Conflict within stories?

[CHamburger]

Hi Y'ALL, thinking about a few things over the boredom hours at work. Does there always need to be a conflict in every story? Can one conceivably write a story that focuses on characters with a weird set of conditions rather than a conflict a character has to overcome? I was thinking about a couple stories I read through out the years some of which didn't have overt conflicts if any at all. Are conflicts necessary if one has a compelling character. Ex. A Cancer patient's day at the circus, (could be a good story but there's no real conflict except that he's dying), Joyce's Portrait of the Artist(it had conflicts but not in the conventional-a-villian-throwing-hero's-reality-outta whack), A father and son on a road trip, hit by car, now father must break the news to mother of dead son?

Are these conflicts or just emotional scenario's? How big does a conflict need to be if its always necessary?

 

[TheArtist]

Reminds me of Crazy Heart. No real conflict there, just the journey of an old country singer.

 

[CHamburger]

I think they are but don't always need to be grand scale conflicts. In fact, I think subtle internal conflicts that spill to create external conflicts make the best stories.

 

[CHamburger]

Thats what I'm saying. Some of these story/movies are completely devoid of conflict. Into the Wild? Where's that conflict? How do these movies maintain audience attention without a serious conflict. Like battling a sickness, thwarting a villain, winning the girl over the jock etc..

 

[rayw]

Many narrative stories lack a classic antagonist as the source of conflict, which is what I'm thinking you're in search of clarification on.

See if there's anything here that'll work for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conflict_(narrative)


Could you cite a few more other films you have in mind with no overt conflict?
It's entirely possible you're overlooking or dismissing internal conflict and situational conflict.

Bob wants a cheeseburger, but...
... 10ft Wiener Monster is stopping him. Classic antagonist conflict.
... his agoraphobia is acting up. Internal conflict.
... he's in India where those are "rare". Society conflict.
... a flooding river prevents him from getting to BurgerHut. Natural conflict.
... there's a problematic city-wide alien ghost invasion occurring at the moment. Supernatural conflict.
... a series of comical events prevent him from getting to BurgerHut. Destiny conflict.

 

[TheArtist]

A story doesn't need a conflict when it has a strong theme, that has to be depicted which serious characters, excellent music and stunning visuals.

Requiem for a Dream which is a powerful movie doesn't have a real conflict with A versus B.

 

[arrodiii]

Into the Wild? Where's that conflict?

I always looked at Into the Wild as a societal conflict - he shuns pretty much everything about what one would consider as a normal, societal norm, hence why he tears up his I.D. and his paycheck stubs. Sure, it's a way for him to make it on his own, but in the same process he is still running away from a society that he knew and grew up around.

Requiem for a Dream which is a powerful movie doesn't have a real conflict with A versus B.

I look at Requiem as an internal conflict of a junkie - they have a dream set up and they are on their way though they also have an internal struggle with their drug usage and this also happens to prevent their dreams coming to fruition, and even leads to them making some decisions in which they are degraded.

 

[kinglis]

Hi Y'ALL, thinking about a few things over the boredom hours at work. Does there always need to be a conflict in every story? Can one conceivably write a story that focuses on characters with a weird set of conditions rather than a conflict a character has to overcome? I was thinking about a couple stories I read through out the years some of which didn't have overt conflicts if any at all. Are conflicts necessary if one has a compelling character. Ex. A Cancer patient's day at the circus, (could be a good story but there's no real conflict except that he's dying), Joyce's Portrait of the Artist(it had conflicts but not in the conventional-a-villian-throwing-hero's-reality-outta whack), A father and son on a road trip, hit by car, now father must break the news to mother of dead son?

Are these conflicts or just emotional scenario's? How big does a conflict need to be if its always necessary?

The examples you gave of no conflict: a dying man at the circus and the father, who has to break the news of his dead son to the loving mother/wife are some awesome examples of the greatest conflict.

 

[JoshL]

rayw, you need to make that movie, right now!

As for the original question I agree that all stories have conflict for certain definitions of conflict. Take "Cries and Whispers". One of my favorite movies in which nothing actually happens. Loads of character and situational development, internal conflicts and struggles, but nothing happens. And it is engrossing. But struggling to cope with a situation, debating the impact drugs are having on your life, facing your own fear of brown socks, these are all just as much conflict as the boss fight on top of the skyscraper with rocket launchers.

I don't know if you could write a story that actually has no conflict. If there is no conflict, there are no decisions. At some point you get rid of the core of what a story is, and you're watching someone sitting on the couch for 90 minutes. Or "Taylor Mead's Ass". And friends don't let friends emulate Warhol

 

[rayw]

Requiem for a Dream which is a powerful movie doesn't have a real conflict with A versus B.

