Microphone for Reference Audio

I will be booming sound and occasionally using lavaliers for my next project. I have a clapper board for syncing, but I also use plural eyes. I need a low noise microphone that will allow me to get strong reference audio. None of the scenes will be going over 4 minutes of continuous shooting. They will be a mixture of interior and exterior locations.

The microphone will be mounted on the camera rig/cage above the camera and plugged either directly into the camera or into a fiio pre-amp then the camera body. I am really hoping to avoid latency issues, so please keep that in mind. I am seeking microphone and cable suggestions as well as your preferred options for that setup.

Options:

1- Microphone plugged into Camera
2- Microphone plugged into Pre-amp then camera.
3- External recorder (Zoom H1/Tascam DR-05) used as a line pass through.
4- Your ideas.

Camera: Gh2, G6
External Recorder: Tascam DR 40 (Upgrading Soon)
Plug: GH2 2.5mm (3.5mm Adapter) G6 3.5mm
 
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I will be booming sound and occasionally using lavaliers for my next project. I have a clapper board for syncing, but I also use plural eyes.

I assume, though not specified, that you have an external recorder as your primary sound recording device?

I need a low noise microphone that will allow me to get strong reference audio.

Simply for reference audio? Which camera are you using? The camera's built-in mic may be perfectly suitable for reference audio, which is simply there to help locate the sync clap and maybe hear the aural slate for comparison to second-system recordings. I understand that clarity of the signal is beneficial to PluralEyes. (Personally, I don't use automation for this... I manually link everything as the clapper board makes it a pretty speedy process.)

None of the scenes will be going over 4 minutes of continuous shooting.

No mic has a time limit.

They will be a mixture of interior and exterior locations.

Again... this is simply reference audio, right? So does it really matter how the mic behaves in multiple locations as long as you can match your video clips with their primary audio files?

The microphone will be mounted on the camera rig/cage above the camera and plugged either directly into the camera or into a fiio pre-amp then the camera body. I am really hoping to avoid latency issues, so please keep that in mind. I am seeking microphone and cable suggestions as well as your preferred options for that setup.

Options:

1- Microphone plugged into Camera
2- Microphone plugged into Pre-amp then camera.
3- External recorder (Zoom H1/Tascam DR-05) used as a line pass through.
4- Your ideas.

Again... which camera? Not knowing what kind of in-camera audio support is available, it's hard to figure out what can plug into it.

I'm going to take a wild guess, though, using clues from your post and the fact that you're considering an H1 to feed the camera, that you might be shooting with a DSLR? 1/8" mic input?

A mic mounted atop a camera is great for reference/scratch audio, and little else, but going through all sorts of external gear just to get a reference track is a waste of time and resources. As for latency issues, you shouldn't experience those unless you send the mic through some bizarre chain of gear with multiple conversions.

If you're shooting on a DSLR, then the pinhole mic is admittedly useless for most things (often including reference sound). Why not simplify things and slap a RĂ˜DE VideoMic or VideoMic Pro on top, plugged straight into the camera?
 
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I assume, though not specified, that you have an external recorder as your primary sound recording device?

Camera: Gh2, G6
External Recorder: Tascam DR 40 (Upgrading Soon)
Plug: GH2 2.5mm (3.5mm Adapter) G6 3.5mm

No mic has a time limit.

I have had sync issues with longer recordings. After a while the timing was a bit off.
Again... this is simply reference audio, right? So does it really matter how the mic behaves in multiple locations as long as you can match your video clips with their primary audio files?

I will be using one mic for both. Just making sure it was stated.


I'm going to take a wild guess, though, using clues from your post and the fact that you're considering an H1 to feed the camera, that you might be shooting with a DSLR? 1/8" mic input?

Yes. GH2 and G6.
A mic mounted atop a camera is great for reference/scratch audio, and little else, but going through all sorts of external gear just to get a reference track is a waste of time and resources. As for latency issues, you shouldn't experience those unless you send the mic through some bizarre chain of gear with multiple conversions.


Been there actually. Original setup was a long xlr to the tascam to the camera. I clappered synced, which I do regardless of pluraleyes. PE just takes a lot of the setup time out of it.
 
I have had sync issues with longer recordings. After a while the timing was a bit off.

That has nothing to do with the mic, and everything to do with the recorder and the camera.

The only way to insure perfect sync between separate camera and sound recorder is to use a camera and a recorder that are both equipped with SMPTE sync, either using one as a master clock and slaving the other to it or slaving both to an external master clock.

