advice for new documentary filmmaker

R

rschwartz33

I am planning on doing sort of a cross country tour by myself, centered on the recent protest movement. I'm looking for a light, mobile set up that will allow me to record picture and sound as easily and economically as possible.

Here's what I am planning on getting.

Panasonic GH2 w/stock lens- $1000
Audio-Technica AT8022 microphone- $400
cheap shoulder rig http://www.amazon.com/CowboyStudio-Shoulder-Support-Camcorder-Camera/dp/B0036NMQ7S ?
tripod
plenty of memory cards


am I missing anything (extra lens, viewfinder) or are there alternatives i should consider? I like the look of dslr and the gh2 apparently minimizes a lot of problems like moire and rolling shutter. I tend to be pretty economical, so I'm trying to buy only stuff that I REALLY need.

any other tips for a long term project like this, logistical or otherwise? Are there any non obvious problemsI might run into, being that the trip will be so long? For anyone who has done this kind of stuff, how much do you usually shoot for a minute of actual footage?


Thanks
 
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If you are referring to the AKG-414 as an interview mic it would be rather heavy and clunky, not to mention rather delicate, for field work.

97871778-260x260-0-0_AKG+AKG+C414+XLS+Studio+Condenser+Microphone.jpg


I own one - the classic BUL/S version - and it's great mic, but not one that I would use outdoors; much too sensitive to wind noise, moisture and high temperatures and it has a fairly wide pick-up pattern.

Shotgun mics are very directional, so unless the camera is always aimed for full-face shots it will not pick up a person speaking very well. You may be better of with something like the Audio-Technica AT4053b; still nowhere near optimum, but a better choice than a shotgun and a bit better suited for interviews.

AT4053B_220_220_1.png


Don't forget some serious wind protection, no matter what mic you get.

I recommend a separate audio recorder as DSLRs are still cameras "forced" into being video cameras; you have no way of monitoring the audio with a DSLR. If you go to a camera with decent audio implementation as Ray recommends it would negate the need for a separate audio recorder. Make sure that it records, at the minimum, 16bit/48kHz, which is standard DVD audio; 24 bit will give a bit more headroom.
 
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alcove, just to be clear, even if i'm recording to a separate device, the sound will be substandard as long as it is mounted on my dslr? Since I'm by myself, a camera mounted mic seems like its my only option when im in the field.
 
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CamVader used to do field news reporting camerawork which I'm guessing is about the closest comparable to what you're wanting to do with this project; interview these "occupy" protesters in the street (and elsewhere, even).

He likely has a very good idea of what broadcast quality products "the talent" (the reporter) jammed in the people's faces for their field reports.

Cam, you out there?
Need some 411 over here! ;)
 
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rayw said:
CamVader used to do field news reporting camerawork which I'm guessing is about the closest comparable to what you're wanting to do with this project; interview these "occupy" protesters in the street (and elsewhere, even).

He likely has a very good idea of what broadcast quality products "the talent" (the reporter) jammed in the people's faces for their field reports.

Cam, you out there?
Need some 411 over here! ;)
Click to expand...

You need a handheld mic within a foot of the subjects mouth - events like this can be loud. A camera mounted mic would be too "In your face" and violate personal space to get good candid responses. Never mind being able to focus that close.

I would not use a DSLR for this type of assignment if given a choice. A camera with XLR inputs and a headphone jack is the only way possible to one man band this. A dslr would require 2 people to shoot, get sound and ask questions. It will be a challenge by yourself with an ENG camera, but at least you have a fighting chance with limited experience.

That's my 2 cents. :cool:
 
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Thank you, CamVader!!!

Yeah, I'm thinking (just in case I ever wanna try a project similar to this, of course ;) ) trying to do this solo is just not really gonna work.

You really do need even just a mute monkey off camera with a mic on pole to make any such product worth watching.

Schwartz might also consider including a wide angle lens around the 70-something range if he insists on going solo.
He's going to have to stick the video camera (Sorry, DSLR doesn't look like the way to go on this) 12 to 18 inches from the subject's face which is gonna make a straight lens shot a HD pimple-fest.

Hopefully he's got a buddy to hold the mic on a pole off camera so that he can back off six feet, well out of mic range, and somewhat zoom in.
 
