Am i ready for full length feature?

dlevanchuk

dlevanchuk

How did you know you were move from short films to full length feature?

Was it when it felt like shorts were to easy, and you had an urge to tell a longer story?

Or you just said "screw this short crap, let me try out"?
 
Still not there, for one reason, money.

As a writer and director i think I'm ready for it. Not that it will be great, but that it has a chance to be pretty good. I generally don't make the same mistakes twice and have made most of the big ones by this point. I could certainly learn more from doing more shorts, but I am ready for at least the possibility (no matter how slim) of actually making money on a film.

I just won't even attempt it for less than 50K. That's why I've moved into doing crap I have ZERO desire to do (commercials, music videos, etc...) to raise some seed money (say 15K to 20K) to prime the pump for raising the rest of that budget.
 
It's opposite for me. I've only done one short and I never finished it. Will be on a second feature in the next two months.

I wish I could shoot a short, but these days I can't justify it for the most part.

You'll know you're ready when you've felt you've learned enough, not just by doing your own shorts but by working on other peoples. I may not have done my own work, but I sat in the front passenger seat on several productions (large and small) over the years. That's how I learned.

If you feel like you need to do a feature then do one, just don't spend much money on it.
 
If you have the script preproduce the hell out of it. Figure out what your needs will be. It's the financial end that kills no/low/micro budget feature projects most of the time. See if it's possible to rewrite to fit your budgetary concerns.

The biggest thing to keep in mind is that it's easy to get commitments for a couple of weekends, but you're going to have to pay crew and post people to commit a month or more of their life to a project.
 
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Great question, and of course there is only one person who can answer it --

Darth Vader.

Seriously, though, I think Gonzo, Kholi and Alcove offer some good words of wisdom. The answer is truly going to be personal for everyone.

Me? I just had to make one. I didn't give a damn if I was ready, I needed to do it. My case was kind of a weird one, though, in that I didn't make my movie with any intent of turning a profit. For a feature film, that's weird.

My next feature is definitely going to be a for-profit venture, and I agree with both Kholi and Gonzo -- there's gotta be some money there. I don't know if it's coincidence, or if there's something to the number, but like Gonzo, I've also set $50K as my absolute bare-minimum for the next feature production. Needless to say, that's a miniscule number, when compared to most feature productions, but I think I can make a quality product, and turn a profit on it.

Should you continue making shorts? I am. Not all the damn time, but I kind of just have an itch to do it, and I gotta scratch that itch every now and then. Plus, there's no question that there is something to be learned with every new production.

I do have one opinion on your situation, for what it's worth. I think you'd benefit by doing a couple more shorts, not so much because you need to learn more, but because you'll be able to network with more people, and perhaps get some more quality talent. Though I didn't comment in the thread, I did watch the behind-the-scenes footage of you doing the walk-through, and it seemed clear to me that you're working with untrained actors. I think most professionally-trained actors would be mildly offended by the way you sort-of force-fed their performance in that clip.

I don't say that as an insult, because I am in fact one of your biggest fans, and I also have been in the same place. I'm just saying that I think you'll find it truly liberating when you're able to cast some more professional-quality actors who will be showing you how it's done, and all you have to is subtly mold and contour their performances.

So, I'd say maybe just a couple more shorts, keep networking, especially with actors, raise that all-important dough, and you'll know when you're ready. But don't forget to consult Vader.
 
Cracker Funk said:
My next feature is definitely going to be a for-profit venture, and I agree with both Kholi and Gonzo -- there's gotta be some money there. I don't know if it's coincidence, or if there's something to the number, but like Gonzo, I've also set $50K as my absolute bare-minimum for the next feature production. Needless to say, that's a miniscule number, when compared to most feature productions, but I think I can make a quality product, and turn a profit on it
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50K and below's a good number to start with. I'd say even less but I'm beginning to factor in the region in which a person may be doing a feature, now. Without a ton of vfx or a name, it would be hard to recover more than that.

After hearing some AFM breakdowns, I'd say it's even hard to recover that without the 50K looking, sounding, feeling like 500K.

Good thing is that it's totally possible to get a face in your feature for a budget of 50K.



I do have one opinion on your situation, for what it's worth. I think you'd benefit by doing a couple more shorts, not so much because you need to learn more, but because you'll be able to network with more people, and perhaps get some more quality talent. Though I didn't comment in the thread, I did watch the behind-the-scenes footage of you doing the walk-through, and it seemed clear to me that you're working with untrained actors. I think most professionally-trained actors would be mildly offended by the way you sort-of force-fed their performance in that clip.
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Yes. You cannot undervalue the importance of crew and talent. Doing shorts and working more is a way to begin forming a team of people who want to rise with the tide, and as a producer/director (which we all are kind of becoming this day and age) you'll have a harder time trying to get anyone behind you by just spiringing into a feature without any good shorts or material behind you.

I had that, just from a different path.

When you have this, the initial cash-spent budget lowers, and your commitments for straight working days doesn't seem ridiculous.

IT doesn't hurt to have a pretty ambitious project, either.

SOmeone convince CF to spill the beans on his next one. xD
 
I think for me that would be the goal, to make a 50K feature that looked like a 500K feature. That's the formula to making money at that budget level.