Umm... Mom wants to look her best for the gameshow, so she decides to fix her hair and loose a little weight (social conflict).
She goes apesh!t looney over the pills (self conflict).

Son and friend think they can make a buck from trafficking the H (destiny conflict), friend's arrest bail consumes their stash as does the son's usage (social and self/substance conflict).

Girlfriend's addiction (self/substance conflict) finds her in a morally compromised, first of soon to be many, late-night, double-dildo, G-O-G action (social conflict).

No.
There is no Hannibal Lecter/Predator/Freddy Kruger nemesis in RFOD.
However, there is conflict.
Didn't you see they lubed up the double-dildo?
That right there is acknowledgement of conflict! Duh!

rayw, you need to make that movie, right now!

Working on the final touches as we speak...

 

[CHamburger]

I dk if I'd really see Into the Wild as any conflict at all. I mean if you acknowledge the going against society's grain, that's only the setup for the whole movie(a kid who goes....into the wild...). He doesn't deal with the conflict in terms of a resolution, he's decided his response to this social conflict before the movie/story even began.

Its not that I'm overlooking the internal situational. An ex is a short story from Rhoad Dahl in which a man plays judge to a bet a older man has with a young guy with his girl watching. The guy decide to take teh bet(that he can't light a lighter 10x in a row) and original guy(narrator) judges. If he wins he gets a Cadalac, if he loses he gives up a finger.

I know that without a conflict a story no matter how basic cannot be told. How do you know how much conflict to put i if its an internal, societal, situation conflict. I remember giving a story idea to someone and, now granted, I didn't go too far into teh detail, but teh reponse was I need more conflict. This is in direct dispute with my own feelings as I think there is enough conflict.

 

[CHamburger]

The examples you gave of no conflict: a dying man at the circus and the father, who has to break the news of his dead son to the loving mother/wife are some awesome examples of the greatest conflict.

If I wrote a story about a dying man enjoying his last moments at the circus(which sounds like a pretty cool idea) where would the conflict be? It would just be him enjoying life while he still has it.

Also, the dead son and father breaking the news to the mom, breaking the news to his wife is something he has to do, its implied that that's what he's going to do. Is there a conflict if the resolution to such a conflict is implied?

 

[rayw]

I remember giving a story idea to someone and, now granted, I didn't go too far into teh detail, but teh reponse was I need more conflict. This is in direct dispute with my own feelings as I think there is enough conflict.

With all due laughing respect: P!ss on him.
Plenty of movies are hated by critics as the producers go chuckling all the way to the bank.

Screw one person's lofty opine.
If they're bankrolling it then that's another thing.
Otherwise...

Seriously though, if your story needs more juice then... do it. Juice that fat bastard up. If it's tickling your shorties then screwwit. Pimp that page-flesh on the street, see if you can scare up some biz.
If no cars stop then you know you got an ugly script.

What IS the conflict in your story?
And what is the market demographic that SHOULD find the story appealing?

 

[CHamburger]

It was a story about the first human team to accompany aliens to an intergalactic counsel that has been around for eons but the humans never knew about it until aliens landed on earth looking for resources.

There was also another one where two guys are kidnapped and left on an island where super elites take part in a long party that focuses around betting and watching the two guys.

Both ideas, especially the space idea, already had enough conflict. But I was told I need more, I feel like sometimes adding too much conflict kills the story. Like guy loses wife to cancer has to go fight to save his son who was kidnapped by a mafia boss who helped pay medical bills and now the guy has just been diagnosed with Lupus. I mean how much conflict is enough conflict? Or how much "juice" is enough juice?

 

[rayw]

I mean how much conflict is enough conflict? Or how much "juice" is enough juice?

Too much is when the average viewer isn't smart enough to keep up with all the tangents.
Enough is when the core story is sensible and enjoyable.

Frankly, that space story sounds expensive as sh!t to produce.
I'd push that one back on top of the "When I'm Famous" pile.

The kidnapped-for-the-entertainment-of-rich-dudes premise sounds doable on an indie budget.
Very SURVIVING THE GAME-ish.
Not a prob.


I've got about fifty spec script feature ideas in the hopper.
Haven't put a single one to paper/PDF because I know they'll easily consume over 200 hours of time getting them "spec-ready", so I don't wanna waste my time.
200+hrs x 50 stories = a sh!tload of my time.
Of the "beyond reasonable" amount of homework I've done on story construct, I believe the Three Act Structure/Syd Field Paradigm are the most common and easy to understand.

