me a good setup that would be great. Shooting mostly short films/skits and maybe a documentary or two
 
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I have not. (i see you around a lot and i've checked out your stuff Alcove so if you can give me some pointers that would help). I'm trying to build a fairly basic yet versatile setup. I want something that can shoot various types of footage yet remain fairly priced and not bulky.
 
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In your price range DSLRs will give the best image. There really isn't a prosumer camera that inexpensive that can compete. Take a look at the Panasonic GH2. I've shot with both Panasonic and Canon DSLRs*, and the GH2 is the best value out there in my opinion.

*Panasonic cameras aren't technically DSLRs, but it's easier to lump them in that group.
 
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Here's the Audio Technica AT897 shotgun mic kit ($660):

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...chnica_AT897BK_AT_897_Shotgun_Microphone.html

Add in the Tascam DR-100 ($330) as your digital audio recorder and the sE Electronics SE1A ($160) as your cardioid condenser mic and you're set at the prosumer level.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...100_DR_100_Professional_Portable_Digital.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/359043-REG/sE_Electronics_SE1A_SE1A_Small_Diaphragm.html

I can hear you say "That's over $1,000! Way too expensive!" Not really when you consider that you'll be using all of it (mics, boom-pole, shock-mount, recorder) ten years from now (only costs you $100/year) when you're on you're third camera. Audio gear (with the exception if the DR-100) will hold on to much more of its value than a camera, which tend to be fadish (who was talking DSLRs two years ago?). With audio gear you just keep adding to your collection. I have mics I've been using for 25+ years.
 
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Alcove Audio said:
Here's the Audio Technica AT897 shotgun mic kit ($660):

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...chnica_AT897BK_AT_897_Shotgun_Microphone.html

Add in the Tascam DR-100 ($330) as your digital audio recorder and the sE Electronics SE1A ($160) as your cardioid condenser mic and you're set at the prosumer level.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...100_DR_100_Professional_Portable_Digital.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/359043-REG/sE_Electronics_SE1A_SE1A_Small_Diaphragm.html

I can hear you say "That's over $1,000! Way too expensive!" Not really when you consider that you'll be using all of it (mics, boom-pole, shock-mount, recorder) ten years from now (only costs you $100/year) when you're on you're third camera. Audio gear (with the exception if the DR-100) will hold on to much more of its value than a camera, which tend to be fadish (who was talking DSLRs two years ago?). With audio gear you just keep adding to your collection. I have mics I've been using for 25+ years.
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Do i really NEED the DR-100? I'll be doing short films/documentaries mostly
 
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The only way you could get away without a digital audio recorder is of you have a camera with XLR audio inputs.

And, BTW, if you're doing docs audio is even more important; you only get one shot at the audio, so you want something solid and reliable.
 
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gorillaonabike said:
Just out of curiosity ~ why a dslr? I went for a VG10 because it has dslr video quality without the hassles, interchangeable lenses and a great big omni directional mic stuck on the top. At 2 grand it's in your price range.
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That great big omni directional mic still isn't going to do much better than the mic on a DSLR. You need to get the microphone away from the camera to get decent audio. I don't really see what "hassles" a DSLR has that you feel the VG10 doesn't. The only really desirable thing it has is a headphone jack, but without XLR inputs recording audio in camera isn't an option for quality results.
 
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SinEater said:
That great big omni directional mic still isn't going to do much better than the mic on a DSLR. You need to get the microphone away from the camera to get decent audio. I don't really see what "hassles" a DSLR has that you feel the VG10 doesn't. The only really desirable thing it has is a headphone jack, but without XLR inputs recording audio in camera isn't an option for quality results.
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The 'hassles' are:

1. Viewfinder. Certain DSLRs really needs a viewfinder to assist with focus whereas the VG10 comes with one.
2. 12 minutes continuous recording time on a DSLR vs 7 continuous hours on a VG10
3. Autofocus which is occasionally a 'nice to have' on the VG10 over and above e.g. the 5D.
4. Overheating on the 7D, 5D etc... whereas the VG10 doesn't overheat. I even tried it in 40+ degree heat and it works like a dream.
5. Gain vs ISO numbers. I don't have to remember the 'bad' ISO numbers, I just hit the gain button and remember to keep it below a certain level
6. The quality of DSLR mics isn't great whereas the Sony will be OK in a tight spot. It's also attached to the camera with a nice little dead cat so I don't have to fumble around pulling it out.
7. The headphone jack is nice vs the DSLRs
8. etc...

