How do you shoot your scenes? And how do the "big" films do it?

M

MelonDome

When ever im shooting a scene, say there is a discussion between 2 people, I will record in 1 angle, stop recording, tell the actors to stop in the middle of their conversation, move somewhere else, and record the rest of the conversation. That way it looks like its being shot in different angles.

When ever I watch special features on the making of movies, no country for old men, or the notebook, which I saw today, they seem to be using only 1 camera. Im assuming they shoot an entire scene with the camera set down, stop, then move the camera somewhere else, and reshoot the same scene over and over until they have the different camera angles that they need, and just edit them all together.

I was thinking about doing this. Im just afraid that when you do the scene over and over, the actors may not talk at the same pace they did in the preivous take, and I wont be able to correctly synch the conversation in editing.

So what do you guys do? Cameras are expensive as it is, and im sure not everyone can afford to rent/buy several.

and just outa of curiosity... If motion pictures get so much money, why do they only rent 1 camera? im referring to the notebook and no country, cause from the special features I only saw 1 camera. There could be multiple...
 
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It's hard enough working on a set with one camera. If you have multiple cameras shooting at the same time, you end up getting camera A in camera B's frame and vice-versa. Just watch a TV show that is live and see how often you see other cameras in the shot.

You won't have any problem editing your conversations if you cut during silence. You're on the right track. Block out your shots, shoot with one camera, and reshoot the same scene as many times as you need to. If you need to, you can use the audio from one take and just sync the clips to the uncut audio track. It's generally not that hard, and it's really easy when you can't see the lips!
 
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I wouldn't worry too much about actors not delivering their lines the same each time. It's really a non issue, because when you're editing you don't necessarily want to use the audio that was tied to that particular shot the whole time.

Just like with the video, the audio should be cut to best fit the scene as well. If you're seeing the back of a characters head you don't have to worry if their voice matches what they actually said in that shot because you can't see their lips. I have often times used completely different reverse angles that were entirely unrelated to the audio because I happened to have a good reaction shot that worked for the line being delivered by the character facing away from the camera, etc..


Generally speaking, if you have the time and such.. the typical order of shots is to get your "master" which could be a wide angle or just a two shot, depending on the scene.. then continue with your closer shots. For dialogue that would generally be the shot/reverse shot (over the shoulder) type shots. The more options you have the better off you'll be for editing.


Inserts (hands grabbing keys, feet shifting nervously, etc) are really important because it's always good to have something you can cut away to. They will save your butt in the edit if you don't have an acceptable reverse shot to cut to before finishing a lengthy bit of dialogue with a different take, they help compress time -- so we don't have to watch Ralph get out of his chair, shuffle across the room, open the door, take his package from the delivery guy, shuffle back to his chair, etc...
 
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You seem to have it right, MelonDome. In addition to multiple
cameras getting in the way, using more than one camera for a
dialogue scenes greatly restricts the lighting. If you have, for
example, two people sitting at a table with a camera on both
sides, there are limited places to put lights and the shadows of
the equipment and crew becomes an issue. And you can’t do much
camera movement because the other camera can be in the sightline.

But there is no need to stop in the middle of the conversation.
You can shoot the entire scene from each angle.

Scene 22 is Bob and Mary sitting at a table - it’s three pages
long. As Will said, you will set up the “Master Shot” - both
people at the table, camera getting a head to foot shot of both
of them. On your slate you will write “Scene 22 - Take 1”

Scene 22 - This will be the entire scene from one angle. You do as
many takes as you feel you need. Again, shooting all three pages
of dialogue.

Then you will move the camera to get Bob’s side of the table.
Adjust the lights and set up the dolly track. Again, you will
shoot all three pages of the dialogue, then you will “punch in”
to get inserts and other coverage you might need. These set-up
requite only minor adjusting of the lights as you get closer.

Scene 22A - A slow dolly push in on Bob - from a full shot into a
close up.
Scene 22B - Close up of Bob.
Scene 22C - Over Mary’s shoulder on Bob.
Scene 22D - an insert shot of Bob lighting a cigarette.
Scene 22E - a close up on Bob’s hand putting the cigarette in the
ash tray.
Scene 22F - a close up of Bob taking the contract, looking at it
and signing it (from Mary’s point of view)

Now you do the same thing - this time from the other side of the
table. This is a major lighting and equipment change - moving the
dolly and track, all the lights and the crew.

Scene 22G - A slow dolly push in on Mary - from a full shot into a
close up.
Scene 22H - Over Bob’s shoulder on Mary.
Scene 22J - Close up of Mary.
Scene 22K - an insert shot of Mary putting the contract on the
table.
Scene 22L - a close up on Mary’s hand snuffing out the cigarette
in the ash tray.
Scene 22M - a close up shot of Mary putting the contract on the
table, putting a pen on the contract and pushing it to the middle
of the table.
Scene 22P - a close up of Bob taking the contract, looking at it
and signing it (from Bob’s point of view)

Another major lighting change. You want to do a dramatic, overhead
shot of part of the scene. You know you won’t be using much of
this in the final scene so no need to shoot the entire three
pages.

