Beginner camera/computer/ect question

I

IhateMyjob

Hey everyone, I wasn't sure if this would be better suited to the Camera section, or the Computer question.. So I'm posting here..

Actually it is a combination of questions...

First off, and it seems simple, is standard definition too old school to be "beginning with" is it a necessity to go straight to HD?

But wait, there is another question to go with that.

And it goes with editing HD video, from what I have read it takes a massive PC/MAC to edit HD video... My laptop is, we'll say, less than massive.

Windows 7 SP1, Intel Pentium 2.00GHz 4gb ram and I believe 275gb hard drive. I'm not asking if this is big enough to edit HD, because from what I've read it is definitely not... but if I started out with SD, would this computer be sufficient to edit?

Lastly, (before I read about the computer needed to edit HD video) I was researching camcorders in the Canon Vixia series, and looking at the Panasonic HC-X900m.. I was planning to buy something in the $500-$1000 range. Which from what I saw will buy a pretty nice HD consumer level camcorder...

However, if I were to start with SD, It looks like I could pick up a pretty solid 3 chip pro level MiniDV camcorder from X number of years ago...





So, to summarize....

Should I stick with SD and get a good used 3 chip, or save up and buy a good computer, followed by an HD camera... It may be worth mentioning that our "group" already has a member who shoots with a DSLR, so we have that access as well..




Sorry this is so scatter brained, but thanks for any advice.
Marshall
 
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TheArtist said:
Also, with a hacked GH2, the files you're gonna get will be even harder for your computer to deal with, unless you're planning on converting everything (I'm not sure about how that would work, I have a T2i).

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So they are going to be harder for the computer than say a Nikon D3200/D5200 ect (which are the one's I really liked when I was looking at them). I'm guessing the hacked GH2 will run that... (I'm going to slaughter this) .264/something compression that I have read about?
 
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TheArtist said:
Finally, save as much as you can and get yourself a good computer. Having something that works slowly is a pain in the ass if you want to experiment a lot of things and get better at post-production (which is a HUGE part in low budget filmmaking).
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I know I've quoted parts of this post twice now, but I have been shopping around on bhphoto, craigslist, ebay ect... and I have figured that my budget will not allow me to purchase a camera, and a computer right now... So my options are,

Buy a Camera (GH2, Nikon, Canon... still haven't made up my mind) and start getting comfortable with it while I save for a more powerful computer.

Or (You can probably guess this option) Buy a more powerful computer and a software program, and get familiar with it, while I save up for a camera...


I really have no idea which is the better option.
 
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Nothing wrong with SD for a beginner, considering the fact that it's gonna take a lot of practice to get good. However, considering how cheap DSLR and EVIL (GH2) cameras are, if you've got the money, that's probably the best bet.

And yeah, don't forget to set aside a good chunk of your budget for audio.

As far as lenses are concerned, personally, I think a good beginner lens is the stock 18-55mm that comes with the T2i. The versatility is nice, but more importantly, I couldn't live without a wide angle. I use the 18mm side ALL the time. So, if you were limited to one lens, I'd go with that one. But if you can afford a second lens, I think the 50mm 1.8 is a great choice. With my stock lens, there are plenty of times when I wish my f-stop could go lower.

One small thing, unless you're a photojournalist, it matters very little how the camera feels in your hand.

And yeah, your computer will edit HD footage, but you might expect to deal with lag. If you transcode all of your footage using Cineform Neoscene (which is FREE), you might not deal with any lag at all. Keeping all of your footage on an inexpensive external HD will go a long way towards improving your computer's performance.
 
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Cracker Funk said:
And yeah, don't forget to set aside a good chunk of your budget for audio.

And yeah, your computer will edit HD footage, but you might expect to deal with lag. If you transcode all of your footage using Cineform Neoscene (which is FREE), you might not deal with any lag at all. Keeping all of your footage on an inexpensive external HD will go a long way towards improving your computer's performance.
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Thanks for the advise, the only audio I will be buying to start out will probably be an XLR shotgun mic and boom pole.
 
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IhateMyjob said:
This is probably getting annoying, but I have 2 more GH2 questions.

First, on bhphotovideo the gh2 is listed under mirrorless system cameras, as apposed to DSLRs... is this significant at all?

Second, and I noticed it shows that it shoots 1920x1080 60i, which if I understand correctly is 60fps interlaced, which is less desirable than shooting progressive.. if that assumption is correct, does the hack change this to shoot 60p?

Sorry if these are dumb questions... but when I try to do a search for "gh2" it comes back as too short to search
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I can comment on this. I have the GH2 and it can run 1080p at 24fps right out of the box. The many hacks out there have different purposes and each merits a try. If you go the GH2 route, be aware that adapting newer electronic lenses will not allow you to use the electronics. I believe only Four Thirds lenses can be adapted to use the electronics. Aside from this, only native lenses can use autofocus, body controlled aperture, etc. In effect, all those expensive canon and nikon lenses with their expensive electronics become manual lenses. While you may like shooting fully manual as a video shooter(I know I do), you're paying a lot for the electronics inside the lens. Effectively, you're handicapping what makes these lenses so great. If you have anymore GH2 questions, please feel free to PM me!
 
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TheArtist said:
Also, with a hacked GH2, the files you're gonna get will be even harder for your computer to deal with, unless you're planning on converting everything (I'm not sure about how that would work, I have a T2i).
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AVCHD files are perfectly fine to work with, and many camera systems use it - including the FS100 and FS700. You should realistically be converting your DSLR footage before you work with it anyway.

