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How much set up before it should pick up?

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harmonica44

It's an action thriller and it opens with an action scene that introduces the plot and characters. After that though though there is about eight scenes up set up, that is required before the suspense picks up again. I need to get certain characters into certain places, before the race against time/solve the mystery section can start. But is eight scenes of set up too much before the reader looses interest, perhaps?
 
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It depends on a variety of factors. Is this a feature or a short film? If it's a short film then you'll have way less time to get everything in place. However, it really does depend on how long those scenes are and what they include. A scene could be 10 seconds or it could be 10 minutes. So...8 scenes at 10 minutes each would be way too long ;) but 8 scenes at 2 minutes each may not be. Too many factors to be certain. If it's done right, a movie can go awhile to set up things for the ultimate action but that's just my opinion.
 
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Feature. And the scenes can be about 3-5 minutes each, a couple of them maybe more, when I write the rest of them. If you add that with the opening action scene, which is long itself, the whole set up could be about 20% of the script before the set up is over. More set up does equal more pay though, but will the reader still loose interest at the first 20% being set up?
 
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Subdividing the Plot

If I'm tracking one character through eight scenes, yes, there is a danger of losing the audience. Particularly if there is little action. If I'm tracking two or three parallel subplots, no it's not a problem. Because each subplot is only three or four scenes long. Now the writer must orchestrate and interweave the subplots so that at the turning point (mid-movie) it all comes to a head and the threads converge.

Okay, structural talk (read at your own risk :P)
The first act is normally about 25% of the story. Act Two is the meat--the commitment to act, the turning point, and the defeat. It is about 50% of the script. The turning point is roughly at the half way point of the movie. So your estimate 25%+20%=45% is pretty dead on to where the set up should lead.

So having the Hero, the Hero's Agent, Independent Agent, and the Villain each carrying certain scenes that converge keeps the audience engaged. It is like watching a heist movie or mission impossible where the 3 or 4 operatives each are engaged in related but individual actions that finally all come together with purpose. The "mission" is the carrot but the excitement is what leads up to it. And of course as a turning point, things don't go as planned and the obstacles appear that create the final crisis which launches Act Three. It is important to inject some action into those subplots to keep the energy flowing.

In a heist scenario, we are following Clive who has to fix the video feed to show an empty corridor. He sneaks in, is prepared to do the install when a night guard comes wandering through. Clive has to hide while the security guard does his check. Clive starts again, but the guard forgot his coffee and starts back. Clive must hurry or do something to stop the guard. Tension because the rest of the heist team is depending on the camera to be disabled. FLASH to ... CASINO TABLE with Ralph ... etc.
Finally they all meet up and boom, everything goes off as expected ... almost. The hurried exit ...
 
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Well the first 20% is about 4 characters, not in subplots, but are in the same plot, but there are multiple things going on that they have to figure out. They are figuring out why the villains are doing what they are doing and how to deal with it. This gives the audience a lot to think about since the villains motives are very complex, and it raises a lot of debatable issues, which is what a lot of the story is about. Then after that 20% is established and they have decided what to do, then the racing to solve the mystery gets started more so. There is a lot of action in the first scene, but none after till after 20% at least. Just setting up the issues and the characters study and debate them.

The villains aside from the opening action scene, are not seen again till halfway through or a little over maybe. Haven't gotten that far yet. But the reason why they are saved for later, is so some twists and turns can happen from the hero's point of view. Then after those are over, the villains come, and are given depth and we get to know them, and their unique motives. Will the viewers also think that the villains are not given enough depth, since they have complex issues? The viewers will have to trust that they will be later on, since they are not seen again after the first action scene, till halfway through.

I don't go by the three act structure. I just come up with the story and pack enough twists and turns in and be sure to have a long building climax, instead of a quick one. So does it still sound like the viewers could likely be drawn out? I was hoping the issue dealing would draw them in.
 
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harmonica44 said:
It's an action thriller and it opens with an action scene that introduces the plot and characters. After that though though there is about eight scenes up set up, that is required before the suspense picks up again. I need to get certain characters into certain places, before the race against time/solve the mystery section can start. But is eight scenes of set up too much before the reader looses interest, perhaps?
Click to expand...

Speaking as a viewer, I am often bored by setup because the typical setup is so often presented in the same way.

The writer Tillie Olsen may have been the first to initiate the idea of "in media res." This means you start in the middle of the action and let the reader piece together the elements of the situation.
 
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Well sometimes more set up, equals more pay off. Even though there are eight dialogue set up scenes, my opening scene before those eight, has an action sequence, which I plan on being probably about five minutes long, if that helps. What is the same way the set up, is often done like you said?
 
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It's hard to say without seeing some script. When you finish a rough draft, post it, and we can give you more specific feedback. It has to be compelling enough to motivate the audience to sit through the next eight set up scenes. Remember a basic 'rule', some action ought to happen every 10-12 minutes. This is particularly true for action-oriented genres.
 
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Well there are two types of action movies. One where there is a lot of action, and ones where there is enough to be called an action movie, but they have longer spaces of time in between. Like The Dark Knight, and Die Hard for example, had a 20 minute gap in the first acts, where there was no action and just set up. In Taken, the action doesn't start till about a third of the way in. My script only has 4 action scenes, but two of them are quite long, counting the climax. Is that good? It's mainly for micro-budget reasons. My last script has 8 action sequences, but that one will probably be out of my budget range, and the story isn't as original, so I would like to shoot the more original script first.
 
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"Action" doesn't require fights or blowing things up. "Action" is about doing opposed to "talking" about doing. But importantly Action is cumulative.

Setup Action Scenes:
Tom buys some supplies from the hardware store.
Adam is organizing a protest rally.
Tom is now following plans on building a bomb.
Adam is meeting with a "Save the Zombies" group.
Tom is planting his bomb under the stadium seating.
Culmination:
The big Zombie Days parade
Tom places a bomb threat to the mayor's office
Adam's girlfriend is now sitting in the stadium seats.
etc.

each action event leads into the next. No big booms but we see clearly how Adam and Tom approach the issue of Zombie Day. And with Adam's girlfriend in the stadium, we reach that crisis point.
 
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Oh I see. Well after the opening action scenes, the following eight scenes are all dialogue, but there is suspense in the dialogue, as their is chaos and mystery going on, if that helps. I know, it's hard to tell, without seeing it.
 
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