A chunk of that 50K as noted above is to pay crew. As was said, on a short, you can convince people to work for a weekend for free. Trying to convince them to work 14 or more days on a feature shoot for free, that's a bit more problematic. You might get some PAs for free, but pretty much everybody else is going to have to be paid even if it's only $300 or $400 a week slave wages.
 
thank you for your replies everyone. Yes, money definitely is a HUGE stop signal.
CFunk- thank you for kind words :) yes, unfortuately im dealing usually with, untrained actors. Guy in the suit (raw videos from Quickie) is actually my main sound man with no acting experience (except for a quick scene inHumpty, for 48hfp)


really liked the advice on doing couple of more shorts. I have two more cooking up, and will focus on expanding my networking horizon, which is extremely limited, as of right now..


so, to underline, the Passage into feature highly prefers two elemets:
1. Money
2. Networking

Find money, and keep doing shorts to expand the networking. got it!
thank you everyone for your input!
 
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The best way to answer the title question is to first know the market for your film before you write your script. A feature film should go somewhere. Do you know where?

How will it be distributed and market?

Self-distribution is an option. But, success has odds of next to none.

Who is going to see your production that can be an important contact now or in the future?
 
Modern Day Myth Prod. LLC said:
The best way to answer the title question is to first know the market for your film before you write your script. A feature film should go somewhere. Do you know where?

How will it be distributed and market?

Self-distribution is an option. But, success has odds of next to none.

Who is going to see your production that can be an important contact now or in the future?
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Agree.
I think films at this level have to be aimed at a niche market. Sci fi, Lovecraft, steam punk, torture porn, something, some specific audience who is hungry for content.
 
oh thats a good one as well.

not torture porn, but market advice in general ;)

frankly, i dont even have a slight idea about the script, or what the feature even will be about, but was slowly getting "The Bug", especially after watching director commentary on Swingers.
 
Like others in this thread, I decided to dive into a feature because that's what I've always wanted to do. Now that I have some short projects completed I know the monumental task I face, so I'm writing the script around all of the logistic limitations I'm facing: most of the shoot will be a 2-man crew (me and my actor). I have a single character (and one scene in the beginning with just a single other character). I have a single location (the ground floor of a house that is my apartment). The story I'm writing adheres to these limitations w/out getting boring or claustrophobic.

Tons of planning are involved. I have all sorts of maps and notes on index cards so that I can organize my shoot to be out-of-order while maintaining continuity. It's still going to be a nightmare, but it will be a fun nightmare.
 
escher said:
Like others in this thread, I decided to dive into a feature because that's what I've always wanted to do. Now that I have some short projects completed I know the monumental task I face, so I'm writing the script around all of the logistic limitations I'm facing: most of the shoot will be a 2-man crew (me and my actor). I have a single character (and one scene in the beginning with just a single other character). I have a single location (the ground floor of a house that is my apartment). The story I'm writing adheres to these limitations w/out getting boring or claustrophobic.

Tons of planning are involved. I have all sorts of maps and notes on index cards so that I can organize my shoot to be out-of-order while maintaining continuity. It's still going to be a nightmare, but it will be a fun nightmare.
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quick off topic: i see that u live in seattle. Let me know if you will need any help with production! email me dl@smokingbarrelfilms.com
 
I started with a feature after making a 3 little shorts... it was my first real project I did. The other 3 were lists of gags and improv on the day. We ended up using every single shooting day as a learning day as if we were shooting another short. You can watch through that 47 hours of footage and see us learning. After it all, we learned not to shoot so much ;)
 
knighly thats awesome! to see your skill evolve in 47 hours lol I'm sure that could become some weird art project, equivalent to time lapses :)

h44: all of my stuff are on youtube.com/dlevanchuk .
But I wasn't really concerned if I am ready but I wanted to know what was other's experience when they decided to go from shorts to a feature.
 
just my 2 cents . . . .

How did you know you were move from short films to full length feature?
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Never made a short -- there's no money in it. ("Moved up" from "educational and promotional" type film projects.)

just won't even attempt it for less than 50K.
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Ok. But for the record, my feature was about 1/3rd of that $50K. Got into festivals, good reviews and won a few awards. One ought not box themselves in with an arbitrary $$$ figure.

I'm writing the script around all of the logistic limitations I'm facing: most of the shoot will be a 2-man crew (me and my actor). I have a single character (and one scene in the beginning with just a single other character). I have a single location (the ground floor of a house that is my apartment). . . . Tons of planning are involved. I have all sorts of maps and notes on index cards so that I can organize my shoot to be out-of-order while maintaining continuity. It's still going to be a nightmare, but it will be a fun nightmare.
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There you go! That's what you have to do -- break the damn mold!

Good luck!
 
GuerrillaAngel said:
just my 2 cents . . . .

Ok. But for the record, my feature was about 1/3rd of that $50K. Got into festivals, good reviews and won a few awards. One ought not box themselves in with an arbitrary $$$ figure.
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I see your point about boxing yourself in, I wouldn't say that the number's arbitrary: if you want a certain amount of quality to the content (by that I mean an image that reaches a certain bar, actors that can deliver without sounding like robots, locations that actually look decent, and post polishing) the 50K number is pretty fair for a first feature.

It's also fair to say that some people may not care about all of those things, so the money won't be as important as just doing it on whatever you have.

I'm sure there are a number of people that can make 15K look like 150K or more, but the vast majority cannot.
 
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