When you use a DSLR and a non-sync recorder, you're working with two devices that have independent, internal clocks. Further, lower-budget devices don't use the same high-quality, stable timing crystals that professional, SMPTE sync devices use. This means that, though theoretically recording 48k audio, one device may actually be recording slightly above (e.g. 48,0007Hz) and the other slightly below (e.g. 47,9993). Put the two together in an NLE that plays back at a solid 48kHz and they will drift apart over time.
 
AcousticAl has already covered quite a bit of it, but let's see if I've got this correct...

You'll be using a shotgun or hypercardioid mic on a boom-pole with an external audio recorder (DR-40 or Zoom H1/Tascam DR-05).

You want a "low noise" mic to mount on top of the camera to record a reference track for sync.

Unless you get a REALLY cheap mic most mics these days a pretty quiet. The noise issues in the audio system are usually associated with crappy mic pres or poor gain-staging. Other noise issues are due to poor mic placement. The camera mic or a mic mounted on the camera this counts as poor mic placement; it is going to pick up A LOT of the ambient sound. "Ya canna defy the laws of physics, Captain."

As a "budget" camera-mounted mic on a DSLR rig a lot of people use the Rode VideoMic. It's not too expensive ($150) and sounds okay. If you don't want to spend that kind of money you can try the Audio-Technica ATR-6550 shotgun ($60?). There are lots of cheap consumer mics out there, but they may be noisy. Plus, if you are plugging the mic into the audio input of the camera, you will be subject to the noise issues associated with the crappy camera preamp.


As AcousticAl pointed out, unless you are using a central sync reference you will get drift.
 
That has nothing to do with the mic, and everything to do with the recorder and the camera.

The only way to insure perfect sync between separate camera and sound recorder is to use a camera and a recorder that are both equipped with SMPTE sync, either using one as a master clock and slaving the other to it or slaving both to an external master clock.

When you use a DSLR and a non-sync recorder, you're working with two devices that have independent, internal clocks. Further, lower-budget devices don't use the same high-quality, stable timing crystals that professional, SMPTE sync devices use. This means that, though theoretically recording 48k audio, one device may actually be recording slightly above (e.g. 48,0007Hz) and the other slightly below (e.g. 47,9993). Put the two together in an NLE that plays back at a solid 48kHz and they will drift apart over time.

Understood. That is what I meant by the record times. Probably wasn't essential info for my problem. I just wanted to give as much info as possible. Also did some research. Seems the DR40 has a bit of an issue with losing sync over time.
 
AcousticAl has already covered quite a bit of it, but let's see if I've got this correct...

You'll be using a shotgun or hypercardioid mic on a boom-pole with an external audio recorder (DR-40 or Zoom H1/Tascam DR-05).

You want a "low noise" mic to mount on top of the camera to record a reference track for sync.

Unless you get a REALLY cheap mic most mics these days a pretty quiet. The noise issues in the audio system are usually associated with crappy mic pres or poor gain-staging. Other noise issues are due to poor mic placement. The camera mic or a mic mounted on the camera this counts as poor mic placement; it is going to pick up A LOT of the ambient sound. "Ya canna defy the laws of physics, Captain."

As a "budget" camera-mounted mic on a DSLR rig a lot of people use the Rode VideoMic. It's not too expensive ($150) and sounds okay. If you don't want to spend that kind of money you can try the Audio-Technica ATR-6550 shotgun ($60?). There are lots of cheap consumer mics out there, but they may be noisy. Plus, if you are plugging the mic into the audio input of the camera, you will be subject to the noise issues associated with the crappy camera preamp.


As AcousticAl pointed out, unless you are using a central sync reference you will get drift.

Will stray from super cheap this time. I bought a Chinese shotgun mic last week. Good sound for the price, but it fell apart after once use.
 
Seems the DR40 has a bit of an issue with losing sync over time.

Most any cheap recorder will. Some are worse than others, but go back to my previous post about timing crystals. It's just the nature of the beast.

Full disclosure: I have a DR-40 (two of them actually... one personal, one at the office) and I love it. It's a very handy tool and serves me well. It's not my primary recorder, but is an extra tool in the kit. The trick is to become familiar with the strengths and weaknesses of the recorder, and work to utilize its strengths while not pushing it toward its weaknesses. Of course, that goes for just about any piece of gear. Once you know exactly where a device like the DR-40 shines, you can get some great stuff out of it.
 
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