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rayw said:
Thank you, CamVader!!!

Yeah, I'm thinking (just in case I ever wanna try a project similar to this, of course ;) ) trying to do this solo is just not really gonna work.

You really do need even just a mute monkey off camera with a mic on pole to make any such product worth watching.

Schwartz might also consider including a wide angle lens around the 70-something range if he insists on going solo.
He's going to have to stick the video camera (Sorry, DSLR doesn't look like the way to go on this) 12 to 18 inches from the subject's face which is gonna make a straight lens shot a HD pimple-fest.

Hopefully he's got a buddy to hold the mic on a pole off camera so that he can back off six feet, well out of mic range, and somewhat zoom in.
Click to expand...
A boom isn't the way to go either for this type of event. Just an extended arm and a handheld mic in frame. It's run and gun. One reason is liability, even with a handheld mic, the extra cable is coiled so it never hits the ground. A boom is a trip hazard, unless you have somebody on cable duty. The second reason is making a scene. You're going to attract every wacko that WANTS to be on camera, and that's not an accurate depiction of what's going on, but a good study on mental illness. There will be at least one network there using that approach. :lol:
 
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thanks for the responses everyone.... I'm pretty committed to the dslr at this point, but how about this:

For field interviews I give the subjects a handheld or clip on mic which i record into a zoom h4n... I also use the h4ns stereo mics for field recordings (environmental noise). It is possible to mount the h4n on the gh2 right?

I also plan on conducting interviews in peoples houses and other private areas- for this i will use the high end akg c414 going into the h4n, which also means i don't have to worry about providing phantom power.

And I don't need to purchase a separate shotgun or a stereo field recording mic.

Does anyone have any suggestions or comments on this route? Would the h4n work as a handheld?
 
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rschwartz33 said:
thanks for the responses everyone.... I'm pretty committed to the dslr at this point, but how about this:

For field interviews I give the subjects a handheld or clip on mic which i record into a zoom h4n... I also use the h4ns stereo mics for field recordings (environmental noise). It is possible to mount the h4n on the gh2 right?

I also plan on conducting interviews in peoples houses and other private areas- for this i will use the high end akg c414 going into the h4n, which also means i don't have to worry about providing phantom power.

And I don't need to purchase a separate shotgun or a stereo field recording mic.

Does anyone have any suggestions or comments on this route? Would the h4n work as a handheld?
Click to expand...

Sure it would, but it will be in frame in order for it to be close enough in a noisy environment. I would seriously look at the E/V's and Shure handhelds in the $100 range instead of handing my h4n with all my audio for the day on it to a complete stranger if I'm understanding you correctly.

The trick to getting good man on the street sound bites and meeting interesting people is talking to large amounts of people. You literally have to walk up rolling and get right to it. Ask for permission on camera and don't bother with paperwork, you're covered with a video contract. Ask them to spell their first and last names. This is for accuracy and gives you a mini sound check at the same time.

Good luck. ;) This won't be easy solo.
 
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Okay...

DSLRs have very substandard audio implementation. Although they may record at 16bit/48kHz most use AC-3 which is a "lossy" data compression format, so will not have the full resolution of a WAV, BWAV or AIF 16bit/48kHz or better format (up to 24bit and 96kHz or 192kHz). Being still cameras that also have video capabilities the manufacturers do not put a lot of effort/expense into the quality of the audio components, so they tend to have a lot of "self noise" which usually manifests itself as hiss. Many DSLRs also feature AGC (Automatic Gain Control) which, on many cameras, cannot be defeated; AGC will substantially increase the noise in between the dialog and in very loud situations - like a protest - may actually cause "pumping and breathing" to the audio. There is also the problem of not being able to monitor the audio while you are shooting.

Now, on to the mic problem...

Shotgun mics have - are at least are supposed to have - a very narrow pick-up (polar) pattern. Although they do not bring the audio "closer" you have to think in terms of a zoom lens. Unless a shotgun mic is aimed very deliberately at the sound source you may end recording more of the sound over the subjects shoulder than their voice.