Scene 22 R - start when Mary puts the contract on the table.
Scene 22 S - zoom in to get only the contract - follow all the
business with the contract.
Scene 22 T - while the camera is up there might as well get a shot
of the two actors sitting down at the table and then leaving the
table. Who knows? You might want to use it.

You continue this until you get all the coverage you need. You
might want to do a slow dolly around the entire table (no way to
have two cameras on that shot) in close up and medium shot. You
might want to cover some part of the scene using handheld and you
might find a few inserts you might use as you go.
 
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Above this post is some terrific insight in shooting a conversation.

All I can bring to the table is a suggestion to see it in action in a movie.

Get a copy of "The Sunshine Boys", directed by Herbert Ross in 1975. It's almost nothing but conversation shots filmed from a variety of angles and in dark or oddly lit settings or on New York streets.

Actually the lighting in the movie is something that got me, Ross (and the DOP) was forever pointing the camera at bright windows in a bunch of scenes.
Since the story runs so heavily on dialogue, the washing out of the scenes by the sunlight actually adds a lot of realism to the film.

One other thing, in a lot of the conversation shots you'll notice a lot of mismatched continuity. Hands in the wrong places, characters sitting a bit off from the other shot, etc.

It doesn't take anything away from the picture, it's still an entertaining watch.

Neil
 
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When you shoot master, single, single (3 angles to cut together for a typical conversation in an indie film), you can have the actors go through their singles at a couple of different paces to not only match the master, but to be able to adjust the narrative pace in the edit bay. What looks good on the set may not end up working when put with the rest of the footage.

When you do edit, you'll use the audio from the singles (generally - as they're miked better), and you'll use the audio from each actor's single respectively. You control the pace in the edit this way. You can make your actors step on each others lines in the edit bay even though they separated their dialog nicely for you on set.

Don't discount the power of the edit in controlling your storytelling. It starts in the edit, continues on the set...then the slate is wiped clean and you rewrite the whole thing to work with the footage you have. If the script is incredibly well written, then this is an easy task. Otherwise (like my feature) it takes years ;)
 
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awesome guys! thank you so much. I used to torture myself and actors by telling them to stop in the middle of their conversation so I can get a different angle.

But now that I know how you guys and films shoot with just 1 camera, that is awesome! cant wait for my next project!
 
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Based on the advice given above - using multiple cameras. Is it possible to have multiple brands of cameras and yet be able to pull the footage togather as you edit?
In other words - what needs to be constant besides eg. the frame rate recorded, for it to work? (keep in mind - I am a Newbie - )
 
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The advice was how to shoot with 1 camera. Most films shoot with one camera. They shoot one whole scene in 1 angle, then reshoot the same scene over and over with the camera placed in different areas to get different camera angles.

But if you do want to use multiple cameras; what I read alot about meshing the cameras to look alike is in post-production with color correcting. Thats all I know for that, I hope someone else can help you. good luck, and welcome :)
 
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Great advice given by all to the original question. If you cover the scene well with 1 camera , you should have bits and pieces from different angles that will make the scene work well together and make it look as though it was all the same performance from the actors, etc.

To touch on chiefkojo's question, about what things would need to be constant to put two or more cameras together if you were using different brands, does not have a simple black and white answer. If you are doing something like I did in We'll Inspect Your House, www.youtube.com/swanpond14, where one of the cameras covering the scene is actually supposed to be seen in the film as a prop, then it doesn't matter, because you are trying to draw attention to the fact that the character is recording something.

But, if you want an extra camera that isn't meant to be seen in the movie that also covering the narrative action from a different angle there are a few things you want to consider in my opinion.

If you are using two different brands you:

1. Shoot in the same aspect ratio - (if one is shooting 16:9 widescreen, then don't have the other one shooting 4:3 full screen).

2. Shoot in the same frame rate - (if you are shooting 24p on one, don't shoot 30p on the other.)

3. White balance the same way in both cameras, that way when you do color correction in post and you need to brighten and enhance a certain color or change the scheme up all together, you will be doing essentially the same thing for both cameras.

4. This one seems obvious, but, you should shoot the same quality from one camera as you do in the other. In other words, don't shoot standard DV in one and then have the other shooting in HDV.

There may be other things that you should do as well depending on what presets and other factors the particular cameras you are working with might happen to offer. Again, follow these rules only if you are trying to cover the action as if the camera doesn't exist. Because in We'll Inspect Your House, I basically broke all of these rules on purpose, because I wanted it to be clear to the audience that the black and white cam shooting on 60i was a prop cam being used by the characters.

Hope this helps, chiefkojo.
 
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