Also, you'll need to consider some kind of rig (unless you already own some). Tripods tend to get boring and cumbersome but they are a must have. Shoulder rigs would be a nice for a handheld feel.
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Rigs can be nice, but are completely unnecessary, especially for a beginner just buying a camera. You can get really nice shots out of just a tripod and can tell a great story using only a tripod.

I believe only Four Thirds lenses can be adapted to use the electronics.
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I believe there are adapters that also adapt the electronics, but they're quite expensive. Most video shooters would want to be shooting manual anyway (although controlling aperture may become cumbersome, depending on the lens you put on).
 
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Hey guys! Thanks again for all the info!

I have however moved away from the GH2 idea, I'm leaning towards going Canon, simply because the other member of our little "filmmaking group" that shoots on DSLR uses a Canon (T2i) and this way we could share lenses without the need for adapters and such...

The Canon I'm seriously considering is the 60d, I read a review that put it's video quality nearly on-par with the 7D.

However, any site I read about DSLR filmmaking, I see a quote like this... "A $750-$1000 DSLR will shoot footage that looks better than a $XXXXX dedicated camcorder" So my question is, how much do you have to spend before a camcorder becomes "superior"?

When this thread started I was leaning towards going the camcorder route, and these are a couple that were on my list, I'm curious how they would stack up against a 60d?

Although they are much more expensive than the 60d

$2698
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/890797-REG/Sony_NEX_VG30_Camcorder_with_18_200mm.html

$3395
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/733535-REG/Canon_4885B001_XF105_HD_Professional_Camcorder.html

$3599
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/887069-REG/Sony_nex_ea50h_Sony_NEX_EA50_Camcorder_with.html

$4135
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...af100apj_ag_af100a_digital_cinema_camera.html




Now, I'm not saying I'm expecting a $1000 DSLR to shoot on par with these cameras, but these were the top contenders on my list when I started researching... And I'm curious just where the 60d stands in comparison, because the price is much much more appealing.


Thanks again, and I'm sorry for "Going backwards" so to speak, I'm just gunning for as much information as I can get.
 
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Well, disregard pretty much everything from that last posting.... I went to Best Buy yesterday and came back with a camera, memory card, DSLR bag, tripod, and software......

It was like a highly researched impulse buy... if that makes any sense. lol
 
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Lucky Hardwood said:
Practice, practice, practice, and have fun.
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I'm doing both!!!

I've been watching "film look" tutorials, and they all talk about shooting "flat" and color correcting in post.... so I'm working on that, not sure what to set my contrast, saturation, ect. at to get the proper "flat" image, but I'm playing with different settings.

The color correction is tricky, I mean obviously since I just started... but those are my 2 main focusing right now.


Also, for T4i/any Canon user, when you're filming, what file size to you store as?



Thanks,
Marshall
 
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IhateMyjob said:
I'm doing both!!!

I've been watching "film look" tutorials, and they all talk about shooting "flat" and color correcting in post.... so I'm working on that, not sure what to set my contrast, saturation, ect. at to get the proper "flat" image, but I'm playing with different settings.

The color correction is tricky, I mean obviously since I just started... but those are my 2 main focusing right now.


Also, for T4i/any Canon user, when you're filming, what file size to you store as?



Thanks,
Marshall
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Start with a Neutral picture style. Turn the Contrast all the way down, Sharpening all the way down, and Saturation down two notches. That gives you a nice flat image. For grading, I recommend using Magic Bullet Colorista Free (which is free). Most people will tell you to crush the blacks and raise the whites to create contrast, but this wrong. Instead, raise the blacks, crush the mids and raise the whites as needed. This will give you a detailed, yet nicely contrasted image. See my tutorial here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxwnYAUikms
 
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Hi Ihatemyjob,

Congratulations for your purchase and I hope it should deliver to your expectation.

I am on the same boat and would request you to please share your exp so far as I am inclined to buy the same t4i or canon xa-10 which is purely a prosumer camera.
I am not very sure how good could be a DSLR in terms of handling and focus issues?

Regards
 
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IhateMyjob said:
I watched some video footage from the hacked GH2, and it looks excellent, but I am curious.. on a couple aspects

First, how complicated is the "hacking" process of a GH2.

Second, What is the "lens mount" used on it? I was looking for a prime lens on BHphotovideo and wasn't sure which to select.

Lastly (for now), Will the hack compromise it's ability to shoot still photos? Because I would still like the ability to take DSLR quality stills


Again, thanks everyone for your help
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Hacking is extremely easy. There is a youtube tutorial that explains and shows it, this makes it very easy to follow. Most of the hacks are available through personal-view.com


The great thing about the micro 4/3 camera (and that it is mirrorless), is that it can use almost any other type of lens mount with an adapter. Meaning that you could shoot with Nikon or Canon lenses if you by a an adapter. Though you will not have any autofocus (I recommend learning to shoot without it anyway).

I just hacked the GH2, wasn't overly impressed with the first hack that I tried (though that may have been my fault) but I really like the second one, and can't wait to start my production with it.

As for your questions, Go HD. I would recommend a better CPU but you might be able to edit with that one if you don't get too crazy.

I use Premeire Pro, and After Effects (Adobe), and with my 8 gig, Quad Core CPU it was a little taxing at times.

However, I now edit on my new 32 gig, 8 core CPU, and it is much smoother. In fact it handles it pretty easy except that the GH2 hack I am using makes the files huge. After color grading a 2 and 1/2 minute clip, the size ended up being 26 gigs and it was using about 22 gigs of RAM to render it.

So if you got a GH2 and hacked it, you would not want to use the high end hacks with your system.
 
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