A digital recorder like the Zoom H4n or the Tascam DR-100 has two built in mics that are aimed left and right to give a stereo image. If aimed at a subject their voice will be recorded on both tracks; each track only contains "half" of the information. However, summing the tracks - panning both to the center - can create combing, flanging, phasing or even outright cancellation of audio information that was recorded in the center and actually hype the audio that was originally on the "outside" of the stereo image. In noisy situations you want as much directionality as possible to isolate the voice from the surrounding environmental noise. That is why you want to use a mono mic aimed at the subject. However, as mentioned, a shotgun mic needs to be aimed very carefully, so is not a good choice for mounting on a camera rig as you will not always be able to get a 100% full-face shot. That is why I recommend a mic with a cardioid polar pattern; the hypercardioid polar pattern is usually preferred in live sound-for-picture situations because of its wider pick-up range. It is more forgiving than a shotgun mic with its lobar polar pattern, yet still has decent off axis rejection (sound to the left and right of the mic).

The reason I recommended the Audio-Technica AT4053b is that it has a hypercardioid polar pattern, is very sturdy, has good sound and can be used as a handheld mic in a pinch.

The situation into which you are placing yourself calls for a series of compromises. Since you are a one man crew you will need to monitor the audio while you shoot. A separate recorder will have a headphone output jack so you can do just that. When you are not interviewing it can be mounted on your rig to collect ambient sound. When you are interviewing a hypercardioid can also be mounted on the camera as well or used as a handheld. It is far from an optimum solution.

BTW, you will also need wind protection for both the audio recorder and the mic.
 
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wow alcove the at4053b is pretty expensive, any cheaper hypercardiod options? I'd like to spending less than 600 bucks total on sound stuff. the h4n is 300 bucks so I guess that leaves 300 for the hypercardiod + wind protection. Also with regards to windscreens is there anything I could use that would work both withthe h4n plus whatever I end up using? Or should windscreens be custom fitted?
 
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camvader, are you saying I'm basically gonna have crap sounding movie? I definitely don't need it to be pro, this is a guerilla style shoot all the way through and roughness is definitely ok. I just don't want it to be so bad people automatically discount the film, or it clashes with the visuals, which won'[t be too shabby.
 
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rschwartz33 said:
camvader, are you saying I'm basically gonna have crap sounding movie? I definitely don't need it to be pro, this is a guerilla style shoot all the way through and roughness is definitely ok. I just don't want it to be so bad people automatically discount the film, or it clashes with the visuals, which won'[t be too shabby.
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No, not at all. My concern is you're going guerrilla as a 90 year old with a bad hip with that set-up. Mind you, I'm more focused on getting good content and I know what that requires (talking to a lot of people and moving constantly). A DSLR is a two hand operation on the shoulder. You still have to get and monitor sound and, most importantly, ask intelligent questions and follow-ups. Most people can do one of these at a time reasonably well.

You're asking a lot from yourself and the margin for error is high.

Sorry if that seems negative, but I feel you should have a realistic expectation of what you may end up with, which is a project with nothing done particularly well done because your resources were stretched to the limit.
 
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assuming i want to be able to mount the h4n and the hypercardiod i get... i've decided that i want the rode nt3, am i gonna need to buy separate shock mounts so camera noise is isolated? I've tried looking for information about this online but its pretty scant.
 
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rschwartz33 said:
assuming i want to be able to mount the h4n and the hypercardiod i get... i've decided that i want the rode nt3, am i gonna need to buy separate shock mounts so camera noise is isolated? I've tried looking for information about this online but its pretty scant.
Click to expand...

I have no idea. You're pioneering a new method. A shock mount will isolate shock last I heard. ;)
 
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The NT3 is a passable mic, but just be aware that it's heavier than most mics (13 ounces, the AT4053b is 4.5 ounces) and has a larger diameter than most mics (the NT3 is 1.5", the AT4053b .83"), so serious wind protection will be more difficult to find and more expensive. The Rode NT55 may be a better choice, but doesn't run on batteries. Also, both mics are cardioids, not hypercardioids, which is the preferred polar pattern for what you want to do.

You are going to want to use shock mounts to resist handling noise.

I have seen some DSLR cages that can "hang" multiple devices, but they seem to be rather expensive.

http://store.zacuto.com/dslr-z-cage.html
 
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