So it gives me everything I want for movie making and a few other things minus the hassles of the DSLRs. To compare, I am shooting with a Rebel next week for someone else and it'll be fine but a host of the little niggles will appear and I will miss the hassle-free VG10.

Naturally, the bad bit for some is the lack of 24p but this is not an issue for me as I can just put it into 24p in post (OK, OK 23.98).
 
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gorillaonabike said:
The 'hassles' are:

1. Viewfinder. Certain DSLRs really needs a viewfinder to assist with focus whereas the VG10 comes with one.
2. 12 minutes continuous recording time on a DSLR vs 7 continuous hours on a VG10
3. Autofocus which is occasionally a 'nice to have' on the VG10 over and above e.g. the 5D.
4. Overheating on the 7D, 5D etc... whereas the VG10 doesn't overheat. I even tried it in 40+ degree heat and it works like a dream.
5. Gain vs ISO numbers. I don't have to remember the 'bad' ISO numbers, I just hit the gain button and remember to keep it below a certain level
6. The quality of DSLR mics isn't great whereas the Sony will be OK in a tight spot. It's also attached to the camera with a nice little dead cat so I don't have to fumble around pulling it out.
7. The headphone jack is nice vs the DSLRs
8. etc...

So it gives me everything I want for movie making and a few other things minus the hassles of the DSLRs. To compare, I am shooting with a Rebel next week for someone else and it'll be fine but a host of the little niggles will appear and I will miss the hassle-free VG10.

Naturally, the bad bit for some is the lack of 24p but this is not an issue for me as I can just put it into 24p in post (OK, OK 23.98).
Click to expand...

1. The GH2 has a viewfinder that works in video mode as well as an LCD.
2. Non-Euro GH2s have no limit. The Euro version is capped at 30 minutes for tax reasons. (Can be disabled via hack)
3. The GH2 has considerably better AF than the Canons I've used. I'm really not convinced that it's slower than the VG10, though it is possible. This is a non-issue for narrative work anyway.
4. I've never heard of a GH2 overheating. I've shot with a 60D as well and never had it overheat even though the AC was out and it was 90+ degrees F.
5. Has there been any research into the Gain functions of the VG10? I'm not convinced it wouldn't have the same issues. Gain/ISO is exactly the same function, it's just named differently. That being said, I've never been disappointed with footage from my GH2, even when it's been on a "bad" ISO.

I'm not trying to call you out, I'm just sick of everyone going back to the 2008 Canon DSLR hassles. Many of these are no longer an issue on current cameras.

Also, converting to 24p can't be compared to shooting 24p IMO. It completely changes the motion blur.
 
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SinEater said:
1. The GH2 has a viewfinder that works in video mode as well as an LCD.
2. Non-Euro GH2s have no limit. The Euro version is capped at 30 minutes for tax reasons. (Can be disabled via hack)
3. The GH2 has considerably better AF than the Canons I've used. I'm really not convinced that it's slower than the VG10, though it is possible. This is a non-issue for narrative work anyway.
4. I've never heard of a GH2 overheating. I've shot with a 60D as well and never had it overheat even though the AC was out and it was 90+ degrees F.
5. Has there been any research into the Gain functions of the VG10? I'm not convinced it wouldn't have the same issues. Gain/ISO is exactly the same function, it's just named differently. That being said, I've never been disappointed with footage from my GH2, even when it's been on a "bad" ISO.

I'm not trying to call you out, I'm just sick of everyone going back to the 2008 Canon DSLR hassles. Many of these are no longer an issue on current cameras.

Also, converting to 24p can't be compared to shooting 24p IMO. It completely changes the motion blur.
Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong - I think the GH2 is a nice little camera and in the hands of an experienced DP, would be loads better than a broadcast quality piece of kit in between my clumsy fingers but the OP asked a question and I wanted to give an answer.

Specifically, the OP asked about cameras in the $1.5k - $2k USD range, not the sub $1,000 USD range which is why I discounted the GH2 and, if you notice, made no mention or allusion to it as I was writing about DSLRs. I am fully aware of the GH2 which is a very nice little sub $1,000 USD piece of kit but just not in the range the OP was writing about.