They begin like this:

I've fabricated my own simple template to follow which goes like this:

Currently, I'm working on a spreadsheet that demonstrates what and when these steps are achieved across a few "easy" films like ZACH AND MIRI MAKE A PORNO and A KNIGHT'S TALE.

Five bucks says, if your story already closely enough follows these constructs then what you've got is conflicted up enough.

If your story meanders all over the place in esoteric metaphysical arguments among a cadre of Wall Street hedge fund managers / weekend cannibals about the benefits of effects of modern immunizations on their supper, then... you might have lost a few of the audience members to transient narcolepsy.
"Whut? Huh?"

How'd we get here?
Who the eff are you guys?
Who do I gotta kill to get outta here?

Looks like conflict enough for me.

 

[Modern Day Myth Prod. LLC]

Interesting reading:

http://ezinearticles.com/?Conflict-in-Fiction-Writing&id=1080850

 

[Jack Lynt]

That's an interesting question. It reminds me a lot of Adaptation, wherein Charlie Kaufman thinks that he wants to write a script in which nothing really happens...you know, like how it sometimes is in real life. But when Charlie attends a Robert Mckee seminar and suggests the possibility to Mckee, Mckee is incredulous and proceeds to give Charlie an indelicate bonking (verbal, of course) over the head for it. I think Mckee's right.

 

[arrodiii]

I dk if I'd really see Into the Wild as any conflict at all. I mean if you acknowledge the going against society's grain, that's only the setup for the whole movie(a kid who goes....into the wild...). He doesn't deal with the conflict in terms of a resolution, he's decided his response to this social conflict before the movie/story even began.

No, I totally understand what you're going after but at the same time the final conflict is man vs nature.

I maybe looking at things wrong, but sometimes I don't feel there needs to be a resolution to a. Certain conflict. There's a movie in my netflix queue that I need to see. Its an Italian (?) Film about a couple who go for a drive and the female ends up getting killed. The boyfriend though doesn't try and resolve to find the killer and the film just ends with this whole unresolved premise. I forget the name, and may have even butchered the details, but its something very similar. And for some reason I want to say Jack Nicholson is in it.

Though thinking about your question, I'm trying to find what the main conflict of Swingers is, besides getting back into the dating scene (internal). Am I missing something with it, I mean besides the multiple failures of attempting to get women, the fight with House of Pain, then with Sue.


***EDIT***
The film I am thinking is L'Avventura by Michaelangelo Antonioni. The girl doens't die, she just goes missing and her lover ends up starting a relationship with her friend. Though her disappearance is never resolved. Oh, and Jack Nicholson isn't in the film, he was in another of Antonioni's films, The Passenger.

 

[CHamburger]

Modern nice article.

I think a lot of times the idiom of conflict resolution is so ingrained in our society that when watching a movie or reading a story we can almost instinctively identify the conflict and when thinking back we overlook it.

I think that there is conflict in every story but its sometimes so innate in the story, especially dramas and serious movies, that its not too overt. Into the Wild is definitely the conflict arising from straying away from societal norms. Be an individual in nature or conform to society that tells you to go to law school?

Swingers seems to be an internal conflict. Does Favreau need to get back out there and date? How's he gonna do it when he's been in a relationship for so long? etc.

Same thing with Easy Rider or Fear and Loathing...conflicts from going against the grain of society. Those conflicts when done right are always more meditative and take a minute to really hit you. I think its because the conflict is so closely related to the theme. Maybe thats it; the closer your conflict is related to your theme the more natural and less obvious it seems, and the it becomes to identify the conflict.

Think about into the wild for example or any story that deals with standing up for what you believe in. I think the exception is Rebel without a Cause, although it wasn't obvious at first, it became obvious when the action started to pick up. The theme and conflict here were closely related but the conflict became obvious because Dean's character became more agitated with his surroundings.

 

[brianluce]

If I wrote a story about a dying man enjoying his last moments at the circus(which sounds like a pretty cool idea) where would the conflict be? It would just be him enjoying life while he still has it.

Also, the dead son and father breaking the news to the mom, breaking the news to his wife is something he has to do, its implied that that's what he's going to do. Is there a conflict if the resolution to such a conflict is implied?

Man dying from cancer? It's man versus mortality.

Into the Wild? I didn't see it -- but know the premise, sounds like man v. nature.

I don't know if it's possible to make a conflict free story for film. I'm wondering why you'd want to, hard enough as it is to make something engaging. why hamstring yourself?