I Fuc#$%& HATE Fluorescent Lights !!!

I hate fluorescent lights !!! I hate fluorescent lights !!! I hate fluorescent lights !!!I hate fluorescent lights !!!

I hate shooting in an area with them. Im a one man film crew and I was shooting a commercial today under them. The buzz from the lighting was distracting enough and the EMI wreaked havoc on my cheapo AUDIO TECHNICA PRO88W-R35 wireless lavs.. I did get good enough sound with my shotgun that was 4' away from the talent. I would have loved to have gotten better, but Im on my own. do not have a boom op.

OK, so whaddya do to keep the buzzzzzz or the screeeshh out of the sound mix every time the talent walks under the friggin fluorescent lights w/ a lav ? do I need a better Lav setup ? what ?? Please help, Im bald and cannot pull my hair out.









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You turn them off. Not always an option, I know, but you lobby very hard for that to happen before you shoot.

The ATPro88's are VHF and therefor very prone to interference; that's why you go with frequency agile UHF. They'll have problems as well, but substantially fewer of them.

If possible you hard-wire the lavs.

Wasn't anyone monitoring the audio during the shoot?

The Hum Remover tool in the Izotope RX noise reduction software (it's about $320) does a great job at removing hums. If you don't have any NR software a notch filter or parametric EQ at around 466Hz will reduce some of the hum.
 
I was a 1 man outfit all on my own... OK. I should have turned the lights OFF and used that nice Tungsten light setup I have... sheesh , so simple., problem solved. Dont know if that would have happened since they were opened at the time.. would have made it easier.

We were shooting during store hours.. you do not know how many times i wanted to scream SHUT UP ! Then people would walk into the scene where we were filming, the cash registers clanging, hard floor and fu#$%^ heels, plastic bags crinkling, people coughing, talking ...ARRRGH !

Lucky Im a frigging gun hating liberul.. If I would have taken advantage of my 2nd amendment rights !!







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CF

Damn... gotta check the footage..........................No.. no flickering.. yaa it's Ok.. FIRST time I shot w the T2i under fluorescent lights. looks good. I was mostly worried about the sound. Shot 1920x1080, 24fps, Shutter speed 50 800ISO no noticeable grain, Kit 18-55 IS lens . I wanted max DOF.... I will down-res to NTSC for broadcast TV Comcast


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4kehGbZtp4







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Well, I'm glad flicker wasn't a problem. For future reference, it's not nearly as noticeable on the T2i's viewscreen as it is on a computer monitor.

I don't see any grain. I think 800 ISO is just fine. Only on 1600 and above have I ever noticed any graininess.

On a sidenote, this is for a commercial? If so, why 24p? Wouldn't 30 be better?
 
yup for a commercial....24...30fps ??? heck they want NTSC...so yes I shoulda done 30. Did not think ... but heck screw them is anyone gonna notice ? he he he

I will convert after editing. Im sure it will look fine.

Although, I do see a little moire in the red sweater









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I'm using Senn G3s and haven't had a problem with flourescents causing interference. I did have a problem once with the big parking lot lights causing a buzz while booming a shot but I had about 50' of cable run to the camera and I also strongly suspect I had a bad cable shield.

If you can re-create the problem under controlled conditions it may help to isolate the problem. I'd start with the cables. Even a poorly terminated mic connector could make the system more prone to picking up EMI.

A bad ballast in one of the lights may have been compounding your problem.

Best to resolve it as I'm finding more and more studio sets are using Kino Flo or other forms of flourescents for set lighting.


I hate fluorescent lights !!! I hate fluorescent lights !!! I hate fluorescent lights !!!I hate fluorescent lights !!!

I hate shooting in an area with them. Im a one man film crew and I was shooting a commercial today under them. The buzz from the lighting was distracting enough and the EMI wreaked havoc on my cheapo AUDIO TECHNICA PRO88W-R35 wireless lavs.. I did get good enough sound with my shotgun that was 4' away from the talent. I would have loved to have gotten better, but Im on my own. do not have a boom op.

OK, so whaddya do to keep the buzzzzzz or the screeeshh out of the sound mix every time the talent walks under the friggin fluorescent lights w/ a lav ? do I need a better Lav setup ? what ?? Please help, Im bald and cannot pull my hair out.