As for the little niggles with the GH2 - well, the XLR, sound, headphones, microphone attachment etc... points I raised are all still niggles with the GH2. A docu film make can pick up their VG10 with nice, omni microphone physically attached (usable in a tight spot if absolutely necessary) and shoot an interview in an impromptu situation right off the cuff without having to mess around with mics etc... or worry that they won't capture the sound.

Next week I will be shooting with a Rebel and I am sure it will be OK. However, my preference would be to shoot with my little VG10. Actually, my preference would be to have a DP shoot with the most expensive broadcast camera they could loot but that's another story.
 
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gorillaonabike said:
The 'hassles' are:

1. Viewfinder. Certain DSLRs really needs a viewfinder to assist with focus whereas the VG10 comes with one.
2. 12 minutes continuous recording time on a DSLR vs 7 continuous hours on a VG10
3. Autofocus which is occasionally a 'nice to have' on the VG10 over and above e.g. the 5D.
4. Overheating on the 7D, 5D etc... whereas the VG10 doesn't overheat. I even tried it in 40+ degree heat and it works like a dream.
5. Gain vs ISO numbers. I don't have to remember the 'bad' ISO numbers, I just hit the gain button and remember to keep it below a certain level
6. The quality of DSLR mics isn't great whereas the Sony will be OK in a tight spot. It's also attached to the camera with a nice little dead cat so I don't have to fumble around pulling it out.
7. The headphone jack is nice vs the DSLRs
8. etc...

So it gives me everything I want for movie making and a few other things minus the hassles of the DSLRs. To compare, I am shooting with a Rebel next week for someone else and it'll be fine but a host of the little niggles will appear and I will miss the hassle-free VG10.

Naturally, the bad bit for some is the lack of 24p but this is not an issue for me as I can just put it into 24p in post (OK, OK 23.98).
Click to expand...

I always thought autofocus was looked down upon?
 
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Mr.Rainbow said:
I always thought autofocus was looked down upon?
Click to expand...

It probably is but as I'm a noob I don't care and there are a couple of shots where only autofocus will work for me. One is a steadicam Merlin shot where there is no choice because I have no idea how to focus at the same time as moving with the merlin. Getting to learn how to use a Merlin has been tricky enough and pulling focus at the same time is unimaginable for me.

The other is a 'backup' in case I can't get the shot to work.

What I mean by this is we will have a camera operator, grip and someone stepping in as a focus puller all working together trying to get a particular shot. While I have planned out how this will work, it is entirely possible this will not work. So I have to be pragmatic and use the autofocus as a backup in case the focus puller cannot achieve the shot.

As an aside, we won't be using the VG10 for the second shot described - rather, we should be using a Z7 which should be a little easier although without a follow focus.

Bear in mind I'm a noob writing this so it could all end in tears...
 
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gorillaonabike said:
Don't get me wrong - I think the GH2 is a nice little camera and in the hands of an experienced DP, would be loads better than a broadcast quality piece of kit in between my clumsy fingers but the OP asked a question and I wanted to give an answer.

Specifically, the OP asked about cameras in the $1.5k - $2k USD range, not the sub $1,000 USD range which is why I discounted the GH2 and, if you notice, made no mention or allusion to it as I was writing about DSLRs. I am fully aware of the GH2 which is a very nice little sub $1,000 USD piece of kit but just not in the range the OP was writing about.

As for the little niggles with the GH2 - well, the XLR, sound, headphones, microphone attachment etc... points I raised are all still niggles with the GH2. A docu film make can pick up their VG10 with nice, omni microphone physically attached (usable in a tight spot if absolutely necessary) and shoot an interview in an impromptu situation right off the cuff without having to mess around with mics etc... or worry that they won't capture the sound.

Next week I will be shooting with a Rebel and I am sure it will be OK. However, my preference would be to shoot with my little VG10. Actually, my preference would be to have a DP shoot with the most expensive broadcast camera they could loot but that's another story.
Click to expand...

Sound is a big part but i'm looking probably at a DSLR. Which one would be my best pick? i changed the OP btw it'll be 1.5k-2k for everything sound included so like a whole setup is what i need.
 
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