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Maybe could cut the wire length from the mic to the transmitter. Perhaps make a necklace type attachment to hang the transmitter just behind the actors neck. The shorter cable MIGHT help (but a DIY wiring job could make the pickup of interference worse).

Another idea is to use Mu-Metal around the base of the flurolight. If 1 m long fluro, then cover the ends and along a bit perhaps 5cm along from the base of the light. Maybe could even wrap wire mesh around the light to stop the interference getting out (but still let light out :lol: ).

Another possible issue could be the wiring within the walls. Thin sheets of Mu-Metal specifically made for covering wiring in walls could be used.

An alternative may be to get fluros that use 5k hz or higher ballasts instead of 50/60hz.
 
Have the talent come into a controlled environment and ADR the dialog, don't use the audio you captured on set.

Next time, find someone to capture audio on a fully XLR rig (even wired lavs will pick up buzz under fluorescents as the wire acts like a giant antenna for RF interference)... the 3rd wire in XLR is there to remove the RF buzz introduced into the line. The cost of having someone slinging a boom for you is much less than the cost of losing jobs due to bad audio.

It's a bit of an investment, but if you're already getting paying commercial gigs, the investment is worthwhile.

Don't record into your camera as that connection is a point of failure for the sound... it needs to move from XLR to miniplug to get into the camera and that little point can allow RF into your audio... albeit, not as much as a long wire - if you're concerned with the quality of your audio, you may as well go all the way (within reason).
 
I did not mention in addition to the Wireless lavs, I used an Azden SGM-1X w/ a short XLR with both plugged into a Zoom H4n . Being 4 - 5' away, it was Ok sound. It will work but obviously not ideal. The place was wall to wall w/ old fluorescent lights, all humming away.





I guess worst case next time, I'll even rig up a stand w/ an arm and hang the boom pole off that. Turn off the lights in the area shooting, use my light kit etc. but a quick & dirty shoot was on the schedule that day. Alcove mentioned a different Lav setup too.. I'll look into that.



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The cheap Azden gear is notorious for insufficient shielding. You should also be using high quality XLR cables as they (should) have better shielding as well.

gpf - Well, that's the difference between a $150 VHF lav system and $600 UHF lav system - and the knowledge and experience to use it correctly.
 
The cheap Azden gear is notorious for insufficient shielding. You should also be using high quality XLR cables as they (should) have better shielding as well.

gpf - Well, that's the difference between a $150 VHF lav system and $600 UHF lav system - and the knowledge and experience to use it correctly.

Ok.. so need to upgrade to a Rode and get premium XLR cables, then go for UHF Lav.. any suggestions for a cheap but decent UHF setup ? I know that is at odds, but I dont currently have the $$ for super high end but do see the need to bump it up a notch










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"Cheap" and "Decent" are mutually exclusive.

The Sennheiser EM2000 and Lectrosonics 400 Series (without a mic or lav) run around $2,000 to $2,500 depending upon configuration.

The Lectrosonics 100 Series goes for about $1,000.

The Sennheiser G3 goes for about $600.

The Audio-Technica ATW series runs about $550.

So the G3s and the ATWs are about 1/4 of the top-of-the-line gear.


Decent lavs such as Tram and CountryMan, that have good sound quality, decent RF rejection, are moisture resistant, etc. are in the $275 to $400 range, a little less if you don't care about being able to hide it.


I wouldn't trust anything less when running a business and/or my reputation is riding on the outcome. I would also consider a cardioid condenser mic like the Audio Technica AT4053B for indoor usage - less of that "roomy" sound. And I would also consider the Audio Technica AT897 over the NTG-2.

My suggestion, as always, is to hire a qualified sound mixer/boom-op. If that is not feasible, rent what you need and add it into the bill. You can rent an Audio-Technica ATW series for about $40/day and a complete boom package - including the blimp and dead cat - for about $50/day. Trew Audio ships anywhere in the US.
 
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Speaking of fluorescents, are Kino-Flos designed so that they don't emit a hum?

The hum is usually from the ballast. With Kinos (at least the ones I've used) the ballast is separate from the fixture. The fixture is placed close to the talent and the ballast several feet away. It's also well-shielded, compared to the cheap ballasts you find in the fluorescent fixtures installed in most buildings.
 
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